My last SNG thread (5k posts incoming) :(

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WiZZiM

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Hey guys, it's my 5k post coming up and i've been less and less active around here. So i'm making this thread for y'all to ask anything SNG related and i'll do my best to answer any questions at all. So fire away, this will be my last thread/post in the forums as i haven't played for years and i feel my advice is getting rusty. Also this is more of a habit/procrastination thing using the forums, so i want to get more productive IRL so leaving things like this is a must unfortunately.

Been a pleasure being here it's helped me a lot and i've enjoyed (hopefully) helping some of you guys.

So fire away, ask anything you want, i'm pretty good with anything tournament related. If you want graphs/charts/software advice whatever it is i'll let you know. Also have a few keys floating around for software i can give away (provided i can find them)
 
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Snakester420

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How wide should I raise the button in a 9-handed regular $1.65 SNG on ACR when it folds around to me? I often find myself frustrated raising non pair hands like AJ+ but never connecting with the flop. I feel that even when I c-bet with no pair my opponent often calls which is frustrating. Maybe I should check back any high card hand since bluffing does not work well at these stakes. But I guess I'm just asking how wide on button, CO, and HJ at 75 BBs deep?
 
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Thanks btw I'm really looking forward to asking you a few questions as I plan on becoming a low to mid stakes SNG reg when I've run up the BR. Still at $172, but starting to play more SNGs and run it up.
 
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WiZZiM

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what you really should be asking is what is the widest possible range i can raise? this will depend on the players in the blinds. Vs nits you can raise pretty much anything you like, they play strict ranges like you state above, vs very aggressive players you will want to tighten that down a lot. So point is, don't bog yourself down with what you should raise. Obviously you will need some sort of baseline and that will solely depend on the general population tendancies of the games you play in.

if you play in tight games, you need to be raising more, looser games you need to be balancing your range a little more and being on the look out for tighter players.
 
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WiZZiM

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if you are raising only AJ+ from the button it's very likely you are playing way too tight, open up more, you will get into more spots where you don't know what to do and that is where learning poker comes into it, if you never get yourself in spots where you have simply no idea what to do, then you are not learning very much.

The key is when confronted with these spots is to learn about them, ask questions on how other players would have played it. so you may get stuck shortterm and possibly lose a little more in spots you wouldn't have, but you will gain a bunch of chips simply by having people fold to your raise or C-bet, so don't stress.
 
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Thanks for the answer! Very helpful and I agree 100% now that I understand. I will start playing the range I do in cash game, but slightly tighter. Kx, Ax, Q7o Q5s and suited connectors, pairs etc.
another question
On the bubble of a 9 man SNG (4 left top 3 cash) I am UTG (or CO it is 4 handed) with AJo. Do I jam with 20BB under any circumstance? Or is that too wide/deep? Should I just min- raise this hand? How about small pocket pairs (77's and below) at 20BB same situation?
What stack depth should I play any pair at in that situation? Maybe if I am in chip lead or very short stack so happy to jam a pair? I tend to fold small pairs below 20-30BB no matter what the ICM is. So what I'm saying is this: is it right for me to fold 77s and below between 20 and 30BB's no matter if SNG is still 9-handed or 3 handed. I mean as an open raise, not set mining and calling an opponents raise. Hope this all makes some sense haha. Thanks so much
 
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WiZZiM

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there's really no situation that calls for jamming AJ with 20bb, even if it technically shows profit theres far better more profitable ways to play the hand. It's a very high risk situation with little reward. There's no real situation that i jam 20bb in. Maybe in some HU spots i will, but really there's no need for it. Big risk little reward.

With the small pocket pairs, raising is fine folding is fine it all depends of course, but jamming again is just a huge risk and little reward situation. Overjamming in spots like that leads to a higher variance of play. There are some regs that will just shove 15-20bb in with pairs as a NASH type play, but there is certainly better options for us.
 
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Thanks for the advice! I guess the MTT player inside me likes to jam a lot of hands pretty deep stacked. So on the bubble like this what is the deepest stack depth you will shove a good hand at? Less than 10BB? What is the shortest stack you will raise/fold to any shove?
Also, if you were to min raise AJo at 20BB same situation on the bubble, and someone shoves in their 20BB. What position does that player have to be in for you to call? Thanks
 
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I'm not a big question asker but I do read a lot of the comments and suggestions so ty for taking the time to answer the questions others post.. I learn like that..
 
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Can you recommend any shove/fold charts for those late game times in the 45 - 180 player games where almost everyone is sitting with ~10BBs?
 
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Can you recommend any shove/fold charts for those late game times in the 45 - 180 player games where almost everyone is sitting with ~10BBs?

Not that i know of. Late stage in 180 mans is pretty dynamic, so shove charts will likely hinder progress rather than actually helping you. Just keep an eye on the average stacks, and use common sense to jam your stack in rather than looking at your cards. Sometimes you are better off jamming 72o than KQs because you need the chips more, or a certain player is playing too tight. unless you are down to the final 4 or something, always err on the side of shoving too loose of a range, it will benefit you way more, but be prepared to have some swings, but also chances at the big wins.
 
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Doug Polk posted a heads up SNG all-in range for an 11 BB stack that is as follows

22+, Kx+, Ax+, Q2s+, Q8o+,J4s+, J8o+, 53s+, 87o+

This seems wide to me, and I haven't exactly been successful using this in the last 100 or so SNGs I've made it heads up in.

Thoughts?
 
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WiZZiM

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Doug Polk posted a heads up SNG all-in range for an 11 BB stack that is as follows

22+, Kx+, Ax+, Q2s+, Q8o+,J4s+, J8o+, 53s+, 87o+

This seems wide to me, and I haven't exactly been successful using this in the last 100 or so SNGs I've made it heads up in.

Thoughts?

yes, that's HU. He was talking about 45 man and 180 man which have sometimes huge ICM implications of jamming a range. This is why no shove chart can really help you, sometimes there's no substitute for just working out how stack setups affect your range. it takes time and effort to do this, theres no magic way to just get better at these decisions.
 
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More specifically I was thinking of full or near full table situations. Stacks aren't big enough to bet 2X plus / fold preflop. Shoving, 3 bet shoving over limps and calling shoves are a bit of a crap shoot.
 
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What is the best strategy for playing 0.50$ sng of 360 or 180 players?
 
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Sucks that CC is gonna lose the last somewhat active poster it has for SNGs :(

Always enjoyed reading your SNG posts and I'm sure many people here who were looking to improve their SNG game have appreciated your posts going over HH and what not.

Hopefully people take full advantage of this thread to ask some questions before you're gone for good. :D
 
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What is the best strategy for playing 0.50$ sng of 360 or 180 players?

Dont be afraid to make some risky moves and push to get a stack of chips as you will need to be able to survive many all in spots in the late game. Aim for those top 3 spots, nothing else really matters too much.
 
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WiZZiM

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More specifically I was thinking of full or near full table situations. Stacks aren't big enough to bet 2X plus / fold preflop. Shoving, 3 bet shoving over limps and calling shoves are a bit of a crap shoot.

I would just use something like a jennifear shove chart then, should be kind of what you are after i think. Those charts don't really help that much, but they can definitely stop you making some big mistakes by not jamming wide enough or the less common jamming too wide. Goggle jennifear (think its that) its a jam chart made for MTT games...
 
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WiZZiM

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Sucks that CC is gonna lose the last somewhat active poster it has for SNGs :(

Always enjoyed reading your SNG posts and I'm sure many people here who were looking to improve their SNG game have appreciated your posts going over HH and what not.

Hopefully people take full advantage of this thread to ask some questions before you're gone for good. :D

thanks mate
 
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Great looking thread Wiz, you will be sorely missed when you do inevitably pull the plug :(
 
DaveE

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I would just use something like a jennifear shove chart then, should be kind of what you are after i think. Those charts don't really help that much, but they can definitely stop you making some big mistakes by not jamming wide enough or the less common jamming too wide. Goggle jennifear (think its that) its a jam chart made for MTT games...

Cheers :top:
 
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Hi WiZZiM,

Thank you for doing that, only really good players with no inferiority complex can help in the way you do.

I've got HM2 full license.. do you have any module license? I'm gonna love you if you can provide sitngo wizard. 😊

Thank you
 
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Hi WiZZiM,

Thank you for doing that, only really good players with no inferiority complex can help in the way you do.

I've got HM2 full license.. do you have any module license? I'm gonna love you if you can provide sitngo wizard. 😊

Thank you

i'll have a look for ya and send some codes, but i can't guarantee that it will work.
 
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Snakester420

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So 75 BBs deep early in a 9 man (or 6 man too), I wake up to AJo in the small and it folds around. I raise on the BB 4x (so to 80 with blinds 10/20 and 1500 chips deep) and they flat. I miss the flop and c-bet, they flat. I just check/fold the turn after that... blind on blind is so frustrating like that out of position sometimes I just want to fold all non-pair hands in the small its so annoying.

So any advice for opening from the SB? How wide should I be opening at the very least? How about a low PP in the small in this situation?
 
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WiZZiM

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So 75 BBs deep early in a 9 man (or 6 man too), I wake up to AJo in the small and it folds around. I raise on the BB 4x (so to 80 with blinds 10/20 and 1500 chips deep) and they flat. I miss the flop and c-bet, they flat. I just check/fold the turn after that... blind on blind is so frustrating like that out of position sometimes I just want to fold all non-pair hands in the small its so annoying.

So any advice for opening from the SB? How wide should I be opening at the very least? How about a low PP in the small in this situation?


two things you can experiment with.

1. raise smaller preflop and on the flop, this allows you to make a relatively cheap turn bet and get them to fold more often. This is because a lot of players now will call bets in position, but will rarely continue to multiple street action without having something.

2. limp more from the sb, this also allows a lot of things to happpen postflop. This is less effective early on like you describe, however in the later game, limping helps to keep SPR really low and a good about of moving space postflop.

As far as range goes, raise as wide as you possibly can, or as wide as the players will generally let you raise. Stealing is less important early in SNG, so the early goal of SNG is to trap bad players into making postflop mistakes, however it can also have the reverse effect with us losing in spots we shouldn't have. So it's much harder to do.

But yeah overall, more and more players know about position and how to use it. So you need to be one step ahead of them and employ strategies to deal with people who are calling with position. You have to be careful with this, as some players are just loose/bad and will call multiple streets often, so it really depends on the players in your game, but this might help you deal with them a bit more.
 
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