All in on the flop

dudemanstan

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Your in a pot and flop top pair rag kicker, and your opponent limped in pree flop, and he goes all in on the flop. Your stacks are really close.

Question...... Do you think he is bluffing, and call?


Edit: In general when your opponent goes all in on the flop, Do you think he is probably bluffing?
 
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Zorba

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My first thought is he may have an over pair, and I would consider folding and waiting for a better spot, I'm assuming we are in the BB here.
 
Michael Paler

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Your in a pot and flop top pair rag kicker, and your opponent limped in pree flop, and he goes all in on the flop. Your stacks are really close.

Question...... Do you think he is bluffing, and call?


Edit: In general when your opponent goes all in on the flop, Do you think he is probably bluffing?

My first thought is he may have an over pair, and I would consider folding and waiting for a better spot, I'm assuming we are in the BB here.

Or a better queen (without a rag kicker), or two pair, or a small set...

In an MTT does it matter if he is bluffing? Since you cannot simply rebuy, it makes no difference, IMO. It's not like you can calc out more money won the times you are correct vs times you are wrong, if you have to go all in, just to call that bet. Once you are stacked, you can risk it if you think you have the best hand. Are you willing to risk it all for one weak pair? Even if top pair? He maybe had AK for two overcards with two cards to come. Could have sucked out on you still, you with the best hand at that time.

Questions:

1. Is he the type to shove with air? Or two pair, at the least? And if he shoves with only one pair, which one? Top, middle, bottom, or any one-pair holding (you would be amazed, lol)?

2. Does he puke chips with a set, or slow play it?

3. Is he the type to limp small pairs? Could very well be a set then, with number 2 above.

4. Why on earth are you liming in w q-rag? That's a raise (if in the right spot, repeat; right spot!) or fold. You can make "plays" with any two cards, including Q-rag. Yet once you get called, you are screwed, unless you got the guts to fire more bullets (turn/river). Not many do, unless it's a free roll.

I would not even complete the SB with that garbage. Why not?

You just found out.
 
dudemanstan

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My first thought is he may have an over pair, and I would consider folding and waiting for a better spot, I'm assuming we are in the BB here.

Yes it is BB with J6 ,and flop is J 4 8 rainbow. He had pocket 8's. I guess you can figure what I did :(
 
Zorba

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I was gonna say he may have a set also as it happens all the time, I'm guessing you called, I would personally fold but I am a big nit and wouldn't be risking it with such a weak kicker, it is your tourney life we are talking about, many better spots to risk it all.
 
dudemanstan

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I was gonna say he may have a set also as it happens all the time, I'm guessing you called, I would personally fold but I am a big nit and wouldn't be risking it with such a weak kicker, it is your tourney life we are talking about, many better spots to risk it all.
I agree. I should have let it go there. I have folded in that situation before.
 
Propane Goat

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Unless I can be confident that I'm holding something better than the vast majority of what the villain is shoving with, I'm going to fold. With only top pair and rag I'm going to drop this virtually every time because it's too easy to be outkicked in situations like these.

I have pulled this stunt several times post-flop when I have what I feel is the best hand but it is vulnerable. My thinking is that I want to either force the villain to fold now or to make him pay the maximum to chase his draws if that's what he has. For example, I was in a hand where the big stack limped UTG and everyone else folded to me in the BB. I had 42o and checked, the flop was 472 and I shoved. Villain called with A7o, turn and river were blanks. In this particular hand I happened to be way ahead post-flop, but that certainly won't always be the case.

I don't know if this is a good play over the long run, it may wind up costing more chips than it gains in addition to putting you at risk of being knocked out and just seems like typical donkey play in freerolls. I need to go back through the books with this particular situation in mind and see what advice is given.
 
dudemanstan

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Unless I can be confident that I'm holding something better than the vast majority of what the villain is shoving with, I'm going to fold. With only top pair and rag I'm going to drop this virtually every time because it's too easy to be outkicked in situations like these.

I have pulled this stunt several times post-flop when I have what I feel is the best hand but it is vulnerable. My thinking is that I want to either force the villain to fold now or to make him pay the maximum to chase his draws if that's what he has. For example, I was in a hand where the big stack limped UTG and everyone else folded to me in the BB. I had 42o and checked, the flop was 472 and I shoved. Villain called with A7o, turn and river were blanks. In this particular hand I happened to be way ahead post-flop, but that certainly won't always be the case.

I don't know if this is a good play over the long run, it may wind up costing more chips than it gains in addition to putting you at risk of being knocked out and just seems like typical donkey play in freerolls. I need to go back through the books with this particular situation in mind and see what advice is given.
Yeah I wonder about that situation also. I have shoved on the flop, and got called only to have him river me. I wonder if instead of an all in, if a nice size bet would work better? Maybe he puts you on a stronger hand that way? It depends on the opponent also I guess.:confused:
 
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