Rush MTT Theory

I've been playing some of the rush MTTs and attempting to develop a winning approach to them, if there is indeed a methodology to better our probability of winning, in these.

Of the 9 games I've played thus far I've only cashed in 3 but that is by far better than I normally do in MTTs, percentage wise.

I do think Im onto a pretty solid methodology that, all things being even, should better ones winning probabilities.

Please post any theories or approaches you feel may work in this new and very different game.

I attached a couple of ss below for no other reason than we all enjoy seeing a nice hand when they come along and its not often enough.

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You need a much large sample then 9 mtt. By the looks off it you were running hot and got a few good results. If you have a decent roi after 250 games then you might have something to brag about but for now i don't think that you can comment on stragety for rush mtt. No offience. anyone can cash in 3 out off 9 tourneys.

What strategy are you using that you feel is different?

Played 2 so far, these are awesome. Bubble bursts in less than an hour. Tried to play LAG in the very first one and that worked out horribly, I busted so fast. Second one I tried to play tighter in the early going and then open it up later. Got top 25. I did suckout tho, 10's hit a set when I shoved into KK's who reraised me. I spend most of the tourney going "PLEASE FOLD"... Serious stress headache. Gonna try to play one of these everyday. It's so much better than regular tourney poker, and spending 3-4 hours just to get ITM sometimes. RUSH MTT = Great idea. Are HUDs working in them yet?

Im attempting to gather input with a Rush MTT strategy as the goal.

Not professing have achieved it.

Never said I've achieved an impressive ROI in these or at all for that matter, though Im pretty sure I enjoy myself more than most.

Upon rereading my post, I fail to see my "Brag". Still just having fun gathering input.

So if you've played these games and have some input, I welcome your opinions regarding your approach and how you feel it worked for or against you. Or maybe how you feel extreme speed vs a delayed approach can give a player an ad/dis-advantage in the ladder stages, then please join the fray.

But if not, and your just looking to post a bit of negativity; well, actually, go for it. Im easily entertained & will most likely have just as much fun pushing your buttons.

:boxing:

tomh7795 said:

You need a much large sample then 9 mtt. By the looks off it you were running hot and got a few good results. If you have a decent roi after 250 games then you might have something to brag about but for now i don't think that you can comment on stragety for rush mtt. No offience. anyone can cash in 3 out off 9 tourneys.

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I totally agree these games rock. I also think they will become huge due to the "rushed "nature of society in general and everybody's lack of overall time to sit and enjoy a nice tournament.

I also LAGed the first few games and had similar results. I find in up to the $10 games you get the same types of players found in .10/.25 Rush ring games, anywhere from ATC to Uber Tight. Uber TAG and Lightening fast in the early stages seems to prove productive. When you score not just hand but a "situation". like the boat I posted above, I've had the best results taking it slow and not being greedy. There is no shortage of aggression when you show a tad bit of weakness.

I've also seen that there are a much larger instance of major hands in these. Im not the man to pin an algorithm as to statistically why but I know that by not being too greedy with my pocket aces, and basically valuing hands more along the lines as one would in an Omaha game, I don't get sucked out on quite as often.

Ok its Wednesday, mid day and Im off to play a few. Ill let you know how it goes.

Enjoy guys.

coolnout said:

Played 2 so far, these are awesome. Bubble bursts in less than an hour. Tried to play LAG in the very first one and that worked out horribly, I busted so fast. Second one I tried to play tighter in the early going and then open it up later. Got top 25. I did suckout tho, 10's hit a set when I shoved into KK's who reraised me. I spend most of the tourney going "PLEASE FOLD"... Serious stress headache. Gonna try to play one of these everyday. It's so much better than regular tourney poker, and spending 3-4 hours just to get ITM sometimes. RUSH MTT = Great idea. Are HUDs working in them yet?

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Rather than LAG, I play fast. I want to see as many hands as I can, as fast as I can. I toss junk fast, and am very cautious even with big hands oop.

The Quick Fold button is my friend...

coolnout said:

It's so much better than regular tourney poker, and spending 3-4 hours just to get ITM sometimes. RUSH MTT = Great idea. Are HUDs working in them yet?

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I can't understand how this could be 'better' than regular tourney poker?? (aside from it being overwith quickly). For the most part you're playing readless poker so how do we exploit our oppenent's tendanices/weaknesses? (or do we just attempt to generalize how they play.. ie. passive (cuz I saw him play one hand in early levels yesterday).. overaggor-spewtard (cuz 5mins. ago I saw him potbet each street with a weak Ace). This crap takes most of the actual 'play' out of tournaments in my opinion. Maybe rename them.... Rush-Level1 Thinking MTTs

I'm right there with you dj, I'm a folding machine looking for Premium starting hands as fast as I can make them come. I've even discovered the fade as opposed to the slide is much faster. I also value hands much weaker due to the others "Hand Mining" like myself and the increased frequency at which they pop, more along the lines one would playing PLO as opposed to hold-em. Top 2 anit shit in a Rush MTT.

I totally understand Poker Orifice's objections to the comparisons as well. The classic Hold-em MTT and the Rush MTT bear little in common. They require a different approach and methodology. Im happy they have come about though. On the weekends if I have some peaceful time, I prefer the classic format and a beer. but for a regular game that I can finish and hit a final table in 2 hours, this new format, fits the bill.

:vroam:

dj11 said:

Rather than LAG, I play fast. I want to see as many hands as I can, as fast as I can. I toss junk fast, and am very cautious even with big hands oop.

The Quick Fold button is my friend...

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Poker Orifice said:

I can't understand how this could be 'better' than regular tourney poker?? (aside from it being overwith quickly). For the most part you're playing readless poker so how do we exploit our oppenent's tendanices/weaknesses? (or do we just attempt to generalize how they play.. ie. passive (cuz I saw him play one hand in early levels yesterday).. overaggor-spewtard (cuz 5mins. ago I saw him potbet each street with a weak Ace). This crap takes most of the actual 'play' out of tournaments in my opinion. Maybe rename them.... Rush-Level1 Thinking MTTs

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Poker Orifice said:

I can't understand how this could be 'better' than regular tourney poker?? (aside from it being overwith quickly). For the most part you're playing readless poker so how do we exploit our oppenent's tendanices/weaknesses? (or do we just attempt to generalize how they play.. ie. passive (cuz I saw him play one hand in early levels yesterday).. overaggor-spewtard (cuz 5mins. ago I saw him potbet each street with a weak Ace). This crap takes most of the actual 'play' out of tournaments in my opinion. Maybe rename them.... A.D.D. Heaven MTTs

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FYP ...

Seriously wouldn't say they are 'better' ... just 'different' ... for those who don't have the patience to play standard, traditional MTT's. Not unlike making choices to play or not to play turbo, or hyper-turbo type games.

nevadanick said:

FYP ...

Seriously wouldn't say they are 'better' ... just 'different' ... for those who don't have the patience to play standard, traditional MTT's. Not unlike making choices to play or not to play turbo, or hyper-turbo type games.

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This. Was just hyped on them since they're new.

I think Cam and I play these similarly. Fast and Tag. Fast being the more important. Agro bumped up a few notches and NO FANCY Preflop PLAY !!!!!! Early you are just as likely to get a caller if you shove AA, or limp or raise any amount. A bit later I still play AA strong, but maybe not so strong.

I have yet to play one of these where I didn't see big pairs at least once. U can run thru so many hands that it becomes statistically odd to NOT see big pair. Wait for them.

I'm of the opinion that if at some point you don't gaq the game because you are folding too fast, you are doing it wrong.

Standard play will occur at the final table. Even the last 3 tables are fairly standard, but the game still is played best seeing the max number of hands.

Small pairs go bye bye, Raggy aces in the small blind often go bye bye even when the pot is unopened. There is seldom a reason to get into a confrontation when you can see the next hand instantly. This doesn't mean u never limp in but only if the situation is correct, mainly I've got a huge stack and playable cards and don't expect a raise behind me.



That said, I like the method and it has taken severe suckouts or bad beats to cool me off.

Latest example 1st chip leader versus me, 2nd stack, me aa, him 10-10 3 flush to the board and I've got the suit ace on the turn. I shove, he calls, and spikes a river 10. Hurts sure, but I had played it correctly, and don't feel bad about it.

dj11 said:

I think Cam and I play these similarly. Fast and Tag. Fast being the more important. Agro bumped up a few notches and NO FANCY Preflop PLAY !!!!!! Early you are just as likely to get a caller if you shove AA, or limp or raise any amount. A bit later I still play AA strong, but maybe not so strong.

I have yet to play one of these where I didn't see big pairs at least once. U can run thru so many hands that it becomes statistically odd to NOT see big pair. Wait for them.

I'm of the opinion that if at some point you don't gaq the game because you are folding too fast, you are doing it wrong.

Standard play will occur at the final table. Even the last 3 tables are fairly standard, but the game still is played best seeing the max number of hands.

Small pairs go bye bye, Raggy aces in the small blind often go bye bye even when the pot is unopened. There is seldom a reason to get into a confrontation when you can see the next hand instantly. This doesn't mean u never limp in but only if the situation is correct, mainly I've got a huge stack and playable cards and don't expect a raise behind me.



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Question.. small pairs go 'bye-bye'?? On tables where villain is raising (am guessing RUSH is like this) with only big prs. &/or your AK/AQ hands, wouldn't we want to always be calling w pp in LP if stacks are deep enough... like all the time??? I would think these would be hands with huge implied odds in these scenarios...>>> villain being unable to let go of overprs. post flop &/or TPTK hands.

The first Rush tourney I played was the $4 turbo rush with 135 players in. very cool.
Its a very different skill indeed. Seems more like gambling-lots of flipping lots of sucking out-with the blinds raising every 3 mins youre three bet shoving to defend your blind against any late positipon raiser when the antes kick in.

Dont think I will play it again though. Even though I won it ($150) it didnt feel like I had an edge with hand reading skillz.... just pure gambling fun. But Im not init for fun Im init for da moneeeeezz.

I prefer real tourneys though-there it feels like skill actually comes into play.

haven't tried them yet. but they do look tempting. the little i've played in the rush ring games opponents seem pretty loose and bet position a lot or any playable hand.
good luck to all that try them. :dancing: :bom:

No doubt these are significantly easier to get paid in than the standard S&Gs. The main key is definitely to burn through hands looking for strength, play it weak, and hope the Suck Out Genie is napping. There is never a lack of aggression attempting to capitalize on your perceived weakness.

:star:

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Nice win bud... Well played on the final Table

Thanks Tim, as you saw, the final table requires standard final table play, 80/20, skill/luck. Thanks for the rail.

sharkyo01 said:

Nice win bud... Well played on the final Table

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I play rush very tight. I do set minning with pocket pairs and play position as well. I think it is effective.

Congrats on the win dude. But not tooo sure its 80/20 skill luck. picking up AA when people shove into you with worse is luck. not skill. You do howver need to know when your weak aces are good so there is a little skill involved but not 80. id say about 10%. And you obviously know when your hands are good so you do have more skill than most that play this game. Congrats.

This is starting to look like a brag thread.

Poker Orifice said:

Question.. small pairs go 'bye-bye'?? On tables where villain is raising (am guessing RUSH is like this) with only big prs. &/or your AK/AQ hands, wouldn't we want to always be calling w pp in LP if stacks are deep enough... like all the time??? I would think these would be hands with huge implied odds in these scenarios...>>> villain being unable to let go of overprs. post flop &/or TPTK hands.

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Bump

slycbnew said:

Bump

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I sacrifice these iffy trouble hands in favor of seeing more hands. Like Cam, I'm burning through deals as fast as I can looking for strength. Thru the middle stages I can see 10-15 hands a minute. The only thing that keeps that number that low is that occasionally I am the bb, and can't quick fold.It is not odd to fold the first 50 hands before something right appears. I haven't worked it out yet but it appears that when I play super fast I end up in the blinds less often than expected. At this point it is just a feeling, but seldom do the blinds play into things until they get large.

While you might set mine, and don't get me wrong, I occasionally do, but 2's 3's, 4's 5's are auto muck, 6's thru 9's are limp calls.

I can only back these up with my winnings at these games. And those winnings are making me happy. Latest triumph was todays 10K guarenteed RUSH. $24 bu-in, finished 15th for $194 and pennies. Took less than 2 hours, and approximately 400 hands. Things got slower after the bubble, when folks start in with the delay thing. Conterproductive strategy in these.

They play fast, the name is 'RUSH', not 'mosey along little dogie' poker.

Poker Orifice said:

Question.. small pairs go 'bye-bye'?? On tables where villain is raising (am guessing RUSH is like this) with only big prs. &/or your AK/AQ hands, wouldn't we want to always be calling w pp in LP if stacks are deep enough... like all the time??? I would think these would be hands with huge implied odds in these scenarios...>>> villain being unable to let go of overprs. post flop &/or TPTK hands.

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More direct answer in addition to the one below (above). We don't know our villains till the late stages, my PT3 hud can not keep up with my fast style here, so I'm playing power hands, aggressively or not playing the hand at all. In position I play a decent percent of my pp's but don't like to until I've built my stack some. It works so much better if all villains can see they are in real jepardy if they defend, so getting that big stack is more important than trying to get that big stack (hope you understand this).

Again, speed is more important to me. I'll burn thru 100 hands while you see 50.