ok pokerbuds i got ajs deep in a tourney and i flop the nut flush but to my suprise after the raise there are 4 callers the flop hits and i'm first to act WHAT DO I DO??? shove or check raise
1. If you have a really strong hand and you believe nobody will beat you, than try to make them believe you have a weak hand. Act like you are afraid of possible flush. And more likely they will get trapped.
2. If you have a weak hand, try to make your opponents believe in the opposite. Unless they have nuts, they will fold.
In your specific case, I will check the flop if I am the first one to act.
Shove or check raise? OMG, Why not bet? Do you really think a guy who flopped two pair or a set on a 3-flush board will bet out and risk getting blown off making a possible full by a check-raise he has to fold to? Not likely! So you might just check one guy into a full house!! Yet, by betting out (a reasonable amount and one which you would normally make, such as a 1/3 pot Cbet) what are you going to get called by? Two pair, a set, or a smaller flush. It's such an obvious board. Tough to get value from weaker hands here anyway - easy to check someone into the nuts tho, isn't it? Therefore checking is the worst one of all!
So, these hands might call a reasonable flop bet. Ideally you isolate one guy with a set or smaller flush and extract the maximum you can by the end. If the board has paired by the turn or river, you need to exercise pot control. If he has a set/flush he may call a reasonable turn bet. Pray for an aggressive loon with a smaller flush.
Now, when you bet and get called and the turn does not pair the board, it's no longer "reasonable" bet time - you do not want to give him good odds to make a full so you bet really big - like more than the pot maybe. If he calls and the board does not pair on the river, I'd sell my hand for whatever I think the guy would call. If it does pair however, your in a tough spot. Hopefully you got em covered and he has so few chips left his shove gives you the pot odds to call.
Your "solution" does not take into account sizes of stacks and what type of players are the opponents. Also you are totally ignoring the probabilities of crashing into full house with Ace high flush. I did say to look at the board and see if two pair/sets are likely given the preflop actionBut even if someone has set or two pairs, and is waiting for full-house, most likely you will be called after your "genius bet".Yes, and they are going to have to make it, aren't they? So if they call and do not, you win that bet. You check you get - wait for it - ZERO! And what you do if the turn comes paired card? The opponents may think you were bluffing a "flush" if you check the turn, and attack, while you will be confused without any opinion what cards they have Only if you checked the nuts on the flop!. So what you gonna do? FOLD? or JUST CALLING What do you think pot control is? to showdown? What is the logic of convincing opponents that you have something really strong when you really have nuts in your pocket? The "Logic" is getting heads up with a worse hand that is going to have to improve. Checking gets zero value unless they bet. And even then...
ok pokerbuds i got ajs deep in a tourney and i flop the nut flush but to my suprise after the raise there are 4 callers the flop hits and i'm first to act WHAT DO I DO??? shove or check raise
ok pokerbuds i got ajs deep in a tourney and i flop the nut flush but to my suprise after the raise there are 4 callers the flop hits and i'm first to act WHAT DO I DO??? shove or check raise
I was reminded if this thread yesterday at a table. I raise AdQd UTG and get 6(yes 6!) callers! Flop comes 6d7d9d. Yay! The almost nuts! Pot is 15 bbs so I decide to lead out for 4bbs. I get 3 callers.
Turn is Ts putting a 4card straight on the board. Pot is 27bbs so I lead out for 9bbs. Next player jams next player folds and 3rd player rejams. I call and I'm facing 6c8d for a made straight with a straight flush redraw and the other player has 8cTd for a bigger straight and he thinks he has the straight flush redraw, but actually his 8d is dead. So I just had to dodge the 5d and the river was a brick so I more than tripled up this hand.
Just confirms my belief that betting out builds a pot and wins you more chips when they have something, and if they have nothing betting out doesn't really cost you anything.