deeznutzz
Rock Star
Silver Level
Depends on the size of your stack. If my stack is less than 15BB I would shove with the jacks.if it's over 15BB I would just call the opponents bet and see what happens on the flop. Any time I have more than 15-20BB I very rarely will go in with any hand other than AA or KK.
Jon Poker
Legend
Silver Level
18bb in the blinds facing a raise from ANY position at the table this is a super standard get in with JJs. You just ran into a cooler. Had it been the other way around and you had QQ and the other guy had JJ you wouldn't even be posting this.
Dont be results oriented. Its just a bad situation and unfortunately you ran into the top of his range. The same thing could happen with KK running into AA but that doesnt make it a bad play, just a cooler.
If we were 1 or 2 places away from the $$ we can be nitty here and fold the JJs since we are almost guaranteed to make the $$ with 18bb - but 30 people away is going to be tough to fold our way to cashing.
Anyhow - You made the correct move at the correct time - it just didnt work out. That's ok, pick up the pieces and move on.
Edit:: The problem when we call so short here is we are going to be check-folding alot of flops our opponent will be cbetting with 1 or 2 overcards on board and so even when they miss we are going to be folding the best hand a ton. Another reason we dont want to flat is when the board comes out relatively safe for us (all undercards) we are still stacking off vs overpairs and so that plays out no differently.
Basically when we shove here we get value from underpairs and we also get value from two overcards as well because we have the best hand and they will be the ones who need to improve to beat us. The same way we are going to check-fold alot of flops OOP - AK is going to fold alot of flops that come down like 9-3-6 and we check-raise all in. By doing so we lost value from a hand that would have called our shove preflop.
In conclusion like I already noted - this is a super standard shove here preflop and not doing so is leaving tons of $$ on the table. When we call we are burning 3bb and getting dropped down on the leaderboards when we had a premium holding and could have possibly doubled up rather than fold.
Dont be results oriented. Its just a bad situation and unfortunately you ran into the top of his range. The same thing could happen with KK running into AA but that doesnt make it a bad play, just a cooler.
If we were 1 or 2 places away from the $$ we can be nitty here and fold the JJs since we are almost guaranteed to make the $$ with 18bb - but 30 people away is going to be tough to fold our way to cashing.
Anyhow - You made the correct move at the correct time - it just didnt work out. That's ok, pick up the pieces and move on.
Edit:: The problem when we call so short here is we are going to be check-folding alot of flops our opponent will be cbetting with 1 or 2 overcards on board and so even when they miss we are going to be folding the best hand a ton. Another reason we dont want to flat is when the board comes out relatively safe for us (all undercards) we are still stacking off vs overpairs and so that plays out no differently.
Basically when we shove here we get value from underpairs and we also get value from two overcards as well because we have the best hand and they will be the ones who need to improve to beat us. The same way we are going to check-fold alot of flops OOP - AK is going to fold alot of flops that come down like 9-3-6 and we check-raise all in. By doing so we lost value from a hand that would have called our shove preflop.
In conclusion like I already noted - this is a super standard shove here preflop and not doing so is leaving tons of $$ on the table. When we call we are burning 3bb and getting dropped down on the leaderboards when we had a premium holding and could have possibly doubled up rather than fold.
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ssangyongpoker
Rock Star
Silver Level
another scenario blind vs blind, small blind shoves 63 off suit, we wake up with AK in the big blind and call.. turn 6, game over
money bubble
R
Rad210
Enthusiast
Silver Level
It depends... what is your opponent raising UTG +2? AQ+ and TT+? If that's his range, then you can call and evaluate flop. If he is raising AT+, KJ+, and all pairs, then jam it in and realize your equity. A fold is way too nitty, and I lean towards the jam against a random opponent. Also, was the opponent shorter than 10BB? Many people only raise nut hands small at that depth and jam everything marginal at that depth.
AllenKll
Rock Star
Silver Level
I would say that it partial depends on how the villain is playing. Is he loose or tight? If he's an OMC, then you can actually just fold the jacks. If he is a Maniac, then the shove is absolutely the right call.
As general rule of thumb though, a 3x is just a standard raise. he was in middle position, so probably had a relatively wide range. That, along with the fact that you were very short stacked, your shove was absolutely warranted, and you go unlucky.
Heck, 3 times in as many days I've done a similar play with JJ, QQ and KK. Twice, I ran into AA.
The third time, I had the guy dominated - my KK against his JJ... then he hit a set on the flop and turned quads
Take a deep breath and move on to the next hand. GL!
As general rule of thumb though, a 3x is just a standard raise. he was in middle position, so probably had a relatively wide range. That, along with the fact that you were very short stacked, your shove was absolutely warranted, and you go unlucky.
Heck, 3 times in as many days I've done a similar play with JJ, QQ and KK. Twice, I ran into AA.
The third time, I had the guy dominated - my KK against his JJ... then he hit a set on the flop and turned quads Take a deep breath and move on to the next hand. GL!
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A
angelamsmith05
Rock Star
Silver Level
Thank you that was a very helpful answer.
Jon Poker
Legend
Silver Level
On the stone money bubble unless you are in last or second to last place just fold and make your way into the money...its a snap fold with AK.
If you ARE one of those short stacks and you get it all in with AK vs 63 off than you were a massive favorite so what's there to think about?
3
300HPGOD
Legend
Platinum Level
I read it as you had 18 BB with JJ facing a raise in front of you. This is a jam spot and you did the correct move by going all in. Just one of those times where the raiser actually has a better hand but many times they will have big Ax or even KQ suited depending on position. Yes, against KQ suited you are only 53% ish but that is if he calls as you have fold equity as well. Don't be afraid to jam JJ with less than 20 BB and a raiser in front.