late reg and "guaranteed" prize money

Hello.

I'm struggling to find MTT's that close on a specific time. I'm a pokerstar player and i'm playing the micro limits. I think it any given day around 3 hours between each other there is a specific buy in and tournament start time and like to play these tournaments.

However the thing that is really beginning to annoy me is the amount of "guranteed 4k,2K,etcetc" tournaments that are going on and ALL have a late registration of around 60 minutes. Now, don't get me wrong i do play in these sometimes purely because there are so many of them available and next to none of the others but given a choice i'd pick a tournament that started at a time and if you miss out you miss out. Then you could just sign up to the next one that is available, which would be within 5minutes the way they push all these guaranteed joke tournaments around.

The way they go about these guaranteed amounts available is so stupid it's annoying. They make out like your getting some sort of great deal and brilliant tournament of a guaranteed 4k with only a buy-in of $1..but the reality is often it surpasses that amount with the huge amount of people registering late.

Do they seriously think they are dooping people into thinking they are grabbing a great MTT tournament deal? It's pathetic and it irrates me, not because people keep signing up late but because of the fact the way they display it and basically it's more of a scam to a degree in the sense of "hey, come join this tournament there is a great 4 k guaranteed no matter how many people sign up"

The point is, they could just as easily set tournaments that have a start time and all the money pooled is split like a normal tournament. I so much pre fare that, at least you know on average how long the tournament is going to take. One minute your playing along with late registration get into top 100, see that another 500 people have registered and i'm thinking you may as well just all sign up 1 minute to go as it seems so totally pointless.

Sorry, just a rant but id sooner see more hundreds of specific start times to a tournament rather than full with these "guaranteed" jackpot amounts like 100 to 1 in comparisons to a "normal" tournament.

I bet they would soon stop these tournaments of guaranteed amounts if there was only 10 people signing up!

Arrrrrrggg!

Is it just me or does it annoy anyone else this much?

ps: Yes i do play SnG's more purely because of this, you know how many are registered etc. I'd be quite happy to play SnG's all the time, i just pre fare larger tournaments of around 500-900 players and the only one they have is the 2cents mega turbo rubbish which is just more lottery game than anything else.

You could look at it this way, ram: the late registration gives you and the other players a choice, and where there is a choice in poker there is the potential for making a strategic decision and hopefully getting an advantage. As for the guaranteed 2k business, yes it is a marketing ploy but i think 'scam' is a bit strong. You have sussed that it doesn't mean there is a bigger payout than the cumulatative buy-ins, maybe others haven't - another advantage for you.

By the way, the word your are searching for is 'prefer'.

I don't mind late registration but do wish it was 30 minutes instead of an hour.

As far as the guaranteed bit - just know there is rarely if ever an overlay and you won't be tricked. Anyone who plays with any regularity at all knows the guaranteed tournaments will fill to the point of surpassing the guaranteed amount 99.9% of the time - so just ignore it.

I wouldn't call it a scam but I can see what you mean.

As you have played alot of these tournaments before, you know that most likely the guaranteed amount will be reached and surpassed every time so there's no point getting worked up about it.

I have never seen a tourney on PS that hasn't gone past the guaranteed amount.

It does make a tounament more appealing to play but just look at it as a guideline for the minimum number of players that will be in that tourney.

Good blog and good points made by all so far.

I too am preturbed with the slight "mis-direction", but I don't consider it a scam...a little mis-leading for newbies for sure (it is explained in their 'fine print'), but once you've been there and know what they are doing, it is still somewhat frustrating. I sort of place these in the same category as the re-buys.

On the plus side, both can be very lucrative as one can buy-in for the small fee just before registration closes and still be ITM/win or never make a re-buy and be ITM/win...it can be done.

Thanks for your thoughts mate, Wally

The pup:

Sorry, yes i didn't mean a scam, marketing ploy was the word i was looking for. I don't understand your post though where you say use it to your advantage. I can't really see an advantage to it because the reasons being the larger the field the more up and down your results become. I love large tournaments, but not consistently playing large fields of like 2000 plus.. I know the advantage of the late registants means they have to act fast because of the blinds, it's just somewhat annoying and i'd just "PREFER" P) the idea of the small amount of ones they have in a day. 50cent buy-ins with around 500 entrants at the end of registration, so you actually know where you stand after the regiistration closes.

What are you personal thoughts on late reg? Do you play them?

Thanks for your reply.

dakota-xx:

Thanks for your reply. Can i ask what it is you like so much about the late reg please or would you prefare tournaments that actually close at the start of the tournaments?

BluffYou123:

I try not to get worked up about it, it just makes me laugh thats all and that's the reason i think so many people sign up. They just see 50cent buy-in with bold writing in green stating "4k guranteed" and get all giddy and sign up without actually knowing what it means and all this late reg rubbish.
It isnt appealing to me in the slightess. Like i say, i do play them but only because there are so little other tournaments WITHOUT a late reg apart from smaller fielded SnG's. I wouldent mind if they said for example

"4k guranteed, 2000 minimum entrants" and have a cap of how many to sign up. Or just do it as a SnG with 2500 players 1dollar buy-in, it is the same sort of thing although you wouldent be getting the late registrations.

Hi bullishwwd.
Thanks for your reply. I think i signed up late once just to see if it acutally could be lucrative, but found it cant be as the blinds are so high at this point and people are already sometimes 100K up in chips. Unless you got really lucky with some decent cards i just can't see it happening. I don't know, i'd like to know though if anyone actually plays for the very late reg and makes it worthwhile in the long run. Thanks for your reply.

Understood.

I like the 90 man SNGs on PS cos of the blind structure, they are similar to tournament structure. (10 min blinds)

Maybe not enough entrants for you but they're still pretty good and have lots of weak players.

SIDE NOTE

dakota-xx said:

I don't mind late registration but do wish it was 30 minutes instead of an hour.

As far as the guaranteed bit - just know there is rarely if ever an overlay and you won't be tricked. Anyone who plays with any regularity at all knows the guaranteed tournaments will fill to the point of surpassing the guaranteed amount 99.9% of the time - so just ignore it.

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Not related, but Dakota, your ID picture here is "right-on" for your image so don't go messing with "perfect" ... it is your image!

Wally :congrats:

Agree with your premise

ramdeebam said:

Hi bullishwwd.
Thanks for your reply. I think i signed up late once just to see if it acutally could be lucrative, but found it cant be as the blinds are so high at this point and people are already sometimes 100K up in chips. Unless you got really lucky with some decent cards i just can't see it happening. I don't know, i'd like to know though if anyone actually plays for the very late reg and makes it worthwhile in the long run. Thanks for your reply.

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However, I have registered right before the first break with a minute to go and still made ITM (althoughthe ITM was a piddling)...and, I have actually made the final table in a re-buy without making a single re-buy.

However, I certainly do not suggest this as a strategy and I do not routinely do it either. :hello:

I like the late registration because I can't always get registered in time lol. Like last night - I had 3 tournaments starting around 9pmish and couldn't get home til right at 9pm. I didn't have to rush - had time to go to bathroom, take my clothes off , and get something to drink before sitting down to play.

It just takes the pressure off registration for me - sometimes I need time to walk the dogs before I start playing.

With all that said I never play if I am more than 20-30 minutes late because I don't like starting with a much below average chip stack.

I see what your saying dakota-xx and this is what they say the late registration is for although i don't believe that! It's more for marketing like it's been said. Like i say, i understand what you're saying however, there are so many of these tournaments running every hour or less even, i don't see the point in the late reg seen as you could just then wait another half hour max to find a tournament rather similar and just start on time. Hence the reason i'm more for more "normal" tournaments where as no late registration and would be the same..

Re-buys

My greatest beef are the re-buy and add-ons....along with the late registration ...people can take a couple of cracks at the pot ..which may influence the way you play ...and if they can afford it...which they can...they just reload and try again...I stay away from these money sucking games....they will drain you DRY!

ramdeebam said:

I see what your saying dakota-xx and this is what they say the late registration is for although i don't believe that! It's more for marketing like it's been said. Like i say, i understand what you're saying however, there are so many of these tournaments running every hour or less even, i don't see the point in the late reg seen as you could just then wait another half hour max to find a tournament rather similar and just start on time. Hence the reason i'm more for more "normal" tournaments where as no late registration and would be the same..

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Some of us need multiple tournaments to play at one time - and there really are not that many to choose from with good structures in the same relative buy-in range. Ideally I would like to be in 3-4 tournaments at a time. Check out my schedule for today lol:

yes, an hour is a big period of time...this can be some type of strategy for some players..

If you like to be in 3-4 tournaments at a time , it seems that you can take a lot of attention out there..and yea, nice schedule) Gl

Without offering an opinion I will share the way I USE late registration. This will not work with Turbo tournaments.

Non-rebuy tournaments

Here I'll use the PS 1700 $2.75 buyin tournaments as an example - 3K starting chips, 15 minute levels. I'll buy into these about five minutes before the break. This virtually assures that I will be seated at an established table with a mix of stacks that are higher and lower than my 3K. The blinds are 25/50 and close to becoming 50/100. This gives me a 60BB stack or a 30BB stack depending on how you want to look at it. If I can't get in at least a few minutes before the break I don't bother, because then I'll end up at a table with new players and 3K stacks which defeats what I am trying to do. The odds are that any table I end up at has bigger and smaller stacks. Play has generally loosened up somewhat. There are big stacks to double me up, and small stacks that I can push against with no chance of elimination. I have enough BB to play my game. I've found that starting with 3K in chips 50 minutes after the start of the tournament is usually better than I do if I start at the beginning. Under this scenario I find myself in a good position to cash.

Rebuy Tournaments

I've only done this a few times but plan on doing it more often. The levels come faster, but I've found that if I get in in the 50 minute timeframe, do a double rebuy, and then the addon, and play my game, I can get good results. Once the rebuy period is over, it's more like a non-rebuy game but the payouts for cashing justify the additional expense. I put this in perspect by picking the right $1.10+R tournament and thinking of it as a $3.10 tournament.

We all have our own playing styles but what I said above seems to work for me. I suspect that this strategy would continue to work at higher levels, but somewhat less effectively due to my presumed better quality of play.

Once you get used to the lobby you'll know approx. how many players will be in each of the tourneys (you can also 'click off' the 'show registering/upcoming only' button & check to see how many were in that tournament the day before.. some will still be there.. other's won't).

The guar. MTT's always have the highest amount of entrants & numbers will almost always far exceed the guar. The site will occassionally increase the amount of the guarantee (ie. the Sun. $11 buyin used to be the $100Kguar., now I believe it's the Sun 1/4mill... also the Daily30k (14:00 - $11) is now the 'Daily40k'.

I've scrolled the lobbies on occassion (on all the sites I play on & could either tell you straight off the approx. number of entrants there'll be.. or just check a page where I have them written down (I keep a page with a schedule of MTT's I will play in, and on each there's an approx. # of entrants & ~payout). On some MTTs I play in the number of entrants doesn't change much from day to day (maybe 5% difference max.).

Another thing... if you're playing a particular buyin level (let's say just for example.. $5-$11 buyin MTT's), there's really not another one starting up every 5mins. It's closer to one every 2hrs. (pretty much the same for all of the buyin levels).

Lobbies take a bit of getting used to, but after a bit it becomes very familiar.

I think the 1hr. is a bit too long as well.. and think that 20mins. (maybe 30?) would be.. should be plenty.
Late reg. is a 'good thing' - - more money in the prizepool!!! (if they want to late reg. by 1hr. they're missing out on alot of the easy money in the earlier levels.. when stacks are deep and fish are plenty).

ramdeebam said:

The pup:

Sorry, yes i didn't mean a scam, marketing ploy was the word i was looking for. I don't understand your post though where you say use it to your advantage. I can't really see an advantage to it because the reasons being the larger the field the more up and down your results become. I love large tournaments, but not consistently playing large fields of like 2000 plus.. I know the advantage of the late registants means they have to act fast because of the blinds, it's just somewhat annoying and i'd just "PREFER" P) the idea of the small amount of ones they have in a day. 50cent buy-ins with around 500 entrants at the end of registration, so you actually know where you stand after the regiistration closes.

What are you personal thoughts on late reg? Do you play them?

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All I meant was that since we can decide to register either on time or late we have a choice and so can think about what registration time is best. I have heard arguments on both sides: register early to see lots of cheap cards and pick off some early donks; register late because the chances are you will be folding everything but premiums and will save yourself the blinds. I guess if you are a master smallballer you want to get in early; if you are as tight as a duck's arse then maybe late reg might make some sense. What I mean by gaining an advantage is that if you register at the right time for your game you have an advantage over someone who registers at the wrong time for their game.

Twitter Poker Tour tonight

Since I had just finished up another tourney, I got to this Private Tournament right as the "late registration" was about to end...about 10 minutes into the tourney and one person was already out. Thought I'd test my previous experience since I had read your thread. Here is what happened...I finished 2nd place overall when my QQ was beat by AK on Final table. Going to try and post some table shots and progress pics.

bullishwwd said:

Notice that when I entered late, I was actually in 10th place and one person was out already. I had 1,500 chips.

I was able to almost double up within about 3 minutes which put me in 2nd place overall. I had 2,700 in chips.

At first break, I had 8,987 chips and was in First Place.

7 minutes after break, I was at 10,487 chips and still in first place.

At second break, I was down to 7,856 in chips and in 3rd Place.

Final hand was a three way with me with a QQ, another with A2 and the winner with AK.

Bottom-line, registering late can be lucrative, but I don't normally do it nor do I recommend doing it....especially if it is a Turbo which this was not.

Thought I'd share this...my best, Wally

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I'm not sure of your purpose here. Are you just saying that it is possible to do well when registering late or is there more to this?

By the way, I don't think that is Shakespeare you are quoting?

One I love and one I hate!

LOVE : Guaranteed tournaments! It's nice to see a guaranteed tourney not hit it's target. It's always nice when Full Tilt has to kick in some cash! ****ers have enough of it!

HATE : Late Registration. I know that sites want to get more players in so they can get more money in their pockets from entry fees, which is bullshit. The way I look at it is, "If you're not there on time, TOO ****ING BAD!!!

Anyone else agree with this?

dakota-xx said:

take my clothes off , and get something to drink before sitting down to play.

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You seem to be saying that you play poker in nudist mode. Does that improve your odds of holding a pair ? :laugh:

The_Pup said:

You could look at it this way, ram: the late registration gives you and the other players a choice, and where there is a choice in poker there is the potential for making a strategic decision and hopefully getting an advantage. As for the guaranteed 2k business, yes it is a marketing ploy but i think 'scam' is a bit strong. You have sussed that it doesn't mean there is a bigger payout than the cumulatative buy-ins, maybe others haven't - another advantage for you.

By the way, the word your are searching for is 'prefer'.

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Now they are saying late registration until first blind change. I've started skipping those as I'm not a believer in late registration. Race car drivers can't drive 3 vehicles at one time in a race and to me you should select the tournaments you prefer and register on time. Enough said.

AntiKhrist said:

One I love and one I hate!

LOVE : Guaranteed tournaments! It's nice to see a guaranteed tourney not hit it's target. It's always nice when Full Tilt has to kick in some cash! ****ers have enough of it!

HATE : Late Registration. I know that sites want to get more players in so they can get more money in their pockets from entry fees, which is bullshit. The way I look at it is, "If you're not there on time, TOO ****ING BAD!!!

Anyone else agree with this?

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Thanks AntiKhrist on late entries. I 100% agree and think that if that theory was dropped, players would schedule their play much better and in turn help the tournaments get additional players.

Don't like late entries.

ramdeebam said:

Hi bullishwwd.
Thanks for your reply. I think i signed up late once just to see if it acutally could be lucrative, but found it cant be as the blinds are so high at this point and people are already sometimes 100K up in chips. Unless you got really lucky with some decent cards i just can't see it happening. I don't know, i'd like to know though if anyone actually plays for the very late reg and makes it worthwhile in the long run. Thanks for your reply.

Click to expand...

I've watched late entries for a few months now and in my opinion I've seen a variety of good/bad play. I've lost chips in the first 3-5-7 minutes to have 4-5 new enter with the max and now I have to fight for chips with them. In most cases I go out ahead of them as some of them turn out to simply be sit ins and wait until the last minute to jump in when you are not expecting them. I had one sit in that waited and all players had picked up on him. All of a sudden when he got good hole cards with his blind automatically in, he gets a flop that is unbeatable and everyone bets heave because they know he is a sit in. BAM, big pot and back in the game.