Late stage....

L

lost2qandisa

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Here is my problem..... I can usually make it to mid to late stage in tournaments. An example of a $2 buy in tournament I was playing yesterday on Brovada:

I was sitting comfortably in 1st with 18 players remaining. Bubble was long gone because it was at 54. I had 175K chips and next closest player was at 145K. Everything I have read says pick on the small stacks and try and chip up some more. So, I would call a 30K all in with 10 8 suited. J 10 suited I would play. I opened my range up. I was doing ok and would win one lose one. With 10 players left, I had 138K in third spot. I was holding QQ. Short stack with 42K shoves into my BB. I called it. He flips AK suited to my QQ and turns a K. I made it to the final table and busted 9th to a 83 to my QJ. We both had about same amount of chips.

So my question: Do you get really aggressive at that point or should I have coasted to a much better spot? I cashed $13. The next step was $21 and they went up to $187. I kind of felt robbed after playing for hours and being in such a good spot. How do you play that situation? Do you just get real tight and make spots? Or get aggressive and risk doing what I did and lose position?
 
trolaAa

trolaAa

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I think even if u want to atack small stacks u cant do it with 10 8 s or J8s , these are junk cards avoid to play with them . J8 or 10 8 is gambling dont u think so ?
 
J

Jdawg0913

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Your strategy is not flawed. You ran unlucky in some spots. However, don't pick on the short stacks as much. Target the medium stacks especially when you are on a significant pay jump. Short stacks are desperate, medium stacks believe they can be patient. They believe they can wait for the small stacks to bust. That is why they are ripe for the picking. Take advantage of these guys instead. If you are going to pick on a short stack do so only if your hand warrants a call.
 
rdm4k

rdm4k

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welcome in the club :) This is the true life of an mttr!!

Unfortunately in late stage up to the FT you need to be lucky a little bit (I dont mean to cooler somebody but I mean to see the right cards on the right spots ect) especially cos of the pretty short avg stack of most of the online micro games.
Even playing a solid poker, in very late stage (10/15 left) it is not so unusual to have significant stacks' swings.

Generally according with the table style you need to adjust your play: usually on the bubble (FT bubble is the same) or generally in late stage people especially at micros tend to tight up their ranges too much so, if you have a good stack, you may open yours to chip up at the best (at least that's one principle of poker, a game of adjustments: the table is tight so we loose up, the table is loose so we close our range).
To chip up I even mean only stealing the blinds in each orbit to be able to stay in avg until you get a good spot.
Putting pressure to the opponents is a good strategy tho. And it's the correct one.
Be aware that so often we get advice about avoiding the big stacks and play the smaller; but depends! I think that (obv according with the kind player) aggression to big stacks might be a way more profitable to chip up especially if they are money scared or nit: they will avoid the conflict with you coz of the short stacks. You may chip up without showdown (which is very important down a tournament) and "reduce" the variance of calling the aipf of the shorts .
Loads of mttrs, when they got a deep run in late stage, make the huge mistake to feel "responsible" to call the short stacks to eliminate them so they end up making a bad call or a bad push. It's not your business, it's everybody's; do not spite call to eliminate people. Play your game.

Late stage means we played long time already and we are perhaps tired as well: it's easy to make mistakes there!! Relax, dont feel responsible to eliminate no one if you are the deeper, wait your spots and punish them.
It's such a waste, getting down there to make few silly mistakes that cost the life of the entire tournament. Deep runs are so rare and the ev lost making mistakes down there is a way much much bigger then normal.

Btw QQ from the blind was a nice call nmw. Dont be result oriented and
gl for the next tournament.
I know the feeling...loose a big tournament playing a good poker with a nice run and end up there, just there, a ittle bit behind the prizes that worth.
and after 5 hours...
and frustrated.

Go ahead mate.

gl gl
 
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sillymunchie

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your strategy is semi flawed, as already mentioned you dont want to pick on anybody who has less the 10BB unless....... they are clearly folding there way to the money.

as for how to play a big stack, calling all ins is still not a good thing to do especially with 8 10o.......
calling all ins is not bullying the short stacks all it will do is make them loosen up there shoving range because they are looking for a double up and your willing to pay them off

what it means to bully is to give the opponent a difficult decision, so you see a 20BB opponent raise pre, it may be a min raise, and your holding AA, at this moment in time you should be looking to make the opponent pay big, because then he cant set mine, so his only moves will be all in or fold, you chip up

now lets say the same curcumstances, but this time opponent has 10BB your whole game changes, your not looking to let him see a flop, only if you have a strong hand, your going to force them all in.
your putting them under pressure

20BB have a lot more to lose so you can loosen up against these, if they miss its hard for them to continue without getting committed to the pot, so usually you can tell if they have missed and so you again add more pressure and start to chip up
 
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TheNoobie

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Yea, just because you are the chip leader of the tournament doesnt mean that you have to eliminate all the other players. When someone goes all in and you want to call him, make sure you have the right cards. Theres a big mistake that you are making. Usually the ones that are shortstacked play push or fold. So, if he goes all in he must have something high. You cant call him with any two cards and hope to get lucky.
 
Vhyre

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Mind your cards and position. Middle stacks are the most profitable, always look to to put the difficult decisions on your opponents, that way you are in control. Calling all ins with rags is never advisable.
 
steveiam

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In that particular situation J8s & 10 8s is not in my calling range.
 
Jacki Burkhart

Jacki Burkhart

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I echo much of the same advice other poster's gave.

pick on medium stacks.

avoid short stacks and big stacks unless you have a great hand.

avoid calling all ins unless you have a great hand

identify the tight medium stacks and look for ways to exploit them.

an example would be:

you have a big stack 40+BB

medium stack TAG guy who has 20BB raises to 2.5BB from cutoff.

You call in BB with medium suited connecters.

flop comes 9 hi and you miss but flop a gutshot. You can lead out for about the pot....so about 5 or 6 BB....the med stack will have a very hard time calling your bet with anything but top pair or better. if he jams you know you're toast and fold, no problem. if he flats, you know you need to hit your gutshot. Most of the time he'll just fold his KQ or whatever and you win by "bullying him"

or calling the raises of TAG medium stacks in position, and if they habitually cbet the flop, then raise them with 2nd pair, or even air if the situation warrants it. They won't continue in the hand with less than a powerhouse.

THAT is bullying. Not calling short stack all ins with rags.
 
Akorps

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You want to pick on players who will fold, not have confrontations with players who will go to a showdown (unless you have much better cards :)

Fold equity is mainly where you get your edge.
 
Arjonius

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The most frequent way to pick on other players, whether small or mid stacks, isn't by calling more. It's by exercising controlled aggression. You open-raise somewhat wider because they've tightened up and will thus fold more than they should. You 3bet somewhat more for the same reason, but still selectively.

When you do call, you prefer to have a hand that flops well, so for example, 76s is better than K8o. You also have to be prepared to be aggressive by betting quite a few flops. As missjacki said, you use aggression with your big stack to take tight players off hands that are ahead of you but not good enough to continue considering your chip advantage and the threat it poses to their tournament lives.
 
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