Fantastic value move when in position, Does anyone use this to get payed off?

C

cotta777

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Ok so this move I stack alot of players and get a hell of alot of value from it.
when we're in position We C-bet the flop against a pretty decent thinking player, we're in say late position raising standard 2.5 to 3 , we C-bet the Flop with either Top pair, or even middle pair if opponents range is wide enough to maintain a profitable advantage.
So Villain floats our C-bet on the Flop we know we are pretty much ahead most of the time, hes floating range can conclude, draws, medium and low pairs a weak ace since a 3-bet OOP is more standard than flatting with Ace Broad. and maybe broadways, suited specs.
We Check back the turn so to speak we are shutting down after the failed Stab at the pot.
having position villain is now first to act on the river, Either a blank comes down and villain feels he can push us off by pricing us out of the pot or like an Ace comes down or a card that completely doesn't add up his pre and post flop play.
He takes the bluff attempt, average around two thirds of the pot if he's playing optimal reg style.
we then re-raise him for the min amount.
This really baffles alot of players, because they see in almost all cases the shut down on the turn is a failed steal or a sign of weakness..
most players call since they are committed and our play doesn't add up, and the logical explanation is he is trying it on because he thinks I am weak because I haven't showed aggression throughout the hand.
Some guys will even go all in.. But in almost all cases you get that extra call which is the min raise to his river bet.
Works a treat for me especially in tournaments where tables break fast and players dont analyse your game
 
Jacki Burkhart

Jacki Burkhart

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I frequently employ a similar tactic with my top pair good kicker type hands, or when I have a strong pocket pair like JJ and only 1 overcard flops like a Q.

This simultaneously pot controls, while gaining us value when villain bluffs.

Where I question your play, is your river play. I don't know why you would raise any amount in position on the river with a marginal hand unless you are trying to bluff out a better hand. If you are bluffing that is fine...but if you think he is bluffing, then just flat call and bluff catch. This limits your losses for the times you are just wrong, or in the times that you were right, but then he sucked out on the river.

The other problem with raising the river is, even when you are correct that he is bluffing, the raise gives you almost no extra value since most bluffs will fold at this point. So it's all risk with little to no reward.

The third problem is that if you raise the river when you think he is bluffing and he smells weakness and re-bluffs YOU!! Now what?? you'll be sick with yourself if he puts you to the test for all your chips...you'll be cursing "Why oh why didn't I just flat call with 2nd pair?" It's a pretty big mistake, IMO to raise without a good clear reason on the river, as it can cost you the entire pot. Instead of raking in a nice 1,000 or so pot, you now lose 2,000.
 
Arjonius

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Sure, this line sometimes works as stated to gain you some value. But there's no free lunch. You're only looking at situations where the opponent bluffs the river. But how do you know he's going to when you check back the turn?

You don't. So, you can't evaluate the line based just on the times he does bluff. This means that in addition to what missjacki said, there can be other downsides. For instance, you lose value when
- the free river turns a hand that would have folded to a second barrel into a winner,
- he would have check-called a turn bet, say with a draw, but now check-folds the river instead of bluffing,
- he would have check-called both the turn and the river with some middling hand, but now only check-calls the river,
 
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