Something to remember about playing off suited big slick (AK)

1) Are only drawing hands
2) Are not worth putting your tournament life in jeopardy by going all in preflop with unless your shortstacked
3) Are great pre flop to raise with, but you have to be willing to let them go post flop if you miss.
4) Can be beat by a measly pair of 2's ( so who's to blame if you go all in preflop and lose to pocket 2's?)

scooterdice said:

who's to blame if you go all in preflop and lose to pocket 2's?

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Obviously the blame question is irrelevant, but you need to think of ranges. If the player with 22 is going all-in preflop with 22 he's probably also doing it with hands like AQ/AJ/KQ/KJ/other random crap hands.

Poker is about ranges, so let's look at the ranges here from each perspective:

AKs - Only worried about 2 hands, and if the opponent is at all aggressive, will be going all-in with bluffs as well as strong hands that he beats, like AQ/AJ/etc. and of course 22-QQ are coin flips

22 - Is only beating 32-A2, is crushed by any other pocket pair, and is either slightly ahead or behind any other hand. 22 barely beats any of the other player's preflop all-in range at all. Basically 22 is hoping to get LUCKY and make it only a coin flip. So the BEST CASE SCENARIO for 22 is for it to be around 50-50.

So as I said, kinda silly to talk about who's to "blame", but pretty clearly if the money goes in 22 vs. AK, it was the 22 who played the hand much worse.

scooterdice said:

1) Are only drawing hands
2) Are not worth putting your tournament life in jeopardy by going all in preflop with unless your shortstacked

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Agreed. I generally try not to go all in pre-flop unless i'm holding big pocket pairs AA KK etc. Or my stack is getting low, 8-10 BB blinds worth left.

3) Are great pre flop to raise with, but you have to be willing to let them go post flop if you miss.

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Really have to be able to lay them down if you don't hit anything on the flop and are being bet at.

4) Can be beat by a measly pair of 2's ( so who's to blame if you go all in preflop and lose to pocket 2's?)

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Who is to blame? The poker site you are playing at of course! It has to be rigged... /sarcasm

This is where "Insert poker site here is RIGGED!" posts come from.


~H

Pocket aces can end up being a "drawing hand" depending on what you're up against and what comes on the flop.

It's like Zach said, the game is about ranges. AK is flipping with 22, but it's crushing all sorts of other hands. You don't need to draw with AK to beat AT or KQ.

is a good hand but not a stong hand for pre flop all in ...you cant hit a flush draw .....you cant but with 1 card

AK looks great for beginners, but when you are more experienced and you have played much tournaments you'll see that you often have to lay this great hand. In the beginning I went often all-in with this hand, but now I think twice before I do this...

I think I can see the problem here - people keep saying the words "all-in" and "preflop", as if the only ways to play the hand are to shove it or fold it.

Truth is there's a huge area in between. If the pot has been four-bet shoved preflop, OK, I might stop to think before I called that shove with AK, as the circumstances dictate I'm probably up against AA/KK.

If you're routinely folding AK preflop, you're losing loads of value. Think about the range of hands your opponent could be on, and play the hand accordingly. If there's one raise in front of you, it could mean all sorts of hands: 22+, Ax, KQ+, maybe suited connectors or some other weird stuff... you're ahead of the vast majority of that range and you should be happy to be putting some of your money up against it. Don't get stuck on one idea like "It's just a drawing hand".

following zach and Oz, if you are folding AK preflop you are losing on value. You are really losing vs 2 hands, which are much more unlikely since you hold 1 of each. If you get called or call against 22 it is a cointoss however they are calling/pushing with a lot more so its a no brainer. Also, if you are pushing it you have plenty of fold equity and if you are calling it less desirable but still acceptable, you almost certainly have pot odds against almost all villians ranges.

Its a rare occurance I am folding AK preflop, and it should be even less in low stakes tournys.

__________________big SLICK (AK)
I like to play with big SLICK and I see many advantages to go out with such good cards. A huge advantage we have is in a flop open A or K,
because we have a dual with higher kicker.
I do not agree that AK = 22, I prefer the certainty with AK by numerous advantages.
But always worth remembering that position as I reached the table and betting up to me.

i am not a big fan if of the all-in blitz beginning most tournies. AA, KK, or AKs or AKo are about the only hands i would race with early. later on AK keeps it value for me for the kickers, if you hit either card you have best kicker, there is just so much Ax rag crap played to the river it is almost laughable.
i will agree that it is overplayed, play is like middle pairs if you don't catch anything. muck it if bet at.

Onadar said:

i am not a big fan if of the all-in blitz beginning most tournies.

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Unless by "most tournies" we only mean freerolls and rebuys, I think the prevalence of this phenomenon is greatly overstated.

In reality, you won't be put to a preflop decision for your whole stack with AK early in a tournament very often. "ZOMGZ, we shouldn't be risking our whole stack early on with AK because we're a dog to 22" is really only a concern that's specific to freerolls. So quit playing it scared, and start playing it properly.

If overvaluing AK is a beginner's mistake, then playing it scared every time you get it is a just-graduated-from-beginner mistake.

I dont think I have won with big slick in almost 4 months, which is roughly 1000 hands a week combined (online and live).

Even UTG with a full table behind you you're only going to be dominated with aces or kings about 4.3% of the time (and AK vs KK isn't even that terrible, you still hold a little over 30% equity in the pot) so you probably shouldn't be folding this hand preflop unless stacks are very deep or you a very good reason to believe you're up against AA/KK or can't continue because of tournament payout structure. So if my or villain's stack is under 23BB I'm almost always willing to play this all-in preflop. Including most likely calling an all-in reraise unless the reraiser's really tight and I've been playing fairly tight and tournament odds dictate folding even when I'm a 2:1 favourite, or as I said, two raises from really nitty players. And this is a great hand to push over the top of someone's raise preflop, I prefer it over QQ and lower pairs. If stacks are deep it's another matter, but the period when you have deep stacks in tourneys is pretty limited.

i never fold AK preflop lol, u cant say i m against AA by looking at the raises it can be QQ or JJ which is same as 22 for AK..

There are so many threads on AK there was no real reason to add another IMO.
If you have problems with AK just use the search function for the answers you may be looking for.

I believe I speak for everyone on this site when I say "hell yes, another thread about AK!!!"

Best thing about AK is when villians have it, miss and won't let go of the hand...Ya gotta love those people!

If you ever think to yourself, "How often will my opponent stack off with AQ (KQ, AJ, etc) in this spot?" If it's anything except "never," it's pretty much fine to get it in pre-flop with AKo.

something also to remember about ako, it is only dominated by KK and AA, and are at least a coin flip or any other hand.