Originally Posted by kingmunchers
ok so its only the 5th hand of the MTT
My stack is at max 3000 cus thats how much we start with and its my BB
I am holding Q 10o and its limped all around to me seeing a flop 5 way
the flop then comes K J 2 (there is 2 hearts on the board and a club)
so guy min raises, and another guy raises out there for 120 chips pot would be 240 now, so i felt if i call im going to assume the min raiser isnt trying to buy the pot with a min raise and will call (which he does) that means 360 in the pot so i have to call 120 to win 480 and im getting 8 outs with a 32% chance of hitting.
the turn arrives giving us the 9 of spades again since we had a hugely agressive opponent i felt like i could slow play this made straight as he is sure to bet out again, he doesnt instead the min raiser min raises again and the hugely agressive opponent on the flop just flatted the min raise.
now i put in a huge bold move here, i raise it right up to 1.9k chips (remember starting stack is only 3000) so im leaving myself with only 900 chips
in my eyes im saying to the opponent do you really have a hand you want to play, his only move at this stage should be all in or fold but he flats me yet again, and the river gives one last heart
OBVIOUSLY its all going in, because even though a final heart has hit, my turn told him i am playing this to the end, and he shows over K 6s with the hearts, so his flush beat my straight
my question is this, how should i have played this hand, because guy clearly was a fish, and i feel there was no way of avoiding this as the hand played out, was it worth the risk committing myself on the turn? or should i have just shoved it as i had the nuts, i mean if hes going to call a bet for 3/4 of his stack on a flush draw he will lose 84% of the time
any feedback would be greatful
I have heard more than once "you always want to be careful going broke in a limped in pot." And "never bet a stright into a possible flush or a higher straight" and "we all have a calling reflex, easy to trigger". My friend, like I have myself so often, you hit the trifecta on this one!
In your situation, you know there could be both; any flush hand (most likely already paired) looking for third flush card and a limped A-Q looking for a 10 - just that alone on the flop. Yet you flat called a re raise (over called) on a board that had both; you have to have a stronger hand to overcall with than to call. You did not. Still, not bad...pot odds
for a cash game might say overcall it, but survival in a MTT says you are/might be beat, give it up or use pot control the rest of the way.
What else could they have? A raise and a re-raise sort of says strong hand by at least one of them - one might be full of hot air, but both? So after the flop action you do not want to do anything other than check or flat call if chasing, even after you make it on the turn. You have to see a river if a flush is possible before going nuclear.
Still again, you could have shoved the flop with your open end straight, yet a 4 card flush/top pair (maybe even bottom) held by an aggressive player will still call (his 14 outs to your 8). Wouldn't you? Then you are chasing a naked straight draw
and he is chasing a even better hand
- a flush/trips/top two pair. You instead went in deep on the turn (Zero pot control). Hey, who has not done this? I know I have.
making the "big laydown" (lol), and I am sure you do as well, yet that is exactly what you must do sometimes in an MTT. Cash is a different story. Even if they are not bluffing, the times you are wrong will not lose more $$ than you make the times you are right. You just whip out the ol bankroll and peel off another few bills for a new stack.
In an MTT you lose, you are gone. You gotta walk fine line between survival and aggression. Many would rather risk it all early then tighten up later. If it's a 1.00 micro you might be able to pay that off the times you double/triple early on and make it into the money because of that.
Sounds like that was exactly what you ran into, combined with a strong hand with many outs to improve even more.