Poker Rules??????????

BrentD22 · May 12, 2008

I've looked at the rules of texas hold'em on the cardplayer.com website. It has all the rules with exception to some of those odd things you hear at tables like the below. If you NOW the real rule or what the ruling should be comment, but we are not looking for more I think it's this or that. Be 100% sure before commenting.

- If someone says their hole cards outloud? I know your shouldn't do this, but what happens?
- Can you really show either of your cards to a player that is all-in when there is no one else to act to get a reaction? I've heard that if you show either of your cards during a hand before finishing the betting is a dead hand. I don't know the real ruling.
- Can you threat to go all-in to any bet that is about to be made before you? I know that if you do threat to do this and the person goes all-in you are binded to this act, but is this just unethical or is it truely not allowed by the actual rules and is there a ruling other than this?
- You declare a lesser hand than what you really have ouload? This is kinda stupid, but it's a common arguement at home games. I think the cards speak for themselves vs. what players say outload.
- A player goes all-in and doesn't want to be called whilie he holds AA turns his cards face up on the table - is he allowed to do this. I know it would be stupid to do so, but I've always wondered this. It could be something I might actually do if the blinds are huge and I hold AA and the ITM bubble is here and I'd rathe just pick-up the blinds vs. someone drawing out on me and getting lucky vs. me getting unlucky and busting out before ITM. I probably wouldn't actual do this, but just curious.
- In a tournament the river card is dealt and I am 1st to act. I make a pot sized bet and the other player thinks and looks like he is going to fold. I have the nuts and want him to call. Can I offer to lower the bet or even remove it and allow the other player to just check in order to see his cards? I know it's allowed in cash games with only 2 players in the pot, but not sure about tournament with only 2 people in the pot.

OK so again DON'T give us your guess or I think the rule is, I am ONLY looking for 100% positive rulings. It would be nice to credit where you found this ruling i.e. a casino and what casino or book what book, ect.?

I'am also looking for additional posts for rules that are those odd things that come up that are not listed in the cardsplayer.com rules.

WVHillbilly · May 12, 2008

Please clarify if you are referring to tournament or cash play.

Jillychemung · May 12, 2008

Look at http://www.pokertda.com/rules.doc for the Poker Tournament Director's published rules. These rules are what a lot of casinos use. But there are almost always exceptions on a casino by casino basis. Your list of questions will have multiple different answers depending on the venue and whether it is a cash game or a tournament. I know I play live in 2 places where your 2nd question will have 2 different rulings.

nevadanick · May 12, 2008

Jillychemung said:
Your list of questions will have multiple different answers depending on the venue and whether it is a cash game or a tournament. I know I play live in 2 places where your 2nd question will have 2 different rulings.

^^^ very true. Check the rules at the location you play. Many have a set of rules posted. In 'most' cases I've seen live, a dispute not covered in posted rules is determined by the pit boss.

Have never, ever, seen a 'universal' standard. The reference by the OP to CardPlayer rules is a guideline posted in a forum not unlike this one and contains a caveat that these 'rules' are from Roberts Rules of Poker. A book not unlike Roberts Rules of Order, but not as widely accepted.

If you have specific strategies that you want to employ in a live poker room, ask the pit BEFORE you play in that room. Every room I've ever seen contains a statement somewhere that the decisions by management are binding, not rules from a website.

Even games like baseball fall prey to different rules. AL and NL teams are both pro-baseball and play each other in the WS, even tho one has designated hitter rules and the other does not.

Ask before you play. It's FAR less embarrassing.

BrentD22 · May 13, 2008

either

WVHillbilly said:
Please clarify if you are referring to tournament or cash play.

Either cash or tournament play. I know in cash games there are a little more le-way with some rules, but I think I am more interested in tournament play rules.

Jillychemung · May 13, 2008

As we have said, there is no universal set of rules for poker as to behavior, exposing cards, table talk and etc. I play at one place where if you expose your cards before the hand has ended, your hand is dead and at another place you can expose your cards whenever you want. 1 place says that if you only expose 1 card and then muck, your hand is dead even if the 1 card was enough to win (but I have never seen a player get called on it). So talk to the tournament director before you start to play if you have questions.

WVHillbilly · May 13, 2008

BrentD22 said:
I've looked at the rules of texas hold'em on the cardplayer.com website. It has all the rules with exception to some of those odd things you hear at tables like the below. If you NOW the real rule or what the ruling should be comment, but we are not looking for more I think it's this or that. Be 100% sure before commenting.

- If someone says their hole cards outloud? I know your shouldn't do this, but what happens? Penalties may be issued by the TD (ex. player may be forced to sit out 2 rounds)
- Can you really show either of your cards to a player that is all-in when there is no one else to act to get a reaction? I've heard that if you show either of your cards during a hand before finishing the betting is a dead hand. I don't know the real ruling. The hand is not declared dead. Again penalties may be issued.
- Can you threat to go all-in to any bet that is about to be made before you? I know that if you do threat to do this and the person goes all-in you are binded to this act, but is this just unethical or is it truely not allowed by the actual rules and is there a ruling other than this? Verbal declarations made out of turn can be binding providing the action hasn't change prior to the players actual turn. (Checks, calls, folds do not change the action).
- You declare a lesser hand than what you really have ouload? This is kinda stupid, but it's a common arguement at home games. I think the cards speak for themselves vs. what players say outload. Cards speak regardless of what their idiot owners say.
- A player goes all-in and doesn't want to be called whilie he holds AA turns his cards face up on the table - is he allowed to do this. I know it would be stupid to do so, but I've always wondered this. It could be something I might actually do if the blinds are huge and I hold AA and the ITM bubble is here and I'd rathe just pick-up the blinds vs. someone drawing out on me and getting lucky vs. me getting unlucky and busting out before ITM. I probably wouldn't actual do this, but just curious. Exposing a hand before showdown can result in a penalty but the hand is not declared dead.
- In a tournament the river card is dealt and I am 1st to act. I make a pot sized bet and the other player thinks and looks like he is going to fold. I have the nuts and want him to call. Can I offer to lower the bet or even remove it and allow the other player to just check in order to see his cards? I know it's allowed in cash games with only 2 players in the pot, but not sure about tournament with only 2 people in the pot. Once an action has been taken in turn it is binding. You can not undo it.

OK so again DON'T give us your guess or I think the rule is, I am ONLY looking for 100% positive rulings. It would be nice to credit where you found this ruling i.e. a casino and what casino or book what book, ect.?

I'am also looking for additional posts for rules that are those odd things that come up that are not listed in the cardsplayer.com rules.

Here is a link to the cardsplayer.com rules CardPlayer.com - Poker Rules

Taken from RROP.

Also on your declaring a lesser hand or a better hand question. If this is done in an effort to slowroll or get an opponent to muck a better hand the player should be taken out and beaten severely. Taken from Hillbilly's Rules of Poker.

blankoblanco · May 13, 2008

also note that if you change the 10 question marks in this thread title to exclamation points, it takes on a whole new meaning

CfPoker · May 13, 2008

BrentD22 said:
I've looked at the rules of texas hold'em on the cardplayer.com website. It has all the rules with exception to some of those odd things you hear at tables like the below. If you NOW the real rule or what the ruling should be comment, but we are not looking for more I think it's this or that. Be 100% sure before commenting.

- If someone says their hole cards outloud? I know your shouldn't do this, but what happens?Penalty issued after the hand, but the hand is not dead
- Can you really show either of your cards to a player that is all-in when there is no one else to act to get a reaction? I've heard that if you show either of your cards during a hand before finishing the betting is a dead hand. I don't know the real ruling.It's not a dead hand, but you recieve a penalty after the hand. In heads up play (2 players left in the tournament, not a single pot) this is allowed.
- Can you threat to go all-in to any bet that is about to be made before you? I know that if you do threat to do this and the person goes all-in you are binded to this act, but is this just unethical or is it truely not allowed by the actual rules and is there a ruling other than this?This really depends on how it is said, I'd need a more concrete example. "If you bet I'm going to put you all in" wouldn't be binding in my opinion. "I'm all in" out of turn would be. In the second case, providing there's been no change in action (ie a raise, or betting when there's no previous bet) then the all in would be binding.
- You declare a lesser hand than what you really have ouload? This is kinda stupid, but it's a common arguement at home games. I think the cards speak for themselves vs. what players say outload.Cards speak. But if the dealer awards the pot to the wrong player and mucks all the cards then the player who wrongly declared has no excuse, though any competent dealer shouldn't do this really as it's not hard to read a hand
- A player goes all-in and doesn't want to be called whilie he holds AA turns his cards face up on the table - is he allowed to do this. I know it would be stupid to do so, but I've always wondered this. It could be something I might actually do if the blinds are huge and I hold AA and the ITM bubble is here and I'd rathe just pick-up the blinds vs. someone drawing out on me and getting lucky vs. me getting unlucky and busting out before ITM. I probably wouldn't actual do this, but just curious.Same as earlier - hand isn't dead, but penalty afterwards.
- In a tournament the river card is dealt and I am 1st to act. I make a pot sized bet and the other player thinks and looks like he is going to fold. I have the nuts and want him to call. Can I offer to lower the bet or even remove it and allow the other player to just check in order to see his cards? I know it's allowed in cash games with only 2 players in the pot, but not sure about tournament with only 2 people in the pot.This is absolutely 100% not allowed.

OK so again DON'T give us your guess or I think the rule is, I am ONLY looking for 100% positive rulings. It would be nice to credit where you found this ruling i.e. a casino and what casino or book what book, ect.?

I'am also looking for additional posts for rules that are those odd things that come up that are not listed in the cardsplayer.com rules.

Here is a link to the cardsplayer.com rules CardPlayer.com - Poker Rules

These are my understanding based on various rules/venues I've played at. They're what I would enforce in my home games.

OzExorcist · May 14, 2008

*agrees with WVHillbilly's interpretations*

Those would be the rulings I'd expect in a tournament situation if they're following TDA rules.

Floor managers have some degree of leeway, of course, which can create some inconsistency from tournament to tournament - for example, Jamie Gold wasn't penalised for repeatedly exposing the strength of his hand in the Main Event, but Julius Coleman was given a sit-out penalty during the final table of the 2007 Aussie Millions just for folding his cards out of turn.

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Poker Rules??????????

BrentD22

Rock Star

WVHillbilly

Legend

Jillychemung

Stacks & Stacks

nevadanick

Back to work ... zzzzz

BrentD22

Rock Star

Jillychemung

Stacks & Stacks

WVHillbilly

Legend

blankoblanco

plays poker on hard mode

CfPoker

Rock Star

OzExorcist

Broomcorn's uncle

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