The Min-Raise; still effective?

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onekaydeep

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There is a lot to ponder when raising in general with all the different variation of situations. I've noticed that, in tournament poker, opening for more than 2x is becoming traditional again. Also, because of this, raising anything more than 2x automatically sets a tone for a strong, polarized range. If the hand of the opener is strong, then there's a lot of value to be had out of the skeptics. Also, after folding two rounds until picking up J10o in the High Jack, raising 2.4 -3.4x disguises the obvious High Jack opening range and players won't be as likely to 3 bet light from the button, as the hand looks reputable and the pot sizing gets sufficiently larger.

Thus, this style opens up dubious perspectives when the player utilizing this strategy changes the bet back to 2x. For me, this looks like a standard weak play just trying to gain positional advantage with a marginal hand. SO switching to 2x with the top of a strong range can induce weak hands and players to bluff this top range - the range Herox is actually playing!

For example, min-raising from the cutoff with AQs and having the button flat with A-4, or even 3 bet! I've seen this happen countless times and have personally gained from this deception.

Moral of the story: build a strong tight image, double up early on in a dominating spot, then run the table to the ground while in position!

-Tylorm1
Merge :cool:
 
W

whoami

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I think that in late stages of the tournament when the average stack is something like 10-15 bb (maybe even little higher), the best play is to minraise because the opponent should 3-bet shove or fold whether you raise to 2 bb or 3bb. And if the opponent shoves and you decide to fold, you lose less by minraising than raising bigger.
(With less than 10 bb you should obviously shove and not minraise.)
 
romych007

romych007

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Yes, I think this is correct but
the main thing is not to strive
for the top spot in the table or
you may lose
 
VizziVizo

VizziVizo

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I think it can be effective only at the bubble or in late tournament.
 
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matiusaa

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I think this may work for regular or slow blind level tournaments. In turbo tournaments where average stack is around 15 bb, there's no point in raising more than 2x, cause when you fold to a push your are losing more money if you raise more than 2x. If te average stack is around 40bb I think you could do that, but still it is adviceable to open 2x.
 
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onekaydeep

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I understand and agree with all ya'll. Late tourney, min-raising is effective to not loose as much, but this gives medium/big stacks odds to defend and stack the min-raiser. 2.5 solves this counter, for the most part.
 
rogerdelpk

rogerdelpk

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in cash as well, i have a friend who plays nl600 and he minraises all the time! He must have his reasons but he plays really good
 
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onekaydeep

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I actually am fond of min-raising in cash; especially higher stakes. However, I find it most effective in Omaha.
 
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Tgen

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there are different strengths and cons on different bet sizes but generally its good to minraise on tournaments when you are shortstacked.
 
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nygmen2007

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There are certain times when the min raise is more effective, but with hands that you can call you should play for a raise. I like betting bigger because you want to get paid off when you have hands, not just win the minimum. All situautons are different, but if you know you are playing and aggro player min raise and let him dictate the action.
 
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YouPay4MyCrack

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depends on who you're up against. I've seen it work every hand, other times you are with what I call a call-bot and they will see the flop every time. If you are better than they are post flop it's win-win, if not, may want to get a bit tighter/aggressive vs. that player.
 
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onekaydeep

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Agreed. Tightening up and playing aggressive alone is win win, coupled with better bet sizing and more strategic patterns
 
Ducbim

Ducbim

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Double raise gives BB about 1:3 1:4 odds to call your raise, so the opener should always prrpare for playing flop. However this strategy works best against opponent ehi likes to shove against a raiser. I prefer a raise to 2.2x to make it look stronger.
 
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JamesMoroski

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Min Raise is Not effective

Min raising only gives the next player better odds to call and if he calls the next guy gets even better odds and so on and so on and then your playing against all those mediocre hands and post flop its a mess DONT DO IT RAISE STANDaRD 3 X or 4 X
 
4kingwildo

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well, if check the name of main theme, which called "tournament poker" it was not of course, but in cash it works pretty well on flop+ and even can help you read opps. and more better works in speed type of cash game. however low limits and donks makes min raises unprofitable...
 
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TetraMinbet

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For some reason min raises after the flop when the pot is huge just slay me

Cracks me up when I see it
 
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DoctorDonLoL

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it depends on the stack
u have to read the situation
 
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kozikpro

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min raise r good but on normal tables with normal players dont do it with fishes :)
 
DonSifu

DonSifu

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i think min raising gets you the same information as a 3 or 3.5x raise does. Also, when considering your raise size, you should factor in, when in tournaments, if there are antes or not, as this can really affect your opponents pot odds to call.
when antes are involved, i like to raise just over 2.2x, and stick to that consistently, whether i have AA or JToff.
As usual, i think the best answer to any poker question is, "It depends..."
 
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Ambur

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Depends on your image! If you play approximately top 5% Early stage! And have created nice solid tight image. Notice that i usually never bet 2bb Early stage! But in the middle stage is perfectly fine bet 2bb, it gives you opportunity to open your game and play more mediocre hands. It is important that you explore your opponents time to time! Sharp players tend to understand more often what are you doing and will set well arranged traps on your way! So its good to mix your game a bit that you stay as unexploited as possible. The bet size will do it for you and variating your ranges occasionally etc.

But keep in mind that play as much possible OP and avoid some big mistakes! For example calling when you do not have odds and implied odds are not great enought to compensate doing so. For example drawing hands against the odds..

But the one important factor to choosing the strategy is the table image. Is it loose or more tighter. If the table is tend to be loose then you should play opposite way tighten up your game and if it is tight then you should open up your game a bit! (as other said already it depends on dynamics, your image, table image, stack sizes, average size, mathematics etc). Wish you good luck at tables!
 
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dsk1231

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Only time I min raise is in the late stages of an MTT. It is usually effective vs most villians when you're in LP.
 
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