KK vs AA correct play

50 / 100 no antes

-fold
-fold
-fold
MP limp 100
-fold
hero bets 400 (holding KK)
-fold
villain reraise to 900
MP folds
hero 4bets to 1600
villain 5 bets to 2800
hero calls
(pot 6899)

flop 3 9 T
villain checks, hero bets 2100, villain rerasies and hero goes all in
villain wins with AA

where should I fold ? when he 5bets I suspect aces but unable to fold, maybe on the flop ? Preflop I have put him on JJ+ AK, I have seen a lot of this plays especially with guys having QQ or AK

thanks

I used to be the guy that would have KK and think my opponent either has AA or has flopped a set, and then I'd fold.

I've learned that, sure, sometimes that happens, but an awful of times, at least at low buy-ins, my opponent has QQ or top pair or AK or some such....or heck, 20% of the time, they have nothing and are bluffing big time.

At least at low buy-ins, my experience is that you will win more by standing by your KK than not. I used to be too scared for that, but I'm learning otherwise. It's crazy the stuff people go all-in with.

After check-raise by villain on this flop what the hand do you wanna see in 5bet pot? AK will never play this line. Jacks and Queens sometimes playing 5bet-push, sometimes 3bet-call.

I mean it's KK vs AA..the money's gonna get in on any flop without an Ace on it. It's a cooler. After he limps and re-raises you twice preflop, you might be able to get away from it because the only hands that are limping and then 5betting are AA, KK, QQ. But like AJantwan said, if you always fold in these spots, you are losing money, and will become easily exploitable.

It's a cooler. no matter how you play, the result is the same.
You could only be saved by a flop with A

Wanted to make similar thread. I'm not sure how to play KK and QQ on early stage of tournament. I've lost two times on partypoker $22 tickets, KK vs AA, and don't know should I fold KK. I feel it's anyway bad idea. Bet high on preflop to eliminate random players and then continue very high betting on the flop. Maybe play safely if there's an Ace on the table and that's all, is it right?

If you suspectd aces then you were waiting a K. It did not appear. These happen! You could get a K and win. We see many things all the time!

All-in

I will try to get it all-in every time with KK unless I am on the tournament bubble.

I would not give up on this model that was described, you played it right unfortunately it gave the bad luck of the villain this with the bigger pair of the game

I have similar situations in cash, the villain with AA, QQ, and even JJ, you have to risk to win in poker, or lose.

there is a correct way? lol

Rufun2 said:

there is a correct way? lol

Click to expand...

Looking back there always is, in this case: fold KK.
But, for me hero did nothing wrong here, it's just a cooler, hopefully villain only has QQ next time.

its going all in any way so relax

Played it correctly he could've had QQ'S JJ'S A10S 10K
Maybe he had AQ AK for you know...

With that flop you never fold and the pot size you also never fold
You played it correct. Just to bad he had AA this time.

Your only chance to get away from it is preflop, but most likely you can't get away. What in that flop are you afraid of with KK? 5 betting 10 10 or 9 9? There is zero chance the leader changed on that flop. With KK I'm either 6 betting allin preflop or folding. I don't see there being much to gain by seeing a flop against a hand that is very likely AA, unless you're willing to call and then fold any flop that doesn't include a K. QQ is probably calling both preflop and postflop, and you let AK off the hook by calling as he can get away after the flop.

The likelihood that opponent's AA will fly against your kings 3.8518%. Do not worry much about it.

Its just pure bad luck
In a cash game 5-10,

I happened to be in a hand holding JJ.
Raised preflop to 75 and got called (rest folded).
Flop AJ5 os
My call first, i bet 125 and got called.
Turn 9, I called 250 all in.
Got called showing AA.
End of my game that night.

Here's how you play this hand

UTG - Fold
UTG1 - Fold
MP - Fold
Low J - $100 Limp
High J - Fold
Cutoff (Hero) - $400 Open
Button - Fold
SB (Villain) - $900 3-bet
BB - Fold
Low J - Fold
(Hero) - $2700 4-bet or ALL-IN
(Villain) - 5-bet or ALL-IN
(Hero) - ALL-IN

If villain doesn't fold to your 4-bet, the only option is all-in. You have KK and there's only one hand that beats you.

The only time you're folding KK in a spot like this is when you're on the bubble and villain has a larger stack than you. The value of your chips is equal to the min money at the very least. There's also people in the tourney with smaller stacks than you.

for starters lets just put this one simple, you have put 50% of your stack in the pot before seeing a flop, you have given brief idea's that people at that level have been doing stuff like that with less then A A
you have no real info on the villain
so in my eyes, no matter what the flop turns out you cant let it go, your not set mining as I said too much is in pre for that, as a result you literally cant fold to any flop at this point so now you have to wonder why you didn't RR allin by the end
maybe, just maybe bet sizing was an issue here...…..

I can only base this on the way it looks but
you are In position, you are also early in a tournament, you get 1 limper and you 4x raise from the BB, this would seem like a standard play if the limper wasn't involved as he would have to tighten up in a multiway pot.
he actually doubles your pot without even knowing if the other player is sticking around, at this point you can start to build a picture, if you had called at this point you could theoretically have only lost 1800 as he check raises you on the flop, and that is only if you believe that your beat, any other time its going all in at some point

The main points I would take away from this moment is, you should ask yourself "should you be so aggressive with your kings, if the answer is yes cus most of the time you beat the hand range, then this is just a tournament you was never going to survive, ie… what people are calling a cooler
however if you hadn't taken the super aggressive approach its possible you could have gotten away, but not always, and that is a different play style altogether.

But only you can answer whether or not your making money with these hands in the long run, and if your not I am gonna put a gamble on that you play them aggressive quite often, and sometimes depending on the time of the tournament its not always worth it.

Just a cooler, he could have AK to QQ in his range. Wouldn't play it any different.

Technically I'd like to know every player's stack size, any read on villain to this point, and what the size and buy-in of the tourney is to decide the right play. But if this is anywhere in the micros that I frequent, I think you played it fine. I'm alway happy to get all-in pre-flop with KK as I'm often called by QQ, AK, even JJ and sometimes AQo. So folding KK pre-flop is too tight. If I knew the stack sizes I might say you or villain should have been all-in at a slightly different spot than you were but it' doesn't really matter - I think you just had to lose a big pot here unless you hit a K on the flop.

Viper ChipIt said:

Just a cooler, he could have AK to QQ in his range. Wouldn't play it any different.

Click to expand...

^ This

Villain could also have TT pre-flop, depending on stakes, the stack size, and the stage of the tournament. This is where the gambling part of poker comes into play. You have no control over it, there is no "correct way" to play it. Move on, think long term.

Jankou36 said:

Wanted to make similar thread. I'm not sure how to play KK and QQ on early stage of tournament. I've lost two times on partypoker $22 tickets, KK vs AA, and don't know should I fold KK. I feel it's anyway bad idea. Bet high on preflop to eliminate random players and then continue very high betting on the flop. Maybe play safely if there's an Ace on the table and that's all, is it right?

Click to expand...

read this article:

https://www.pokernews.com/strategy/esfandari-and-the-folding-pocket-kings-preflop-puzzle-28765.htm

James24543 said:

read this article:

https://www.pokernews.com/strategy/esfandari-and-the-folding-pocket-kings-preflop-puzzle-28765.htm

Click to expand...

Interesting literature thanks.

this 3bet>4bet>6bet>6bet>7bet... - no . just no.
You raise you get reaside - you meither shove if you shallow or op is good for caaling liught or you you flast if you are too deep.
I would say PRF is were you could have folede. Flop check rerase with PRF 4 bet indicates some strong holding so it's unlikely its JJ-, you are either against a set or KK-AA(no1 will play QQ ike that) and there ar eless KK than sets.
BTW. Op played AA like sh*t