Is it ever right to fold AA preflop? :)

U

UncleConRon

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My input.

I would fold aces the third time i get them. Aces win about two thirds of the time. leaving a third where you get caught with them. The guy on television played it correct and avoided a serious loss.
 
NCDaddy

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If I was on the bubble of the wsop....I could fold Aces. I'd have a hard time doing it....but I could. In the video that you posted, that was a stupid fold. You need to 3 bet it. And you re-raise it to get the 6s and 4s to fold and take down the pot. If Laak calls and hits, so be it.
 
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joe777

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Probably on the bubble of a satellite against 3-5 players all-in.
 
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nyolcas

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Agree with NCDaddy. It was a stupid fold. Why? Raise to achieve a fold on 4-4 and 6-6.
 
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MikeyE8

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If there are around 4 or 5 people all-in you could fold aces because your chances would go down and variance could send you home. But with less than 4 people I would just go all-in because you will have the best hand.
 
Yermek

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The guy with the AA has a good sense of danger :D
 
KenZZel

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I think A A is dangerous vs 3+ players preflop
 
SteaknEggz

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its very rare but its ok to fold on the bubble if you really really need to min cash for some reason. using good BR management you should never be in this spot and should be able to play your AA. :)
 
Kavaleits

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Before flop i think i wouldn't fold Aces, but at flop, turn or river, if you see that you cant win with this Aces, then it can be easy fold.
But usually its hard to fold Aces.:)
 
Greg Austin

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I would fold on the bubble to cash in, It would be hard because there would always be that what if question but money is money and for the right amount yes i would fold them.
 
edc1

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im not sure i could make a dold with aces pre-flop-i would have to def mull it over-ive folded kings pre a few times-the bigger the tourny the harder it would be
 
detroitjunkie

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the correct answer is yes - BUT only in a satellite scenario and only on the bubble.

Also, AA is a favorite until 6 or more players are in the hand against you, only at this point is the 'field' favored to win.

In this video it is a crime to say the fold was correct, it was completely and utterly wrong! Do not confuse results with correct play.
 
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ph_il

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Folding AA, in all situations except for a specific satellite situation, would be the wrong play.

However, you all have to understand what was going on in the video. Fishman was on a show called The Big Game. Simply put, a player (loose cannon) is staked 100K and gets to play 150 hands in a PL pre/NL post style of hold 'em. After 150 hands, they get to keep any profit they had made and the player with the most profit gets a 50K MTT package deal or something like that.

In the hand Fishman was up 140K in profits and his initial plan was to fold the last 50 or so hands left and keep most of the profits. Blinds were 200/400/100 ante, and 6 handed, so Fishman only had to play ~9 more rotations and pay out ~6300 in blinds and antes, earning him over 130K in profits. And I believed he also earned the 50K MTT package as well.

Was it a crazy fold. Yeah, but I can understand someone who is up 140K not wanting to lose any of it. That's probably life changing money for that player. He came there with a plan and stuck with it, so kudos to him. Was it correct to fold AA there? Well, without being result oriented...I don't know. Part of me says I'd at least call and see a flop. The other part of me might think "In just 50 hands, you're up $130K and you have a $50K MTT package in the bag."
 
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ph_il

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I would fold aces the third time i get them. Aces win about two thirds of the time. leaving a third where you get caught with them. The guy on television played it correct and avoided a serious loss.
lol.

Are you saying you fold AA every 3rd time you get them because they lose 1/3rd of the time? That's just stupid. If not, how do you determine when to fold/when to hold your AA?

Oh, and you know that poker results aren't linear, right? As in, just because you won with AA 2x in a row, you're probably going to lose the 3rd time, so you better fold. You already won 2/3 times with AA, don't want to press your luck....because that's not how it works.

So, I'd really like to hear your formula on when to play/not to play AA.
 
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sking111

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only on the bubble where there is a good cash......
 
NCDaddy

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Folding AA, in all situations except for a specific satellite situation, would be the wrong play.

However, you all have to understand what was going on in the video. Fishman was on a show called The Big Game. Simply put, a player (loose cannon) is staked 100K and gets to play 150 hands in a PL pre/NL post style of hold 'em. After 150 hands, they get to keep any profit they had made and the player with the most profit gets a 50K MTT package deal or something like that.

In the hand Fishman was up 140K in profits and his initial plan was to fold the last 50 or so hands left and keep most of the profits. Blinds were 200/400/100 ante, and 6 handed, so Fishman only had to play ~9 more rotations and pay out ~6300 in blinds and antes, earning him over 130K in profits. And I believed he also earned the 50K MTT package as well.

Was it a crazy fold. Yeah, but I can understand someone who is up 140K not wanting to lose any of it. That's probably life changing money for that player. He came there with a plan and stuck with it, so kudos to him. Was it correct to fold AA there? Well, without being result oriented...I don't know. Part of me says I'd at least call and see a flop. The other part of me might think "In just 50 hands, you're up $130K and you have a $50K MTT package in the bag."

Why not raise and make even more profit when 66 and 44 folds? The point of poker is to make money. You don't make money folding premium hands. I get the gist of what you're saying though. I just don't agree with it.
 
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heraldyswift

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Before flop i think i wouldn't fold Aces, but at flop, turn or river, if you see that you cant win with this Aces, then it can be easy fold.
But usually its hard to fold Aces.:)

Same
 
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ph_il

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Why not raise and make even more profit when 66 and 44 folds? The point of poker is to make money. You don't make money folding premium hands. I get the gist of what you're saying though. I just don't agree with it.
It was pot-limit pre and 44 and 66 are probably not folding.

True, you wont make money if you keep folding premium hands, but I think in this situation, it was ok. Fishman is probably never going to play these stakes again and he had already made a ton of money. I think if we take it from Fishman's perspective, who is a math teacher IIRC, +$140K is huge and I don't think he wanted to take any more risks losing that money. Or he didn't want to play post flop and get into a bad situation that could risk his profits. So, he decided to just stop while he was ahead and I think that was a viable strategy.
 
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ph_il

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I tend to fold AA preflop if it puts all or most of my chips at risk because of seeing too many suckouts online. In live poker I am much more likely to play them. I hate AA online unless I can play for just BB or a small raise.:D
That's a very result oriented way of playing.
 
Sil3ntness

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Fold AA preflop if the biggest stack shoves pre and we're 2nd in chips on a satellite bubble. Huge moment of ICM. It's either all or nothing. There's no consolation prize for bubbling.
 
detroitjunkie

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I was not aware of the crazy format that this game was, so in retrospect maybe it wasnt a terrible fold...however, I would still have potted preflop I think.
 
chory1414

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woww, nice hand, i never fold AA preflop
 
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