Set Miners

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schnozzinkobenstein

schnozzinkobenstein

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My $.05/.10 cash sessions have been getting destroyed by set miners. I used to be good stacking off with TPTK or overpair on the flop, but lately every time I do it I end up against a set. What am I supposed to do? I can't just fold against any aggressive betting, because most people there are willing to stack off with TPTK, sometimes even TP + rag.

Slow-played sets are hitting me hard as well. They just cold call me down to the river, and sometimes raise there. How am I supposed to take that? They could be on a draw for all I know or have TP.

I considered increases my preflop raises to 4x or 5x bb with no limpers before me, but if I get a caller on my premium hand less often, that seems like -EV for me.

I need some help here guys, I'd really appreciate any advice.

also: Betting the flop really strong for information is probably going to make most everything besides sets fold which doesn't sound +EV, plus I know it's bad to play scared.
 
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Jagsti

Jagsti

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FR or 6mx?

FR is way easier to get away from tptk or overpairs v setminers tbh. 6mx is imo, far more difficult as it's far more usual to play for stacks far lighter (obv villain dependant).
 
Jagsti

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As FAR as I know there's far to many far's in the above statement!
 
dj11

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Since the average winning hand is something on the order of 1.5 pair, and the standard deviation breaks at about the set mark, there is not a whole lot of established strategy about how to deal with set miners, or set mining in general. We all will be toast occasionally.

It becomes that gray area where you have to involve your gut feelings (table images, reads, game flow, meta game considerations, even your mood) as much as the odds at hand. You know sets are always possible, but in reality they just don't show up that often, so the odds become important, but not dictatorial.

One of the few things you can do is to exert pot control via bet sizing. I for one tend to want to take big, top or over pairs farther than I should. Another thing I am beginning to understand is that the stealing aspect is generally more lucrative than the showdown aspect of the game. While both are important, one comes with much less stress. This is forcing me to spend the time to get some reads on my villains.

Granted this is not a foolproof solution, but it can prevent you from losing more than necessary while gaining info. Add in the ability to lay down promising hands, and you have some control over this situation.
 
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feitr

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pay attention to pf stats. somebody who is something like 16/13 is very likely to be set mining if they limp or cold call pf. somebody who is 40/4 is not. when tight players with small calling ranges give you alot of action after the flop it is much more likely you are up against a set than when some loose fish or lag gives you action.

if somebody has <5% calling range and they limp then give you action post flop then i'd be very careful about getting too attached to tptk, ESPECIALLY on dry boards.
 
aliengenius

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Real honest to goodness set miners have very specific PT stats, something along the lines of 8%vp$ip/2%pfr--- so just don't give these guys any action when the go past the flop or show aggression on it.

Depending on stack size and opponent tendencies, sometimes you have to go broke w tptk, so don't let a recent negative downswing in a (relatively) small sample size skew your outlook.

For more on the odds/implied odds of set mining, see here.
 
BelgoSuisse

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Real honest to goodness set miners have very specific PT stats, something along the lines of 8%vp$ip/2%pfr--- so just don't give these guys any action when the go past the flop or show aggression on it.

QFT.

True set miners are a gold mine once you recognise them. 7 times out of 8 they will call your PFR and then fold the your cbet. If you don't pay them off the 1 time out of 8 that they resist, then it's hugely profitable.

Losing your stack to a 40/4 fish who got lucky to hit a set is fine, on the other hand, because you make money out of him in so many other ways.
 
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