Hyper-Turbo Sngs

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Fanch

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hey CCers! Just wondering what your alls thoughts are on hyper turbo sngs, such as those on merge 300 chips and 3 minute levels. Also 6 max? Any strategy? Ty!
 
Aleksei

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In a vacuum, open-jam any two Broadway and any PP. If you're in a laggy game (standard), merge your range by adding Ax and K8/Q8/J8. If you're in a tight game (uncommon), polarize your range to AT+, Axs (the most marginal hands in this range but you're mostly relying on the Ace blocker adding fold equity), suited Broadways, PPs, and then suited connectors 54 and up. The objective at all times is to avoid domination as much as possible.

Call ship with more or less the same range as you ship yourself (possibly just narrow it to ATB and PPs if it makes you feel safer) vs lags, and call ship almost none at all vs nits and passive sations that call a lot but never bet (I could call with TT+/AT+/KQ, but depending on how nitty they are I might honestly just call with QQ/AK).

You can probably get away with playing shovebot to the end, but I like getting fancy towards the end when I usually have about 20-ish BB and some maneuvering room. At the bubble they get REALLY nitty very often to where you could just minraise steal a ton, and even see flops if it strikes your fancy. By the flop, however, you almost always have to make a decision -- jam or give up. If the board missed my villain's range or his range is so wide it misses every flop often, I often jam exploitatively because they're almost never gonna call two overs where they might have called two random Broadways preflop, and I just gave myself some extra $$$ to take down.

And most importantly, NEVER play with junk no matter how bad your opponents are. The worst hands you can get away with having usually are ragged Kings because they have high-card value (I almost never bother with any K rag lower than like K7 though).
 
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RamdeeBen

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Never played the merge games, how many bb's are you starting with? I only really play the stars games which start as 25bb.

6max hyper though; in general you want to just play a solid tight game early rounds, players are so bad at the low limits you don't need to do anything creative. Learn some basic push/fold and then distinguish the fish to the regs. You should be able to manage that within the first few orbits. Once you have done that; you can then adjust your shove/calling ranges per player.

Example; Calling lighter vs regs who are going to be shoving really wide. Call tighter vs the fish players as they are going to be shoving for more value in general.
 
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BomTombadil

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If you play these a lot do yourself a favor and buy the book Kill Everyone. It's got a chart (several pages of charts actually) that tells you what hands you can unexploitably shove from each position. There's also a chart what hands you can call off with from each position. If you simply follow the charts you'll be playing perfect push-bot strategy which is pretty much what you want for these hyper-turbos. They have huge variance, but there's enough really bad play that they can be quite profitable. If you get a good feel for push-bot strategy it's really helpful for a lot of sng and tournament situations too.
 
Aleksei

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If you play these a lot do yourself a favor and buy the book Kill Everyone. It's got a chart (several pages of charts actually) that tells you what hands you can unexploitably shove from each position. There's also a chart what hands you can call off with from each position. If you simply follow the charts you'll be playing perfect push-bot strategy which is pretty much what you want for these hyper-turbos. They have huge variance, but there's enough really bad play that they can be quite profitable. If you get a good feel for push-bot strategy it's really helpful for a lot of sng and tournament situations too.
Pfft, why do I want an unexploitable strategy if no one's gonna exploit me? I use an exploitative strategy for these.
 
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Moeller_Br

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my strategy to this kind of Tourney is...shove,shove,shove with any Ace high...
and give any rebuys i can...
cuz you'll need get a deep stack to survive ...
i think its so hard to get...
but its good to try... sat for sunday million..is great...can get a great money
 
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These games are pure gambol. Your decisions are mostly based on stack sizes, position. Don't play these if you cant handle bad beats
 
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RamdeeBen

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These games are pure gambol. Your decisions are mostly based on stack sizes, position. Don't play these if you cant handle bad beats


This is what makes them very profitable for people who know what they are doing, by playing people like you who think hypers are pure gambol. You're so far off.

Playing 1000's upon 1000's of these quite quickly; against a fish you can get a 5% roi. Now do the maths and you'll see how "pure gambol" is way off :)
 
hadi

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Hi guys,Any one can say me what is difrence of 2x turbo and 3x turbo?
 
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Henreiman

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Hyper turbos at merge can be profitable if played in massive quantities, but are generally just variance adjustors
 
Abedin120

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No strategy there, it's only a luck. Usually I wait high card and go all-in but there is a case when I lose against lower card like 2-3.
 
Propane Goat

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I've been playing quite a few of these 11 cent hypers on Carbon and have actually been doing better in those lately than on Funsteps. I used to think these were a waste of time until very recently but if you get to HU and know a little basic strategy you can win more often than not because villain's HU play at these stakes is often completely clueless. In the last one I played, the villain folded the button 7 times in a row, of course when he finally raised with something it was an easy fold because it was so obvious that he was waiting for a premium hand. Since you start with such a small stack there's not a lot of room for anything other than shove or fold unless you are the chip leader by a good margin. It seems like these can be a good way to get a lot of short-handed and HU experience without costing a fortune.
 
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This is what makes them very profitable for people who know what they are doing, by playing people like you who think hypers are pure gambol. You're so far off.

Playing 1000's upon 1000's of these quite quickly; against a fish you can get a 5% roi. Now do the maths and you'll see how "pure gambol" is way off :)
You make it sound easy. You would need a huge bankroll to reach the RB tier you need to make profit on top of the 100 buy in downswings you encounter. You can't just adjust in these games to there range, You need to make them adjust to you range. If you dont play a hand in first 12 hands, your under 4 big blinds. J8s on button in a unopened pot=Shove=gambol. You cant just adjust to there range. Fish will tilt very quickly in these and there gameplay is constitntly changing and Regs are just EV grinders who don't puch much thought into hand range.
 
Aleksei

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You make it sound easy. You would need a huge bankroll to reach the RB tier you need to make profit on top of the 100 buy in downswings you encounter. You can't just adjust in these games to there range, You need to make them adjust to you range. If you dont play a hand in first 12 hands, your under 4 big blinds. J8s on button in a unopened pot=Shove=gambol. You cant just adjust to there range. Fish will tilt very quickly in these and there gameplay is constitntly changing and Regs are just EV grinders who don't puch much thought into hand range.
1) J8s is a decently high-value hand HU because you're blinded every hand and people will have call you with fairly worse (and if they don't you'll be taaking their blinds often enough it won't matter). It isn't really that much of a "gambol."
2) in a 6max hyper you really only have to play one hand per orbit, so just limit your shove range to ATB in loose games and you're golden. No "gambol."

Seriously, hypers are fun, they ARE more than just pure luck, and they're not really that hard to consistently beat.
 
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So Aleksei, u would advise simply shoving any pair or at is a multi tabling strategy for these that simple?
 
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Fanch

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So Aleksei any pp or atb is it that simple to multi table these hyper turbos?
 
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These games are fairly solved. Google hand charts/shoving ranges. In general, in EP they are going to be tighter than you think and in LP they are way wider than you think.
 
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not really much strategy invloved in those things... push or fold is the way to go... the way its set up... it just leaves so much room for luck to play a big part of. cause even if you limp in... well great... no you only got 8 blunds left... push or fold. push or fold. push or fold..
 
aa88wildbill

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Like most of my fellow club members think, it's a crapshoot. You're either push are fold not much tragedy there. I think why some people like playing hyper turbo sngs is because they don't have a lot of time/patients, or they are lacking skill, or any combination of; time, patience, skill.
 
Aleksei

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So Aleksei any pp or atb is it that simple to multi table these hyper turbos?
I never play more than 2 tables on these because they're really really fast and it gets slightly more complicated when you're down to 3 players and you all have a more defensible M (15-20 or whatever), but yeah basically.
 
italiano

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I play a lot hyper-turbo HU but unfortunately I lose demasiadono know why! quiezas fish is because I am or not! the truth is that it makes me sad that I'm gone bad
 
TeUnit

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not all luck, they are all math
icm, nash, sage, pot odds, etc, etc

i think u guys think there is a large luck component because of the typically low levels of roi associated with the format, but the low rois do lead to a great deal of variance
 
olliejjc16

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hi I have a question for 6 man hyper regs, what do you think of the six man hyper sattelites on Stars, I've been playing the 1.50 sattelites to the Big 4.40 and I've noticed that the play on them is really bad. Would it be possible to grind these and show decent profit? Would there be worse players in these than normal 6 man hyper sngs?
 
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