Help with C-bet

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stg1969

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Hi everyone...

Firstly, I know there are gonna be a lot of you that say, give us specific hand history, but i'm just looking for some general advice really.

Basically, its said that someone will only hit the flop 30% of the time, so if you consistently c-bet, this will be a big +EV situation.

I'm not dissagreeing or anything, but it can't be that simple..the games I play, people call a c-bet more than 50% of the time... then it gives me a harder decision on the turn, or ive just burned money.

Im just looking for ANY advice really, no matter how simple you may think it is.. I mean, c-betting OOP cant be the same for example.

If i give one sample...that i find a tricky situation, then perhaps it will help

6 Handed, SnG, average chips stacks...blinds 50/100 (stacks around 10k)

Im dealt A/10 clubs in the cutoff... its folded to me and I decide to raise to 400

Button calls, sb folds, BB calls (i mean cmon, at $6 sng the BB has to defend regardless, its the law :D )
So theres 1250 in the pot and the flop comes Kh 9d 3c
BB checks, i bet 750 and the button calls..BB folds.

OK...so what does this mean to you, cos i see this every single day in $6 sng
I'm now not even sure at this stage what I want to see on the turn regardles.

In my world, it tells me that im beat..there's no flush or straight draws on board.

If the guy has AK he could flat here, but would you? Why give someone a chance to catch up, i'd be raising with AK to either take down the pot, or get an answer.

If the guy has AA its also a dangerous flat call...KK is a little safer i guess.

He cant be bluffing, because you dont flat call with a bluff, which i guess means he could be floating to build the pot, knowing he's going to shove on another street, but again, thats dangerous considering my pre flop raise and c-bet.

So is he chasing????

So many questions..

Anyone wanna take a guess what happened next (just for fun)?
 
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Durrin

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He could have anything. A have also noticed that A LOT of people are glued to their hand, what ever it is pocket deuce or an inside straight draw.

But in this situation i would probably bet again on turn depending on how your opponent have played previously.
 
OMGITSOVER9K

OMGITSOVER9K

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raise pre is too big, flop bet is too big.

if they call 50% of the time and you bet half pot then its neutral ev right?

if they fold to 600, why bet 750? saves you money when you get called in spots like this.

on such a dry board I don't wanna barrel here unless you know he floats a lot or calls with underpairs in these spots.. what could he be chasing?

if you barrel the turn you're repping Kx + AA/KK imo, but I think check-folding is the best line since he's not gonna fold the stronger part of his range on many turns, and probably not the weaker part if the turn's a brick.

also we like to see HH's so we can know stack sizes, that's a major influence.
 
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stg1969

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raise pre is too big, flop bet is too big.
also we like to see HH's so we can know stack sizes, that's a major influence.

Too big pre flop? Do you play SnG's or cash... if you raise less than that, everybody calls, lol....
Dunno if i still have the HH to hand, but this is literally in the first half dozen hands, stacks between 9.5k and 10.5k all round, no one short, no real history of the villain.
 
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stg1969

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Well...this is what happened next..

Turn card is the Q clubs...
I check (simply because of his calling my cbet, i realise that this is like giving up the pot)..

He bets 2000 into what was a 2750 pot.. I fold..

Villain kindly shows J/10 spades.... class

So he's called a 2/3 pot sized bet with a gutshot..

I cant see that ive done anything wrong here, other than get caught by a chaser..

This is not a moan about a bad beat, its standard i know, but was i right to cbet?
 
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kanselau

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depending on my opponent ill usually only fire a second barrel if i pick up some sort of hand on the turn , for example when holding A10 a Q on the turn will give me a gut shot , turning my second barrel into a semi bluff. then sometimes check/call if i hit top pair on the turn alowing my oponent to bet for me if he floats the flop alot , all this ofcorse i will mix up to stay unpridictable.
everyone knows these days that cbets are ev+ when not abused so this is why , alot of the good players especialy in position will peel your cbets , you have to be prepared to fire a second bullet more often in todays agressive trend IMO .
probably most important for me is to cbet more with position and alittle less oop

Whats also important if we should continue after we get flated on the flop is the texture of the flop , if there are draws then our opponent is likelly flatting with a draw , or middle or bottom pair. so if turn completes a possible straight or flush be selective if you should continue in the hand or not . some times represent the flush or straight and get tp small kicker or bottom pair to fold depending on your read.
I think cbets go well together with a plan , dont just assume that if your opponent calls your cbet your beaten and have to fold. sometimes you will be behind but that doesnt mean you cannot win the hand.
My advice is cbet eveluate on the turn if called , if raised im continuing only if i have a hand or draw on flop. Plan your cbets around your opponent and his tendencies. If he calls your cbets often with half pot bets but folds to pot bets then adjust to this , if your oponent plays fit or fold poker a third of the pot will be enough to get him of the hand if hes missed and you have also.
Hi everyone...

Firstly, I know there are gonna be a lot of you that say, give us specific hand history, but i'm just looking for some general advice really.

Basically, its said that someone will only hit the flop 30% of the time, so if you consistently c-bet, this will be a big +EV situation.

I'm not dissagreeing or anything, but it can't be that simple..the games I play, people call a c-bet more than 50% of the time... then it gives me a harder decision on the turn, or ive just burned money.

Im just looking for ANY advice really, no matter how simple you may think it is.. I mean, c-betting OOP cant be the same for example.

If i give one sample...that i find a tricky situation, then perhaps it will help

6 Handed, SnG, average chips stacks...blinds 50/100 (stacks around 10k)

Im dealt A/10 clubs in the cutoff... its folded to me and I decide to raise to 400

Button calls, sb folds, BB calls (i mean cmon, at $6 sng the BB has to defend regardless, its the law :D )
So theres 1250 in the pot and the flop comes Kh 9d 3c
BB checks, i bet 750 and the button calls..BB folds.

OK...so what does this mean to you, cos i see this every single day in $6 sng
I'm now not even sure at this stage what I want to see on the turn regardles.

In my world, it tells me that im beat..there's no flush or straight draws on board.

If the guy has AK he could flat here, but would you? Why give someone a chance to catch up, i'd be raising with AK to either take down the pot, or get an answer.

If the guy has AA its also a dangerous flat call...KK is a little safer i guess.

He cant be bluffing, because you dont flat call with a bluff, which i guess means he could be floating to build the pot, knowing he's going to shove on another street, but again, thats dangerous considering my pre flop raise and c-bet.

So is he chasing????

So many questions..

Anyone wanna take a guess what happened next (just for fun)?
 
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kanselau

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standard play , your oponent has a gutshot on the flop and calls your cbet , firstly hes calling because he has a draw and has implied odds if you have AK , secondly hes calling because just because you bet doesnt mean you have a hand ,and he believes you will check the turn and hes going to get a second free card, to hit his draw. third he could have won the hand with 72 when the Q turned because you gave up on the hand anyway.
Cbets are a part of a good strategy and you were right to cbet , it just turned out that it didnt work this time .
Well...this is what happened next..

Turn card is the Q clubs...
I check (simply because of his calling my cbet, i realise that this is like giving up the pot)..

He bets 2000 into what was a 2750 pot.. I fold..

Villain kindly shows J/10 spades.... class

So he's called a 2/3 pot sized bet with a gutshot..

I cant see that ive done anything wrong here, other than get caught by a chaser..

This is not a moan about a bad beat, its standard i know, but was i right to cbet?
 
OMGITSOVER9K

OMGITSOVER9K

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you picked up probably one of the better cards in the deck to barrel and you check folded?

players are bad but you not betting there is a big leak 100bb deep.

bet/fold > check/fold imo

also implied odds? really?

edit: no hate on OP, just bet there if he has JT he has it, you still got outs.
 
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stg1969

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Thanks....thats fair enough...im always learning...
 
sam1chips

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its tough to give a general answer, because every hand is different. one of things i've noticed (generally) is after i raise pre-flop and then don't hit the flop, you show a lot of weakness if you don't give a continuation bet after flop.
 
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GWU73

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People "will call." Inexpansive sit n go's are notoriouse for bad players. Just bet your big hands against the bad players because they will not believe you. Consider betting more pre flop with big hands; yes it is transparent, but they will not believe you or care. I routinely got calls betting 10-20 bb pre flop with my big hands. Decide on or before the flop if you are willing to stack off and follow your plan. When you get near the bubble you should be able to revert to your regular poker strategy and bet sizing. In cash games I have found that about 2/3 of my c bets are successful (.6 to .8 of pot bet) and if the flop is raggady a 2nd barrell often works - just not against that guy who only stays in with good hands (nits, and other weak tight players)
 
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