No winning sessions in 5 days - LO8

Been playing 10/20c LO8 which is not that much different than 02/04c and I have not had a winning session in 5 days. I guess this is just a normal downswing.

I have not changed my game at all. Been playing A2 for a raise form most positions. Playing A3sx from all positions and for a raise from late positions and playing AAxx as long as the xx are two cards that play well with the AA especially a pair that is not suited to the A.

Seeing all of these laggy donkies taking down big pots and having 10$ win sessions playing 72/5

Should I hang in there and keep up the play with the hopes that a turn around is coming. Or do I need to make adjustments to my game?

Isn't it better to just limp with those low connected hands? To try and create a multiway pot? Like A234 we would rather just limp in, whereas AQ2K we prefer to raise? post some hands in HA, and also check out the learning section, C9 has put a great offer out there.

The whole object (IMO) in PLO8, is to build a pot with the chance of having having either nut H or nut L and a chance of a scoop. The way you descibe your play sounds to me like you prefer taking the pot down pre flop similar to HE. Limping pre and even post flop in O8 is pot building, and raising with the nuts only after the turn ( as we all know the nuts on the flop is the shits on the river ) happens more then 50% of the time ( so your always a dog if your called and they catch, cause their on a nut draw and will raise you if they hit and your screwed ). A3sx sounds to me like your willing to raise with a dangler ( dangler= 1 totally useless card ). I know it gets tempting in late pos, but only when it's a short table.

I think the mixer says it is LO8 not PLO8, and in my book it is a different animal. Too often you can not bet an opponent off the pot before he see's the river. So for that reason I would prefer to see the flops as cheap as possible, thus Wizzim's comment.

As much as we would all like to see sanity at a higher level, it just plainly ain't ever gonna happen. Maybe at the mega stakes, but nothing in this range.

In O8 in general, I am a fan of sneak a peek with decent hands, maybe even some skip connected middle of the pack hands like 578J, or 468T but probably you need to fold a few more hands and tighten up your current range. As often as not our actions affect their actions, so by raising too often we set off some bizarre feeding frenzy which tho lucrative if you win, is devastating as often or more.

WiZZiM said:

Isn't it better to just limp with those low connected hands? To try and create a multiway pot? Like A234 we would rather just limp in, whereas AQ2K we prefer to raise? post some hands in HA, and also check out the learning section, C9 has put a great offer out there.

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From up front yes I will limp to encourage more people to come in behind. From later positions I will raise because I know the limpers ahead of me and the blinds are most likely not going anywhere for one more bet and the pot is built. As far as building multi way pots go, yesterday at this one table I had seen A2 at showdown in three people's hands with the low on board 4 out of 29 times (are those odds realistic for this game?) so in this case I am not thinking the multiway pots were a good idea. But just try to get a micro player to fold A2. I dont care if he has nothing to go with it. I quit playing ring PLO8 because even when you win you lose. Yes I have seen his offer. It is a great one that i hope to get in on.

Pothole said:

The whole object (IMO) in PLO8, is to build a pot with the chance of having having either nut H or nut L and a chance of a scoop. The way you descibe your play sounds to me like you prefer taking the pot down pre flop similar to HE. Limping pre and even post flop in O8 is pot building, and raising with the nuts only after the turn ( as we all know the nuts on the flop is the shits on the river ) happens more then 50% of the time ( so your always a dog if your called and they catch, cause their on a nut draw and will raise you if they hit and your screwed ). A3sx sounds to me like your willing to raise with a dangler ( dangler= 1 totally useless card ). I know it gets tempting in late pos, but only when it's a short table.

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Yes I am talking about Limit Omaha 8 here not PLO8. There is no way to take a pot down in LO8 at 10/20c

dj11 said:

I think the mixer says it is LO8 not PLO8, and in my book it is a different animal. Too often you can not bet an opponent off the pot before he see's the river. So for that reason I would prefer to see the flops as cheap as possible, thus Wizzim's comment.

As much as we would all like to see sanity at a higher level, it just plainly ain't ever gonna happen. Maybe at the mega stakes, but nothing in this range.

In O8 in general, I am a fan of sneak a peek with decent hands, maybe even some skip connected middle of the pack hands like 578J, or 468T but probably you need to fold a few more hands and tighten up your current range. As often as not our actions affect their actions, so by raising too often we set off some bizarre feeding frenzy which tho lucrative if you win, is devastating as often or more.

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Thanks I will take all of this into consideration. I am playing about 26/6 at these levels. The guy at my table right now is playing 74/23 and is ahead. Thsi is the way most of these tables play out. Not just a fluke.

I never raise with ace 2 or low hands, ace 2 3 ace 2 4 etc. Yes you are building a pot but since youve raised people will smell a rat. They will check down to you and pot is not as big as you want it. Another scenario why dont raise is if 2 high cards come you got fold. 1 high card comes people betting then raising and your calling with ace 2 trying hit a low and you will be counterfieted 25% of the time. If just limp in let everyone in then bigger pot for you to split or scoop. Let people in as when hit 2 pair and some hits top pair your going get a good pot for you to split.

eamesy4980 said:

I never raise with ace 2 or low hands, ace 2 3 ace 2 4 etc. Yes you are building a pot but since youve raised people will smell a rat. T

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First let me say I am not playing/raising low hands without any chance for hi and of course the scoop.

Let me ask you this honestly. Do you think that people that play 76/6 can smell anything or care what cards I have vs what they see in their hands.

I think the problem in most of the discussions that we have are about people who play like maniacs and win and they given way too much credit for actually being good players. If a person is makng money and I am losing money i guess one of the possibilities is that they are better at the game than I am. But if that is the case then all the theories we talk about and all the starting hand ranges that are considered worth playing must be dismissed.

If I raise with A2 and he calls and I raise with A8 and he/they calls then my cards are not their concern.

Im not sure but my experience of playing it, when ive raised with ace 2 and no one else raised itl just get checked to me. Myabe thats just because showed strength which is what you dont want to do. Or they suspect you have good low and not prepared to be reraised by yoru low if they holding high only hands. But if never raised youl get them betting their high only hands while you take the low side or possibly scoop.

So with that in mind we should never check raise either because they will catch onto this?

if check raising just builds a pot and doesnt get them folding when you dont wnat them too then cool. But if its going to get rid of players that would build a pot that you want when just got low hand then no i wouldnt check raise. Id just call.

Six days of losing sessions and throw in a few SnGs to boot. Started with $133 in the BR at PS now down to $108.

Not feeling too good about my game. After my 2010 post I would have thought I was gonna think better about the game but the last few days have been really bad.

I've had my ups and downs with LO8. I lost like $200 on UB trying to learn the game, at first my focus was really on A2 and A3 hands, but the fact is you gotta look at hands that have scoop potential. Nothing wrong with all high hands, an A2 or an A3 is sort of nice, but I'll throw these away if there's no suits and it's like A3Q7, like that's just garbage. Naked A2 and A3 hands are sometimes good for half the pot, and other times good for a quarter. I've been having a little more success with this game after realizing that. Give me a DS, two high card A4 hand over a crappy A2 anyday.

Thanks I will keep those pointers in mind next time I sit down to play.

BenLZ said:

I've had my ups and downs with LO8. I lost like $200 on Ultimatebet trying to learn the game, at first my focus was really on A2 and A3 hands, but the fact is you gotta look at hands that have scoop potential. Nothing wrong with all high hands, an A2 or an A3 is sort of nice, but I'll throw these away if there's no suits and it's like A3Q7, like that's just garbage. Naked A2 and A3 hands are sometimes good for half the pot, and other times good for a quarter. I've been having a little more success with this game after realizing that. Give me a DS, two high card A4 hand over a crappy A2 anyday.

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How are you playing your hands on the flop? Your starting hand selection seems ok, I'd raise a little less, so i wonder if your play on the flop and later streets could be the problem.

I feel ya

I have the same thing happen to me occasionally,and I've found the best solution is to take a break.I find that when you start having losing sessions over and over again it's just best to walk away for a day or more.If your anything like me you start losing confidence in your game and then you'll try to manufacture a win which will only make it worse.

kmixer said:

I have not changed my game at all. Been playing A2 for a raise form most positions. Playing A3sx from all positions and for a raise from late positions and playing AAxx as long as the xx are two cards that play well with the AA especially a pair that is not suited to the A.

Seeing all of these laggy donkies taking down big pots and having 10$ win sessions playing 72/5

Should I hang in there and keep up the play with the hopes that a turn around is coming. Or do I need to make adjustments to my game?

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I see you refer to 72/5, 76/6, 74/23 - what does that mean? I don't raise a naked low (A29J) from any position. A3sxx you mean? Tie or loss is worse than quartering, if a 2 does not hit. Why would you prefer a pair that is not suited to the ace? Or was that a mistake?

Not of the opinion that you should take a break, except long enough to figure out where the holes in your game are. Unlike NL, where aggression, position, bet size, opponent reads rely on your mindset, LO8 is a more game of precision. Every play is either correct or incorrect. You have the Hwang book, right? It may not give you all the answers, but it might help.

dj11 said:

In O8 in general, I am a fan of sneak a peek with decent hands, maybe even some skip connected middle of the pack hands like 578J, or 468T but probably you need to fold a few more hands and tighten up your current range.

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Huge mistake. Those are the worst hands imaginable. You don't call bad hands on a lark or a whim, or to 'change it up' in limit. You don't see a cheap flop with a hand that has so little chance of high or low. That 468T is mathematically impossible to scoop 1) unless no one has any low cards -unlikely, or 2) The board falls A235x or something like that, also unlikely. That 2 gapper at the J is suicide. I have a feeling those 2 examples are not in kmixer's range. If so, he is beyond any help I could offer. lol

kmixer said:

From up front yes I will limp to encourage more people to come in behind. From later positions I will raise because I know the limpers ahead of me and the blinds are most likely not going anywhere for one more bet and the pot is built. As far as building multi way pots go, yesterday at this one table I had seen A2 at showdown in three people's hands with the low on board 4 out of 29 times (are those odds realistic for this game?) so in this case I am not thinking the multiway pots were a good idea. But just try to get a micro player to fold A2. I dont care if he has nothing to go with it. I quit playing ring PLO8 because even when you win you lose.

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The first 2 sentences - correct play.

While 4 of 29 maybe be a teensy bit high (maybe by 1), it is realistic at full ring. But you answered your own question. It's that high because you won't get anyone to fold it. But you want a multi-way pot. Hwang covers this very well. When you quarter a pot, you want as many in it as possible. You will raise this when there are more than 3 people in the pot, especially after the turn, when the bets are double and people making mistakes are pot committed. hehehe

When there are 4 or more in the pot, worst you'll usually do is break even or better if there's dead money in ther pot. Worst you can actually do (that 4 out of 29) is lose 1/6 of the pot, and that is ONLY if there are 4 people in the pot. Max loss is 1/6, but it's probably much less than that, with the dead money. So, in the small chance you 1/6th the pot, it is still correct to reraise the nut low with more than 3 in the pot. It is just unfortunate, but never a big mistake.

Dive thanks for the reply.

In the first quoted part the numbers I am referring to are the VPIP/PFR numbers I have on my opponents. That is the number of hands they play by percentage and the amount of times they raise pre flop

Thanks. Had no idea.