What to do about over bets,micro stakes

MiguelC18

MiguelC18

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I'm not sure if this is a good topic because it happens in $1 sit and go, but I have been running into a lot of donk players lately which is good and bad. This is an example:
pokerharleygirl Posts SB 25.00
BIGGGESTFISH Posts BB 50.00
kik007sig Folds
MiguelC2013 Calls 50.00 with Kh Ks
PSRBoy Folds
pokerharleygirl Calls 25.00 with 3d Qc
BIGGGESTFISH Checks
flop is Qd 3h 4h

pokerharleygirl Bets 50.00
BIGGGESTFISH Calls 50.00
MiguelC2013 Raised to 150.00
pokerharleygirl All In 3480.00
BIGGGESTFISH Folds
MiguelC2013 Calls 3380.00
MiguelC2013 Shows Kh,Ks
pokerharleygirl Shows 3d,Qc
turn is 4c
river is Ah
MiguelC2013 Won 7260.00 from Pot 1 with Two Pair Kings and Fours
I know I should not have called, maybe I should just fold everytime this happens. What do you think? I know this example is not the best because maybe she was trying to get all the draws to fold, but still why risk everything for so little?
 
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crow27

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her all in was better than your call IMO. At that level, never never never just limp with KK. You're begging to get beat. That and you are not getting the proper value from your hand. You were DRAWING to 5 outs after the flop. 8 if another live card drops on the turn. That's 8 outs going into the river. That means you will lose the vast majority of the time. Bottom line is she didn't do anything wrong. She trapped you and got sucked out on, that's all that happened here.
 
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WizardRubic

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Yeah. I agree with Crow27. Don't limp with KK at a passive table. Just won't work. You need to make them pay for the times that your KK gets beaten by taking their cash when you beat them with KK. Limping in just lets em see the flop for free.

Also, if something similar happens after the flop and you have raised pre flop, you can't just assume you're beat every time. If a maniac keeps doing something over and over, you can't give em credit for every hand they represent. Otherwise your stack will slowly dwindle.
 
newbie in training

newbie in training

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Yea depending on how big the blinds are you should almost always raise (unless blinds are like 500/1000) or some where high up there's

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Tabazaba

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I see what you were doing obviously you wanted to trap with KK but as with any hand you need to beable to fold. She could of had a set or just top pair. It could be the right play in certain situations but you need to have reads to beable to just snap call or fold in that situation.
 
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crow27

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I see what you were doing obviously you wanted to trap with KK but as with any hand you need to beable to fold. She could of had a set or just top pair. It could be the right play in certain situations but you need to have reads to beable to just snap call or fold in that situation.

negative ghost rider. You have to remember the level we're playing here. I think 95% or more of the players don't realize how or even who they can trap effectively. I just think it's a huge mistake not to raise preflop. Let somebody else make the mistake by calling out of position with rags. That is, after all, how you make the most money. By others making mistakes, not you.
 
starting_at_the_bottom

starting_at_the_bottom

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her all in was better than your call IMO. At that level, never never never just limp with KK. You're begging to get beat. That and you are not getting the proper value from your hand. You were DRAWING to 5 outs after the flop. 8 if another live card drops on the turn. That's 8 outs going into the river. That means you will lose the vast majority of the time. Bottom line is she didn't do anything wrong. She trapped you and got sucked out on, that's all that happened here.

She didnt trap OP, she re raised and played it pretty straight forward.
 
MiguelC18

MiguelC18

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Advice well taken. When is it a good time to limp in with big pocket pairs?
 
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redcross

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Yeah. I agree with Crow27. Don't limp with KK at a passive table. Just won't work. You need to make them pay for the times that your KK gets beaten by taking their cash when you beat them with KK. Limping in just lets em see the flop for free.

Also, if something similar happens after the flop and you have raised pre flop, you can't just assume you're beat every time. If a maniac keeps doing something over and over, you can't give em credit for every hand they represent. Otherwise your stack will slowly dwindle.

Never allow others to see a cheap or free flop when u have a power hand, make them pay!!
 
Arjonius

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Advice well taken. When is it a good time to limp in with big pocket pairs?
There aren't many. The main one is when you're at a table where you won't end up going to the flop multi-way. You want a situation where there are players still to act who frequently raise limpers to iso them and/or because doing so is part of how they play. And even then, you still have to figure out how to continue and build the pot when, in most instances, you're OOP. So, limping a big pair isn't necessarily a better line than simply betting out in the first place.
 
MiguelC18

MiguelC18

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Thank you Arjonius. I lost a good sized pot today after raising preflop with JJ on the BB to several limpers. Got called by two, one being a small stack. I kept the aggression with a good flop, got called by both, small stack called all in. I shoved on river, player folded. after seeing he called my preflop raise with K7o I see how it's better to get value from a big pocket pair preflop. somewhat... I'm new at this. Thanks
 
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jimmylytle2

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I do not believe in limping unless I am the small or big blind. At least a min raise to scare away the 2 4 off suit hands.
As soon as I saw two hearts on the board, you know you were in trouble, lol.
 
Henry Minute

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I think that you were very lucky that the board paired to enable you to win.

She hit 2 pair on the flop, a 2 pair that is hard to read too, and it was therefore quite reasonable for her to think she was ahead as she actually was when she went all in.

As I said you were very lucky. When I try to slow play AA or KK I invariably get beaten.
 
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crow27

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She didnt trap OP, she re raised and played it pretty straight forward.

ah yep, you are right, my bad.


And +1 to Arjonius I think you need to be pretty sure someone will raise behind you to open limp with AA or KK. Those are the only 2 I would do it with though.
 
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ezevan1022

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Over bets are generally nuttish hands, i would take notes on the villain if he did indeed show up with a bluff.
 
zEric7x

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Over bets are generally nuttish hands, i would take notes on the villain if he did indeed show up with a bluff.

I notice some people when they have two pairs and over always almost shove or make some huge over bet. It still catches me off guard sometimes.
 
trekmaster

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Advice well taken. When is it a good time to limp in with big pocket pairs?

Ive tried to limp in all kinda of situations over the years.I have lost alot of those times.The only time I tend to limp with big pps now is when Im at the final table with 3or 4 of us left and there is an aggressive big stack who is raising every hand.Your more likely to get paid off in this situation and limit you risk I beleive.
 
rodrigoudf

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I think limp KK is not the best move, you back many players to play if weak hands
 
MiguelC18

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Ive tried to limp in all kinda of situations over the years.I have lost alot of those times.The only time I tend to limp with big pps now is when Im at the final table with 3or 4 of us left and there is an aggressive big stack who is raising every hand.Your more likely to get paid off in this situation and limit you risk I believe.
Yeah I do that in the same situation and I try to mix it up, then again I have lost some big pots by not letting go of that big pocket pair.
 
lulu pk

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Never limp whit kk AA,You don't now where you are in the hand.you were lucky that the 4 pair the board.
 
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KaineB

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good topic

great topic bro, its hard to lay down kings when its over to the board.. just gotta go with your gut brotha
 
blueskies

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Unless u know for a fact that villain overbets with garbage or pure bluff, then just fold and wait for a better hand to get it in.

More importantly, raise preflop! Avoid situations like this where where you allow villain to see the flop for free and hit a monster with junk.

A line like min bet then shove is usually quite strong. I.e. villain wants to "build the pot" on the flop, and when raised he/she thinks "aha! gotcha" and goes all in.

If villain only had TP Q, I think the flop bet would have been larger.

But bottom line is, your biggest mistake is not calling the all in, but not raising preflop.

The way to disguise your AA KK and QQ monsters is to widen your opening range, NOT to limp with them and then go crazy after the flop. Remember, a monster like AA is only a large pair after the flop most of the time.
 
Vhyre

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Sound advice from blue. Limping is just that, lame
 
MiguelC18

MiguelC18

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really good advice blue, I am working on widening my opening range.
 
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jcdagenius

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i pretty much fold to overbets.....basically means value in micros 100 percent
 
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