Originally Posted by 888jamie888
I'd count outs as cards that would probably put you in a winning position.
If I had A2, I wouldn't count the 3 other 2's as outs. If that's what you mean?
There's a concept called discounted or partial outs. Many times, cards that improve your hand don't give you the nuts, but still give you some chance to win the hand. So for example, if you're drawing to a flush that would be the effective nuts, you can count 9 outs, all of which are clean.
But if there's a chance you'll make your flush and still lose, those 9 outs are worth less. The tricky part is gauging how much less, but as an example, let's say you're drawing to a non-nut flush, and that even when you hit it, you think you'll lose 1/3 of the time. In calculating the odds
, you'd use 6 outs instead of 9.