Is Limping In Really so Bad?

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johnny2shoes

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im not sure but the advice u get here at cc is stop limping in, is this really good advice for new micro players?? ive been watching while playing and people have lost lots of cash when they miss the flop and if your very new to the game they then have a hard decision what to do next, also what range are you saying dont limp, ive started limping a bit myself with stuff like, A,J, K,10, K,J and J,J n lower, anythig higher i get it in, im still new at the game since dec ,would like more veiws on this by the more experienced.:toilet:
 
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WizardRubic

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I don't like limping in with certain hands because it'll lead to an unbalanced range. I don't know how the play is like at the site you're on, but that's bad if they can catch on.

Even if they don't, your letting them see the flop for free with worse hands. If you raise whenever you're more likely to have an advantage, you'll increase the likelihood of winning more than what the blinds take.
 
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hffjd2000

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For newbies, books will tell you to have short ranges when entering while for old timers, they can widen their ranges.
Newbies will have a hard time on latter streets because of selection of starting hands.
Hands you mention above are troubled hands, limping or calling.

Goodluck...
 
Lotok

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If I'm dealt decent cards and I know a pre-flop raise will make everyone fold, I limp. It means more folk are likely to call also and create a larger pot. Heck, if they all check, I sometimes check also (when on button), so they will pay in a little more with a buy attempt
 
T0mmmi

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In my opinion limping is ok with certain small pair like 22 - 99 im middle or late position to be able to hit set o Flop...If not....just fold to any raise. There are many players who limp a lot ...sometimes they get lucky (limp with 74s ) and hit Flush or Draw but for most cases it is just waste of chips that could be used for more aggressive play. I do not like limping and if there are some before me ..i just make bigger raise and most if not all fold. But you have to have premium hands for such play. Not sure if this will help you...if so ..I am glad ! :)
 
Dubstep

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In general RAISE OR FOLD never call. The only time you limp is with suited connecters and small pairs and suited aces if you have a medium to big stack. Do not limp ever with a short stack. On the flop raise or fold. The only time to call on the flop is with a flush draw an straight draw and you need better than 1/3 odds on the flop and 1/6 odds on the turn to make a profitable call. I wouldnt worry about implied odds for a new player. Do you play tournaments or cash games? For a new player only play good hands. Raise with JJ-AA and AQ-AK. And bet the pot with top pair, check and fold if you miss or there is a higher pair. Limp with 22-1010 and play only for sets. This roughly how a beginner should play at the micro s. A new player first should learn how to play tight. So go on google and search how to play tight and aggressive poker.
 
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thanx for all advice, i play 5nl and freerolls on stars,i do ok usually up a couple of dollars at the end of the day,i usually get in the small cash in the privl freeroll, came 22 out of 8000 two days ago would of got finall table exept for my A,A got cracked by trip JJJ when he riverd a J. still making silly mistakes that cost me chips but improving, less mistakes. thanx all.
 
JusSumguy

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miss the flop and if your very new to the game they then have a hard decision what to do next,
It doesn't matter what you think. What matters is what they think.

Limp... they think weak
Raise... they think strong. And if an A hits the flop, but misses you, you can claim that A because you PF raised.

-
 
trolaAa

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I will tell u my opinion :)
Do not limp
Raise or fold.
 
jazzaxe

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Limping and obtaining cheap flops can work at a table where all the action is generally postflop. There are micro games where you will see this. It is not necessarily good poker, but can be successful if you don't mind folding often and waiting for a killer flop.
 
Arjonius

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Limping modest hands is a great way to bleed slowly. Every time you miss the flop and fold, it costs 1bb. But that's just part of the problem. Even when you do hit the flop, you often have hands that can be difficult and thus expensive to play - TP poor kicker, 2nd or 3rd pair, non-nut draws, etc. Sure, you'll flop big occasionally, but overall, not enough to make up your limping profitable.

This is especially true for a newer player who probably is below average in terms of having the knowledge and ability to win enough pots with marginal hands, to minimize losses by knowing when to fold, to pot control, etc.
 
Propane Goat

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If you're wondering whether or not limping in frequently hoping to strike gold will pay off, just look at how hard it is to actually hit the flop at all, as compared to flopping full houses, straights, flushes, which is what people hope to hit.

Also, take into account that when you limp in and if you do flop the nuts, the villain(s) also has to flop something strong enough that will cause him to pay you off, which is even more unlikely in combination. What happens more often than not on that rare occasion when you do flop the nuts, is that everybody runs and hides and you get no more value.

Another issue I see often is that people will limp in with something like A3, there's a Ace on the flop, and you see them leave broke at the end of the hand because somebody else had a better Ace and they couldn't fold. Top pair/bad kicker is lethal to new players, even more so in early position.

The reason newbies are told to stick to only premium hands is that doing this removes most of the difficult post-flop decisions that take experience to make correctly.
 
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ala6

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IMHO if you do not limp at all you are very soon low on chips in MMT. Limp is fine with some hands but you must be self-controled and fold if you do not get flop you expected. Eg. KQ flop A,K,9 = FOLD

I see now - I used in exapmle good hand which require Raise.

Better example is 10,9 flop J,10,6
 
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Limping is very exploitable IMO. 90% of the time if someone tries to limp into the pot I will raise them or try and isolate them. To me a limp is a sure sign of a new player. If you're going to play a pot step up and play the pot afirmatively. Limping shows a timid mindset (Again IMO)

My suggestion is to work on playing from position. Be tight, and be aggressive.
 
Propane Goat

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Limping is very exploitable IMO. 90% of the time if someone tries to limp into the pot I will raise them or try and isolate them. To me a limp is a sure sign of a new player. If you're going to play a pot step up and play the pot afirmatively. Limping shows a timid mindset (Again IMO)

My suggestion is to work on playing from position. Be tight, and be aggressive.

You will occasionally encounter somebody who limps AA/KK in EP in certain situations, if done in the right spot they can bring down a huge pot.

For example, in an STT let's say player A with a 20+BB stack limps with AA UTG. A short stack, maybe around 4-5BB shoves from MP with something like KQ or a mid PP and gets calls from a couple of other 20+BB stacks with hands like ATs or AJ. Now, when the action gets back around to player A, he re-shoves all-in to isolate the short stack and more likely than not, the ones who called the initial shove will have to fold because now they would have to put most or all of their chips at risk to see a flop with easily dominated hands. This leaves a huge amount of dead money in the pot.

This is more likely to occur when blinds are high and the table is short-handed or getting close to it, just something to be aware of. In the same token, limping AA in EP at a full table when blinds are low is also asking for a lot of trouble.
 
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You will occasionally encounter somebody who limps AA/KK in EP in certain situations, if done in the right spot they can bring down a huge pot.

For example, in an STT let's say player A with a 20+BB stack limps with AA UTG. A short stack, maybe around 4-5BB shoves from MP with something like KQ or a mid PP and gets calls from a couple of other 20+BB stacks with hands like ATs or AJ. Now, when the action gets back around to player A, he re-shoves all-in to isolate the short stack and more likely than not, the ones who called the initial shove will have to fold because now they would have to put most or all of their chips at risk to see a flop with easily dominated hands. This leaves a huge amount of dead money in the pot.

This is more likely to occur when blinds are high and the table is short-handed or getting close to it, just something to be aware of. In the same token, limping AA in EP at a full table when blinds are low is also asking for a lot of trouble.

The percentage of the time this happens is so low in comparison to how many pots that can be taken down preflop (not to mention post flop when someone limps with top pair) the amount earned vs the amount lost is still at a high percentage. AA limps UTG can potentially have 6 limpers behind. That's a lot of hand to have to beat. A pretty big risk IMO. Not to say people don't do it but having AA cracked a few times after limping would sure smarten me up :)
 
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trent32la

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Never ever limp! limping only allows other people left to act to see the flop cheaply with marginal hands and gives your hand less equity.....you also now have another way to win the pot even if u miss by cbetting the flop since you initially raised....The only time you should be limping is if you want a ton of callers which is rare! Ive seen people limp trash hands and end up going broke on hands because they let others limp behind and outflop them...its not a good idea! Raise preflop or toss your hand.
 
el_magiciann

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I think every hand that you think is good you should better raise than just limp, i don't see any benefit of limping mate!
 
JusSumguy

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I think every hand that you think is good you should better raise than just limp, i don't see any benefit of limping mate!
What if you're facing a raise from a TAG, and you have AT?

-
 
Keith_MM

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What if you're facing a raise from a TAG, and you have AT?

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question is too vague , what stakes , what positions are you and he playing from, whats your image, how big was the raise ? did he open shove?

e.g you are in SB , TAG is UTG and he 4x a raise. easy fold as his range probably has you dominated and you are out of position for the rest of the hand.

you are in SB TAG is BTN and he min raises it and he has a high Attempt to steal and low fold to resteal - easy 3 bet for value (since he has a wide weak range and will stick with it hoping to connect on later streets) and you likely have the bext hand if he continues.

etc.
 
Diogo Jorge

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i use to limp when i have low pair of hand, or suited connectors when i'm out of position if not i dont limp. I just fold or raise. What do you think about that?
 
IPlay

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If I'm dealt decent cards and I know a pre-flop raise will make everyone fold, I limp. It means more folk are likely to call also and create a larger pot. Heck, if they all check, I sometimes check also (when on button), so they will pay in a little more with a buy attempt

I am curious how you know everyone will fold? Please tell me your secret? :D

Seriously though if you limp with AA and get 4 callers your AA is going to lose about 60% of the time(I'm pretty sure something like that) which makes it an obvious bad play.
Look at it like this, you can limp and get 4 callers for a 5BB pot on the flop or you can raise 3BB and everyone fold but one guy and have around a 6BB pot against only 1 opponent.
 
punctual

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One of the most important things a poker player should always be trying to do is be the master of the table. Which is to say, the player through whom all bets seem to flow. You don't become the master of a table by limping. You ahve to be aggressive and put the pain on some players before you can earn this title. You must be unpredictable.

Now limping in with strong handsis not recommended because you are allowing other people who may have weaker starting hands to draw on something. If you had raised, some of these people with weaker hands may have folded at the pre-flop stage. So, in a sense, raising preflop with top hands allows you to have a better indication of what people have in their hands at the flop and beyond stage because you will have for the most part weeded out all the weak hands preflop
 
Lotok

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I am curious how you know everyone will fold? Please tell me your secret? :D

Seriously though if you limp with AA and get 4 callers your AA is going to lose about 60% of the time(I'm pretty sure something like that) which makes it an obvious bad play.
Look at it like this, you can limp and get 4 callers for a 5BB pot on the flop or you can raise 3BB and everyone fold but one guy and have around a 6BB pot against only 1 opponent.

By watching people and how they play, if the stronger players folded and I know the ones left in tend to fold on raise preflop then I would call. I do understand your point though about letting others flop a good hand.

More of an online tactic as you don't usually get as many weak players in live games.



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10058765

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Limping alot is wrong.
Limping every now and than is ok if you don't always do it with the same hands, such as low pocket pairs.
Mixing it up is ok and limping every now and than is part of that.
 
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