Best strategy for overly tight final table with med to short stack

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rule72

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This seems to be a growing problem for me in a live MTT. (Reason for registering today at cardschat). The following is the latest example of what's been happening the last couple months: $65 no limit, reentry, 10k in chip to start. Payout is for the top five. At beginning of final table a total of 470K chips in play, I'm med stack and two biggest stacks on my immediate left. After an hour at the final table still 10 players. Biggest stack is my immediate right (165k), second biggest is 2nd to my left, I'm 5th stack at 40k and 10th stack is 25k. Blinds are 8k/16k, no antes, I'm close to being the most aggressive player push/folding medium strength hands since the previous level. My playing style is Harrington/Sklansky with adjustments depending on the villain's style.

In the past those short stacks used to give up sooner now they seem happy to blind into the cash if they can, like 3-5 big blinds with anything just before they're back into the blinds. Typically with 5 smaller stacks I'd be tighter.

Two questions: Is my more aggressive strategy correct even though there are five smaller stacks? Second, we did a ten way equal chop and I got 25% more than 5th place pays, is that a good deal for me or should I pass on the chop? I think it was a good deal.
 
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mrbond8844

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when it comes to your situation i would have tried baiting them more rather than go aggressive if its that tight
 
SuzdalDEcor

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the best strategy of the game it is poker which will be awkward for rivals :)
 
fortopyan

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best strategy on final table Tight agressive . in hads-up loose agressive, on my opinion:rolleyes:
 
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tjc123

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Hello my voice capture thing is working alright on the final table I like the play very tight and bet very light of course unless you flopped the nuts completely nuts I mean there is Blind versus blind spots so you can take advantage of and a few other moves you can make but a final table . With a mid stack... tight is right
 
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tjc123

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chop?

It all depends on your poker skill if you're very confident in your skills even with 10 big blinds you could have a good shot at winning it if time constraints are an issue that could be something else to think about but if you don't have time issues and you're very confident in your skills chop is the worst thing you can do
 
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rule72

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when it comes to your situation i would have tried baiting them more rather than go aggressive if its that tight

What is meant by baiting? If you're implying slow play or sand bag keep in mind I don't have a big hand and the stack is small.

Thanks everyone for the replys
 
thaysen13

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If the small stacks are the bb limp maeby hit someting and so can you bust them
 
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JPainTrainSicko

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Congrats on the score!!

As far as the even chop, I'd consider icm, or chip chop. That makes a big difference. Even tho your getting better than 5th you may well do better using a different calculation method, it would at least be worth looking at and usually the casino can facilitate the calculations. Another point on that is your skill level vs the field which someone else mentioned also. If you have an edge chopping becomes less appealing unless the $ is significantly better for you.

I was in a very similar situation recently. My play was to stay like you Harrington/sklansky esk. I did take some nice bluff lines on players I knew were tight or reading me as tight. Other than that tag play and going for max value. Being comfortable with a short stack helps a lot in these spots! Play well, Good luck and go get that win!
 
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Matthew tudberry

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Play with less than 3bb raises and less than half pot c bets. Will do the job. Get outta dodge if it doesnt
 
Gh0stL

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I think depend the BB you have and position, but you are Cheapleader you have to be agressive.
 
westside1950

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Definitly try to abuse your opponents weaknesess - doesn't matter if they are big stacks, if they keep playing passive and fold their blind you should be the most aggresive player out there and attack their blinds..
 
Gh0stL

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I think is more effective to be agressive but play with intelligence and careful.
 
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mrbond8844

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ppl say be aggressive but being aggressive will just lose your chips when the other person has a better hand than you, ppl at final tables are there for a reason, theyre not afraid to bet their good hands and if you go aggressive be prepared to lose quick
 
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klickitat

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Final table is all about reading your opponents. If your opponent is overly tight, the make moves on them and steal from them. If you got one that is loose wait for the right time to check raise him. If you have the chips against a short stack, then limp on their bet to encourage more callers so as to put them out. Final table is not about a single strategy, but being fluid in all strategies bases on situations and players.
 
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rule72

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Congrats on the score!!

As far as the even chop, I'd consider icm, or chip chop...
Another point on that is your skill level vs the field which someone else mentioned also...
If you have an edge chopping becomes less appealing unless the $ is significantly better for you...
I looked at a chip chop and I did a little better than that. Our casino's are limited in knowledge on helping to calculate a special chop and usually a player has to both calculate and explain to newbies what we're talking about.

I'd say I was in the top 3 in skill on this final table in the example I gave, but I feel the problem in this situation skill is not much of a factor. At the time of chop I had 2.5 bb's with the blinds getting close to me and the big stack had 10.3 bb's. (470,000 in play, blinds 8k/16k)

The consensus seems to be aggression. So I start pushing a little sooner relative to blind sizes vs stack as soon as I think I've got a more passive final table like the one's I've been facing of late.

I was the most aggressive at the table during the last 20-30 minutes before chopping, but just couldn't land a knockout punch even with the best hand going in.
 
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rule72

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Congrats on the score!!

As far as the even chop, I'd consider icm, or chip chop...
Another point on that is your skill level vs the field which someone else mentioned also...
If you have an edge chopping becomes less appealing unless the $ is significantly better for you...
I looked at a chip chop and I did a little better than that. Our casino's are limited in knowledge on helping to calculate a special chop and usually a player has to both calculate and explain to newbies what we're talking about.

I'd say I was in the top 3 in skill on this final table in the example I gave, but I feel the problem in this situation skill is not much of a factor. At the time of chop I had 2.5 bb's with the blinds getting close to me and the big stack had 10.3 bb's. (470,000 in play, blinds 8k/16k)

The consensus seems to be aggression. So I start pushing a little sooner relative to blind sizes vs stack as soon as I think I've got a more tight-passive final table like the one's I've been facing of late.

I was the most aggressive at the table during the last 20-30 minutes before chopping, but just couldn't land a knockout punch even with the best hand going in.
 
Gh0stL

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I think is important play tight for you can play with bad hands to bluff!!
 
jgreenman18

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I would play tight but when in a hand let people know you will risk all your chips and only give up when you exactly know your beat. The people at the final table should know when you play a hand your whole stack could go in at any time
 
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Chipsteal_jj

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play aggressive for a couple of hands to steal blinds and then play tight for a while. Keep switching up your game again and again and find very tight players on the table and try stealing their blinds.
IMO though if you can, look for a better tournament which has antes and a good blind raise time which suits you. If there are antes then you'll see that people will start risking more instead of just slow playing till they get a good hand.
 
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subdylzep

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I dont think you could have played it any better and you came out basically w the best guarenteed outcoome you could arrive at. I have been in this situation all too often! But you were aggressive when the blinds were less and you did what you could do to try and make the money, at that point with most of you having between 5 - 10 BBs you are basically just playing luck at that point, You could have waited until a few players busted and looked for a better spot to chop, but you never know if thats going to happen or if someone will all of a sudden shoot up in chips and then the offer is off the table and you are the one being blinded out. So i say at the level of blinds you were at and everyone only having 5 - 10 BBs max it was a good place to chop, sucks, but still at least it was something. As for your play, you did exactly what you should do at a tight table, you exploited what you could and kept yourself fighting just a shame you didnt hit or some people didnt bust. If you did continue playing i would have said start to tighten up w just 3 blinds left but you did exactly what you could do. I was in a similar situation last year, 220$ buy in, chip leader w 20 left i had 1/5 the chips, Got to final table and still chip leader. Got to the bubble 5 paid 6 left, and got 2 people all in w a 4-1 fav on them, both hit, then took chances at a 40/60 lost that as well, still had plenty of chips but blinds started getting higher and i had gone from 1st to 3rd in chips w the blinds quickly becoming so high i pushed for a chop, got 1200 which was more than 3rd place money so i considered it a success but so mad i couldnt bust more people on the final table w my large stack, sometimes things just dont go your way and you have to take what is offered. I certainly wasnt going to let my chip lead, some of my best poker, and 10 hours of play go in vein because of some bad luck on a final table when i was ahead so many times, I was walking away w something damnit! lol Gl in the future i think you know what you are doing.
 
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