Pursuing 6-max Super Turbos

SYWTWAF

SYWTWAF

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I've taken a great liking to these "donk fests" (really, they aren't mere crapshoot donk fests, but I'd love it if people continued to think they are ;)). I've grinded out ~1200 $2.16 6-max super turbos on Merge and done pretty well. It's certainly not enough volume to know my true ROI, but it is, I think, enough to say with some certainty that I'm winning at these limits.

I reckon it's time to move up soon. I don't think it makes sense to stay at the 2s if I have an adequate BR (which I do), as moving up translates to less rake and more $$, but I'm an apprehensive nit. Does anyone else regularly play 6-max super turbos and have an idea how much tougher the $5.30s are compared to the $2.16s? Can I expect the skill level to rise dramatically, or are there only slightly more skilled players? (FWIW, virtually everyone at the 2s is a fish)

Would like to hear other thoughts on super turbos, too. I don't believe they get discussed quite as much as other SnG formats. Here are some of my own general tips for beginners (these are mostly supplementary. If you want to master the essence of super turbo strategy, i.e. ICM, there are sources out there that explain it with much greater quantitative precision than I can):

-Take plenty of notes on your opponents. Identify the fish. Record their every goofy move. Identify what species of fish, so to speak, they are. Are they the kind of fish that call too wide? Limp too much? Never call or shove in the early and mid- stages except with a monster (I've identified one guy who's exactly like that. I love having him in my game and being able to profitably shove into his blinds every time. I love knowing that my AJ vs. his 10bb UTG shove or my 77 vs. his 10bb UTG+1 shove are snap-folds)? Exploit accordingly. I may be especially fervent about note-taking to compensate for my lack of SnG Wizard.

-Get the hang of HU play. With Merge's 70/30, heavily weighted towards 1st place, pay-out structure, you really want to finish in 1st significantly more often than you do in 2nd.

-Learn to appreciate your passively acquired equity. It's easy to see you're winning when the pot gets shipped to you, but realize that a lot of the time, you gain doing nothing at all, i.e. when other players get into all-in confrontations. Keep yourself in check when you're tempted to make an unnecessary marginal shove that is likely to get marginally called, and is going to be -EV for both you and the caller when it does get called. Pit donks against each other instead, and let them hand you equity on a silver platter. It reminds me that I'm always running better than I think I am, which helps me cope with the swings. Speaking of which...

-This game involves lots of swinging; get used to it. There's nothing you can do about downswings but to play your way out of them. So keep playing, don't get too frustrated, and don't let losing streaks affect your technique. (I'd do well to follow this advice myself; am honestly a little tilted at the moment due to some bubbles that, as decisive chip leader at one point, I feel I should have closed out, but failed to)
 
jbbb

jbbb

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HU play in super turbos must be super easy. Surely you're on like 5 - 10 BB and can just shove nash?
 
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losched16

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I can't imagine the $5s are going to be much different than the $2s. You will still have just as many bad players at those stakes as the $2s. Maybe you will find a few more regs/winning players, so just be sure to note them so you are aware when playing those tables.

If you have the bankroll, you can move up. Of course, if you hit a little downswing, just move down until you can move back up again. But I would not let the fear of better players at the $5 level prevent you from moving up.
 
danprince10

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Yeah I really don't like the payout structure carbon has set up for all the 6 max SnGs you have to come in first way too frequently. This is why I've been playing the 6 person double up tournaments and have been having a TON of success (bankroll from 150 to 325 this week). I wonder what most people think of the current payout structure, is it like that for all the big sites?
 
SYWTWAF

SYWTWAF

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HU play in super turbos must be super easy. Surely you're on like 5 - 10 BB and can just shove nash?
Yeah, it's not necessarily difficult. I was just emphasizing how critical it is for your ROI that you seize 1st place as frequently as possible, and that you therefore want to be very focused and minimize mistakes (however easy this might be to achieve) when you get to HU. (P. S. against some weak opponents that never play back except with a strong hand, min-raising a ton works even better than shoving)

I can't imagine the $5s are going to be much different than the $2s. You will still have just as many bad players at those stakes as the $2s. Maybe you will find a few more regs/winning players, so just be sure to note them so you are aware when playing those tables.

If you have the bankroll, you can move up. Of course, if you hit a little downswing, just move down until you can move back up again. But I would not let the fear of better players at the $5 level prevent you from moving up.
Good idea. I just might rail some $5s and make notes on players before jumping into them. I think I'll slowly start mixing things up, maybe play 1 $5 SnG for every 3 or 4 $2 SnGs.

Yeah I really don't like the payout structure carbon has set up for all the 6 max SnGs you have to come in first way too frequently. This is why I've been playing the 6 person double up tournaments and have been having a TON of success (bankroll from 150 to 325 this week). I wonder what most people think of the current payout structure, is it like that for all the big sites?
FTP's 6-max SnG payout structure is 65/35. I've played a lot of 6-max super turbos on both FTP and Merge, but I'm not sure which one I prefer. The differing payout structures necessarily affect ICM calculations, but I'm guessing that if you adjust accordingly, it shouldn't change your long-term results.

I dabbled in DoNs for a bit when I first deposited on Merge, but once I got into super turbos, I lost all patience for them. I accidentally registered into 2 DoNs yesterday, and felt really annoyed and barely even cared about cashing (SnG post-flop play? Wuz dat? What a waste of time! :D), but fortunately all that super turbo donking taught me well, and I cashed anyway :p
 
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