Tournament Advice to Ignore and Habits to Break

Debi

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This is our strategy discussion for January Week 1 in the CardsChat Forum Challenge:

Tournament Advice to Ignore and Habits to Break

We could probably write a book on this topic! Everyone is always trying to tell us what to do - and sometimes we discover later that it was not great advice. Old habits are hard to break.

Discuss this article and let us know some of the worst advice you were ever given and any bad habits you had a heard time breaking.

This should be a very long thread lol.
 
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RidersFan

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A lot of the strategy articles I could find something to take away from it, unfortunately not this one. The article uses absolutes and suggests ridiculous scenarios to not do things that aren’t habits, like calling for information; who loses 15% of their stack calling for info, no one ever. Calling a river bet info isn’t or should be just to see what your opponent has, it should be to find out how accurate or in accurate your read was in the hand.
Defending your blinds is important especially later when the blinds go up. Obviously your not going to be defending 100% of blinds but if your fold too many and not 3betting out of them your going to be very exploitable.
Basically you can defend any of these “habits” if you have a plan and reasoning behind your decisions. If you don’t know why you’re doing something than any tournament strategy is a bad habit.
 
mtl mile end

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·BAD HABIT #1
I've got to keep you honest
TRANSLATION:
I’m making a hero call
If you suspect you are good because of the particular circumstances, and suspect your opponent is capable of reraising a big bet with air, calling might be the thing to do. Saying “I’ve got to keep you honest” lets everyone know you’re willing to hero call this opponent.
·BAD HABIT #2
I needed the information
TRANSLATION:
I'm making a hero call but am not sure enough of the call to say “I’ve got to keep you honest”

·BAD HABIT #3
Always defend your blinds
TRANSLATION:
Open up your range in the blinds. There may be good times to speculate and this may be one of them.
Never say always.

·BAD HABIT #4
The price was right to call
TRANSLATION:
I’m defending (rationalizing) my actions
The pot odds may mean that your call could be justified mathematically as giving you a chance to risk/win an amount of chips that is equal to the odds of winning, but THAT DOES NOT MEAN YOU HAVE TO CALL IN THIS SITUATION. This is entirely dependent on the context of the hand.

In a recent thread, every poster seemed to be saying that if you have the pot odds, YOU MUST CALL! in this situation, regardless of the fact that it’s the second blind level, for your whole stack, on the Flop, T2050 to call a pot with T2450, when you know you’re behind.

https://www.cardschat.com/forum/tou...e-mtt-freerollhe-call-all-358047/#post4059311



·BAD HABIT #5
Watch out for big stacks
TRANSLATION:
Try to avoid tangling with one of the chip leaders at your table unless you are willing to commit to the pot because they can double you up or take you out.
As always, context is everything.
 
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demibar

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I've got 2 from 5 bad habbits to be honnest .The 3rd not every hand of course but deffend the blinds specially late on tournement could be save your stack...and the first if the opponent plays with trash cards .I usually dont follow advise from other players when they chat its more usefull to read some articles .
 
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No1eJoker

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I think that old habits can be hard to get rid of and that the advice we have heard from anyone should not be applied,
sometimes we can not resist not to bluff when there is a lot of money in the pot, but then we often pay the price and get out from the tournament,
or often invest on a flop to just see if the opponent is strong, or too much and often cbet can swallow a lot of ours stack.
 
MattRyder

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#5 avoiding the big stacks, or more correctly, the chip leader bully, is the toughest one for me, but one that I need to come to grips with. Even though we know the bully is raising every hand with any two, we tend to avoid him because we don't want to risk getting knocked out. However, the flip-side is that UNLESS you happen to magically hit that monster that you've been waiting for AND it just happens to hold up, you're getting shorter and shorter every hand. It's a tough place to be, for sure.
 
Debi

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#5 avoiding the big stacks, or more correctly, the chip leader bully, is the toughest one for me, but one that I need to come to grips with. Even though we know the bully is raising every hand with any two, we tend to avoid him because we don't want to risk getting knocked out. However, the flip-side is that UNLESS you happen to magically hit that monster that you've been waiting for AND it just happens to hold up, you're getting shorter and shorter every hand. It's a tough place to be, for sure.

Yep - and then of course when you finally get brave and play back at them they happen to have a monster. :p
 
MattRyder

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Yep - and then of course when you finally get brave and play back at them they happen to have a monster. :p
..., or, this happens. Although it seems like I'm usually the one losing with the two over-cards, it's important to remember that the odds for over-cards vs. under-cards is actually only 2:1. So barring any strong pair/straight/flush pre-flop combinations, your miserable cards are going to win one in every three times (like the 74o did below) against one opponent.

Of course, the shorter you are when this happens, the less chance you have of coming back to a strong position. So even though your pre-flop cards suck, it's probably better to take your shot when you're still deep enough for it to make a difference.

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Good article, I think all the advice made sense.
 
zam220

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I have 5 out of 5 bad habits, but the good thing is they sometimes happen.And I'm trying to get rid of them.However, simply knowing these things will not make you a successful player
 
adriantempo

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One of the best articles I've read lately and I must say I agree with it.

BAD HABIT #1


I think you've got me but I feel like giving you some chips anyway


Well, some people just call because they got so much in the pot already. "When you know you're beat", actually it's pretty impossible to know. "You think" are better words.


BAD HABIT #2


I'm willing to waste my chips to see what you are holding because this intelligence will help me defeat you later


Getting information while not playing is excellent advice. You got nothing else to do, might as well get something for nothing than nothing for nothing.


BAD HABIT #3

When you're in the big blind or small blind, you must call any pre-flop raise


Remember that you still have bad cards and you will be playing out of position after the flop. Don't need to defend blinds, it's just a blind, it will go away, you are not cursed or something.


BAD HABIT #4


I knew I was behind, but the pot odds were so good I had to call


Again, I don't think you KNOW you are behind. You just THINK.


BAD HABIT #5

Try to avoid tangling with one of the chip leaders at your table because they can take you out


If you can't win by stack size against a chip leader then you must win by strong hands, so choose wisely.
 
Andrew Popov

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Perhaps my worst habit is an excessively narrow range for the game. Yes, I'm a "nit". I'm used to playing only the best hands, but they do not always win. At the same time, I miss many good boards where my card would be the best. I need to play a lot more. I'm working on it. I think that this is a problem for many players.
 
Serjo600

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Add a schedule of freerolls other games: stud8, flo8, 2-7 NL SD, Razz, Badugi, horse.
 
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My worst habit is that i always think that the chip leader who raise frequently always have best hand.
 
BentleyBoy

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I like this article as it contains words that we have all probably heard before, yet we don't always give the correct level of attention to until we see it written down.

I particularly like the advice about pot odds. This is always a piece of advice that I have considered, but like the article says, pot odds are only good when you can afford them. Be wary of being drawn into pot odds bets when you are short stacked.... you could be saying goodbye to your tournament life with a handful of nothing!


I also like the one about watching out for the big stack. Big stacks are dangerous but also a good source of income. Yes they may have you covered, but when you have a winner, suck out of them as much as you can. Just don't speculate against them.


The piece of advice I was given that I always guard against is worrying too much about what the other guy may be doing. Be alert to what they do, but dont get sucked into their behaviour! Focus on your game and play your A Game every game and let the other players worry about you!.
 
shanest

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Some good points to be made in the article. I cannot say I agree with everything said there.
I think most winning tournament players defend their cards, especially from the big blind, extremely wide. Especially when you get to the Ante stages of tournaments this can be very profitable to do.
Number 5 is definitely one people do not factor enough. I have seen people play such marginal hands very deep with other chip leaders in the deep stages of tournaments. It is ICM suicide.
 
schtiuky

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my biggest mistake is getting into a tournament but not having the free time for it. I get in things are going good then i have to do something go somewhere or its too late. Last tournament got in at 22 o clock, then 3.5 h later i was tired i just didn't have energy to finish it. got 85 place, was out of money and had a hard day at work the next day.
 
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In terms of results I have received some bad advice regarding the way of playing pairs in hand, especially the AA. the bad habit is to be compulsive limp no matter which hand it takes, this often reduces my gain in a hand, so it should be modified.
 
AizenFalck

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Bad habit 1 and 3 I practice thgem almost every time I played the firs year I was learning to play poker haha, those are some habits really difficult to avoid when you are a newbe. For me my Aquiles tendon is always calling an all in when having KK AA or AK suited. Preflop, during the flop or post flop I dont care, I just can control my hand taking the mouse and select "call". Thats something I really need to work on it. Last but not least, I always try to see the chipleader in the table as my chance to double up my chips, always carefully but thats always in my head "Those chips will be mine" :D
 
miric007

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My bad habit happens when I'm a chip leader. I'm too fond of myself and I want to participate in every hand
 
tagece

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I think there is a lot of bad information on internet and many looser players teaching beginners. This kind of article is important to show how play just following rules can make you lose money. Sometimes Youtube videos and blogs teach strategies without showing how complex can be the game. You need to learn the delicate art of balancing position, stack, range, ICM, metagame, ods, all at the same time. It's really hard.
When someone play by rigid rules, looking for only one aspect of the game, it's a easy food for the real shark.
 
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Propane Goat

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Some of the worst tournament advice I have ever seen was actually a hand scenario in a book. The scenario was something like being UTG with AK at a full table with 5BB, the author was advocating only min-raising and not open-shoving for some reason and I thought this was pure rubbish.

What are you going to do if you get multiple callers and the flop comes 964? You're going to have to push all in to c-bet even with one caller, if you check it back and they bet you're going to have to call off your stack with nothing but Ace high, or fold and be left with crumbs in your chip stack. It kind of seemed to me like the author was a cash game specialist without much tournament experience, but needed something to bring the book up to the publisher's requested page count.


One habit that I've been able to break is calling pre-flop bets from the SB with weak Aces, you're never going to be in a good situation post-flop here unless you hit two-pair or better.


Regarding the big stack, if they got there from playing fast and loose and getting very lucky then they're probably going to be giving those chips back just as fast.


A big stack who got there by getting 3 big hands paid off in the last hour and has played nothing else will probably be playing just as tight....but you have to watch them and try to figure out what they're doing. I've been successful at times by constantly nibbling away at a tight big stack with small bets in position.
 
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sryulaw

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This is our strategy discussion for January Week 1 in the CardsChat Forum Challenge:

Tournament Advice to Ignore and Habits to Break

We could probably write a book on this topic! Everyone is always trying to tell us what to do - and sometimes we discover later that it was not great advice. Old habits are hard to break.

Discuss this article and let us know some of the worst advice you were ever given and any bad habits you had a heard time breaking.

This should be a very long thread lol.

BAD HABIT #2

I needed the information​
TRANSLATION:

I'm willing to waste my chips to see what you are holding because this intelligence will help me defeat you later

Too many players overvalue poker "intelligence", especially in a tournament. In a multi-table tournament, you're just not going to get enough data to generate any reliable assessments of your opponent. You change tables frequently, and players come and go as they are knocked out.
Instead of wasting your precious chips in some vain effort to find out that your opponent opened from an early position with K-8 suited, you are better off just paying attention to every hand and trying to make assessments of who are the good players at your table. You may waste 15 percent of your stack paying for information only to see that player moved to another table three hands later, or knocked out by somebody else at the table who took advantage of the information you paid for.
Considering that only about one in four hands actually make it to showdown, most of the intelligence to be gleaned is going to come by observing your opponents' betting patterns pre- and post-flop and not from seeing your opponents' hole cards. Remember that the best time to get information is when you are NOT in the hand, and "paying" for information is never a good idea.









Many professionals in brazil say that betting on information does not exist, this is a mistake, they say that either you bet by value or bluff, nothing else !! And thinking well they're right .. correct me if I'm wrong I believe in them.?
 
kena3000

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I already had read this article. Good tips and helpful for beginers. I think that some things that players sometimes do wrong is to chase projects. One bad adviced that i was told is to defend blinds. I used to play this a lot, waiting to hit in the flop and pay the raises that button guy sometimes plays to steal them.
Other thing is not knowing how to play small blinds and limping just because it is half the BB. I think this it is call "bargaining" i don´t remember.

Calling on the river knowing that i'm beaten? I don´t think that happens. I think that you think you have a better hand, not the best, but better than you opponent.
Ex:
Hero: UTG. AJ raises x3
Everybody fold.
Button call
SB (loose) and BB call
Flop:7JJ
SB checks BB checks, Hero bet 3/4 pot, Button fold, SB call, BB fold.
Turn: 6
SB checks, Hero bet 1/2 pot, SB call.
River: 2
SB all in, Hero calls.
Villain shows 77
Hero wants to die cause never saw that set in the beggining.
Lost half my stack deep in a tournament.


I don't have the eyes to see a set (i put SB on the range AT, A7, QQ, TT)




Sorry for my English
 
kena3000

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my biggest mistake is getting into a tournament but not having the free time for it. I get in things are going good then i have to do something go somewhere or its too late. Last tournament got in at 22 o clock, then 3.5 h later i was tired i just didn't have energy to finish it. got 85 place, was out of money and had a hard day at work the next day.

Pretty much the same thing happen to me. Last weekend at the home game of CC. the one because of the holidays, i was leaderchip in one hour of game. Then i had to leave and half and hour when i came back the tournament was finished and i was finished 10th, only four players wins.


Sorry for my English.
 
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