Big hole in my game.

Brandon morris · Nov 20, 2017

I keep having the same problem not recognizing early in a tourney when the stacks are still deep a 4 bet preflop when I three bet in good position with usually ak qq or jj and getting smashed by kk or aa any thoughts? Too loose early on? But that early double up helps alot..

wsbar · Nov 20, 2017

I particularly game AA, KK, QQ, AKs, AQs in the same way I play with 88, 77, 66, 87s, 86s, like to play with caution, I don't like to be aggressive pre flop, like to be aggressive post flop. my Noble, I am a player beginner, I am also adjusting my game, I still have much to learn.

bmw13 · Nov 20, 2017

aggressive preflop with premium hands has to be done ... otherwise with what hands you should play aggressive in that spot?

LazerBoy · Nov 20, 2017

You've gotta 3-bet AK, Queens, Jacks in position ... Even early in the tournament. But if stacks are deep and blinds are still small relative to stack sizes, if I get 4 bet jammed on, I will fold it.

Sometimes I will even flat AK, Queens, Jacks in position (very rarely) depending on my opponent. If I know I can outplay him post flop then I will flat sometimes.

But like I said above, I wouldn't be calling 4-bets with those hands early in a tournament. It's generally not worth it to put you tournament life at stake so early, you can put yourself in plenty of better situations to chip up early in a tournament.

I personally play tighter earlier in a tournament until the antes kick in and then I open up my game and aggression.

Middle to late in a tournament when stack sizes are small relative to the blinds, rip it in though.

Acesinthebig · Nov 20, 2017

Are you saying your calling 4bet shoves???? It depends, if you have a gamble early mentality or if you want to see some flops to narrow down the variance. Of course getting it in with JJ vs KK is never good, so if you know you're up against a tighter player facing a 4 bet, there is no shame in folding some monsters.

Brandon morris · Nov 21, 2017

I don't think it's a shove I dono I'm still new let me try to explain. Early in Mtts say blinds are 40 80 . Early position raise to 160 folds to me I either have jj,qq,ak,or aq always .. so I reraise with position an top ten hand of course maybe like 400 he makes it 800 i still call flop looks safe we both shove and I inevitably run into kk or aa.of course early in a tourney u want cheap flops but qq or ak suited on the button always feels so powerful to me hard to fold it to the 4 bet I guess it's called ? Any tips?

Brandon morris · Nov 21, 2017

LazerBoy said:
You've gotta 3-bet AK, Queens, Jacks in position ... Even early in the tournament. But if stacks are deep and blinds are still small relative to stack sizes, if I get 4 bet jammed on, I will fold it.

Sometimes I will even flat AK, Queens, Jacks in position (very rarely) depending on my opponent. If I know I can outplay him post flop then I will flat sometimes.

But like I said above, I wouldn't be calling 4-bets with those hands early in a tournament. It's generally not worth it to put you tournament life at stake so early, you can put yourself in plenty of better situations to chip up early in a tournament.

I personally play tighter earlier in a tournament until the antes kick in and then I open up my game and aggression.

Middle to late in a tournament when stack sizes are small relative to the blinds, rip it in though.

U really fold ur jj or qq or ak suited in position preflopo to the 4bet? It's just so hard for me to do i dono why I out so much more value to a hand when I'm on the button it's just so easy to maneuver i guess I'm getting to invested in any one hand just throw it away huh?I'll give it a try I've heard stories of people folding their kk preflop when they just know they other guys got aa I could never do it yet haha any of u guys ever fold kk when u feel a fishy feeling ur up against the dreaded aa??

LazerBoy · Nov 21, 2017

To a 4bet jam yeah I will fold those hands.

I've never folded pocket kings preflop but I have just called a 4bet with the intention of only continuing if I hit a King on the flop (only when I strongly suspect my opponent has Aces). I mean I guess if the flop would come like QJ10, I would continue too..

Now if what you are saying in your example above where you 3bet to 400 and opponent min-4bets to 800. I would call with those hands. But I basically would be looking to hit a set (with the jacks/queens) or flop a huge hand with AKs. If neither of that happens ... I most likely fold even if the flop looks safe because, in my opinion, you are going to be up against AA/KK so many times. Not all the time but a good amount of time.

AMTF1988 · Nov 21, 2017

I see it so often where someone has high pockets, flop comes with an over and they shove, only to lose.

On topic, there's not really much you can do if someone has a over pair, see a flop and play if you have a set, but even that can be beaten.

playinggameswithu · Nov 21, 2017

The chips are worthless but your tournament life is still at risk at the beginning of a tournament. Enter the tournament with 40 BB you won't regret it. There is a reason why the pro's show up late to tournaments.

Ryan Nelson · Nov 21, 2017

Brandon morris said:
U really fold ur jj or qq or ak suited in position preflopo to the 4bet? It's just so hard for me to do i dono why I out so much more value to a hand when I'm on the button it's just so easy to maneuver i guess I'm getting to invested in any one hand just throw it away huh?I'll give it a try I've heard stories of people folding their kk preflop when they just know they other guys got aa I could never do it yet haha any of u guys ever fold kk when u feel a fishy feeling ur up against the dreaded aa??

Dreaded aa HAH!, i have lost more times on pocket rockets than won.

Anatoliy Tolik · Nov 22, 2017

The flop is supposed to look at 3-5 bbs, in order to squeeze the swaval, excess aggression can lead to a loss, and at best, you will win less because few will answer. So try to look at the flop postis start

Andrei Korolev · Nov 22, 2017

In the early stages of the tournament raise or reraise not help,I was convinced.Since the blinds are small and everyone can see the flop for cheap...

karl coakley · Nov 23, 2017

bmw13 said:
aggressive preflop with premium hands has to be done ... otherwise with what hands you should play aggressive in that spot?

I really don't think the range of AK, QQ, or JJ is truly a "premium hand". With these kinds of hands you are really looking at something close to a coin flip. When you get 4 bet it would really slow me down. I would specifically be looking where I would be vs AA or KK on the flop. If I didn't hammer the flop I'd most likely let it go.

I think the OP just overplayed his hands....

pr0serbian · Nov 23, 2017

Early in the game,i just call witk AK out of position and if A or K doesnt hit flop or some big drew,and my opponent continue aggression will lay down my hand most likely(maybe call 1 small bet on low dry flop).With AA or KK i always try to get it all in preflop,with QQ also but if 2 playes or more jamed after 3bet before me most likely i would fold.

neafana · Nov 24, 2017

I think you have to play this hands, more carefully, in the beginning.

If you play against tight guys, you have to fold AKo; AQs. I think you will lose in the long run.

When you are against active players, in the long run you will win, but you will have to realize that, 40% of the time you will be eliminated from the tournament.

You have to decide if a big stack, in the early levels, will help you. If not I think you will have to fold more and be tighter in the beginning.

eidikos · Nov 24, 2017

hi!
my opinion is to be aggressive there,especially in small buy in tournaments
heve in mind that you aim in final table and to get there you have to win some big hands.so push with such good hands!

Amanda A · Nov 25, 2017

I think it depends on the tourney, if it is a micro rebuy I'm happy to get it all in with AK pre flop. People shove with a pretty big range so most of the time your not that much of an underdog and a double up is sweet and actually maybe even necessary I would say.

deform fedot · Nov 25, 2017

Are you playing aggressively or tightly? I think that a tricky image game can be implemented here. If the opponent is sufficiently studied and you consider him a labor player, it will be easier for him to beat him through aggression, and of course, the order of cards on the table should take place. Good luck!

Vorem · Dec 5, 2017

My opinion is that the game with AK QQ JJ in the early stage should be very aggressive. because very many people want to see the flop cheaply

Big hole in my game.

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