I finally understand Bankroll Management

mmm, bank role management.

I think I Finally know what it means..

Right.. if every hand you ever played from now on was AA vs KK you with the AA of course... you would be delighted.. and let me tell you that you would be all in for every single one of these hands.. Forever

Life would be good.. you would be the best winning poker player in the history of the world. Ever!!!!

But wait for just one second... AA is a 81.25% Vs KK which has 18.74% (when your suits don't clash) this means... that in every 100 hands you play, you will lose 18-19 of them...

Holy crap... 18 or 19 times..., but you win 81 times...

Now.. what happens if you have your entire bankroll on the table for every one of these hands that you are playing? Well you would lose your entire bankroll 18 times in 100.

Shoot..... that's not good..

So when you follow Bankroll management properly (like I am starting to learn to do) you play with only one 20th to one 50th... (that's 1/20 to 1/50) of your available cash at any time... That way, when the 18 or 19 times you lose with AA Vs KK all happen in a row... you are fine. And what happens when you lose the hand 36 times in a row.. it could happen... You're still fine

So, don't risk all your money at once.. even if every hand is AA vs KK

from here - https://www.cardschat.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=757&stc=1&d=1146365596

People shouldnt confuse the tournaments chart for SnG's, you don't need 50 buyins to play sit n goes, more like 30.

Ive only recently PRACTISED good bankroll management, its all well and good understanding it but putting it into practice and sticking with it is another thing entirely, i'm currently playing 5nl with a starting roll of $100, even with a shocking first few sessions where i dropped as low as $82 this was still a comfortable amount. I've decided not to move up to 10nl until i get to $250 though just to add a bit more of a cushion, every move up from there i'm planning on having 30 buyins in the bank before hand.

GL

Not to mention that with good bankroll management, swallowing a really bad beat is was easier!! less pressure

orangepeeleo said:

People shouldnt confuse the tournaments chart for SnG's, you don't need 50 buyins to play sit n goes, more like 30.

Ive only recently PRACTISED good bankroll management, its all well and good understanding it but putting it into practice and sticking with it is another thing entirely, i'm currently playing 5nl with a starting roll of $100, even with a shocking first few sessions where i dropped as low as $82 this was still a comfortable amount. I've decided not to move up to 10nl until i get to $250 though just to add a bit more of a cushion, every move up from there i'm planning on having 30 buyins in the bank before hand.

GL

Click to expand...

You are smarter than me, I played 25nl with a roll of 100 $, which resulted in a roll of 50 , I played to scared even when I believed to have the best hand I didn't bet it enough.

The problem for me is patience before climbing up a level, and also finding the right balance, playing 5nl with 100 $ is the right way but I feel when you lose there, the loss doesn't sting enough which also affects my game
in a negative way.

The scared money thing is a big reason why proper BRM is effective, you cant raise your pocket tens in the CO and then cbet a JQ5 flop without a decent roll behind you but you should be cbetting, obv not that flop every single time but u get what i mean.

Losing 2 or 3 BI's (like $15) does sting me a bit but not in a monetary sort of way, just a, damn it now i've gotta grind that back up way. As long as i made the right move even if i got fished out then i'm happy, i'm beating 5nl right now and i'll be at 10nl soon it's just a matter of being patient and moving up when i can take the swings, i just think of it as practice for the big game, i'm gonna be up there at 100,200nl one day but you gotta learn your trade somewhere.

I dont believe in BRM.

I deposit $20 and i go play $3 and $5 MTT. You gotta take a chance and hope for the best. playing $1 SNGs would take forever to build up.

orangepeeleo said:

People shouldnt confuse the tournaments chart for SnG's, you don't need 50 buyins to play sit n goes, more like 30.

Ive only recently PRACTISED good bankroll management, its all well and good understanding it but putting it into practice and sticking with it is another thing entirely, i'm currently playing 5nl with a starting roll of $100, even with a shocking first few sessions where i dropped as low as $82 this was still a comfortable amount. I've decided not to move up to 10nl until i get to $250 though just to add a bit more of a cushion, every move up from there i'm planning on having 30 buyins in the bank before hand.

GL

Click to expand...

Attached to this is the graph of one of the best sng players ever. If you sharkscope SpaceGravy you'll see he has over 285k lifetime profits in sngs. He made a bet for the month that he could make 40k in 30 days. He didn't even give himself odds. He still barely got action, he's that good. These are all $60 sngs, and he goes from a high point of around 3k to a low point of around -3k, this is a 100 buy-in swing from one of the best sng players today. I'm pretty sure playing sngs with a 30 buy-in bankroll is just asking to go broke.

edit: file too large, here's link: http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/5171/gravybw1.png

zachvac said:

Attached to this is the graph of one of the best sng players ever. If you sharkscope SpaceGravy you'll see he has over 285k lifetime profits in sngs. He made a bet for the month that he could make 40k in 30 days. He didn't even give himself odds. He still barely got action, he's that good. These are all $60 sngs, and he goes from a high point of around 3k to a low point of around -3k, this is a 100 buy-in swing from one of the best sng players today. I'm pretty sure playing sngs with a 30 buy-in bankroll is just asking to go broke.

edit: file too large, here's link: http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/5171/gravybw1.png

Click to expand...

I have to agree with Zach here. I am an avearge SnG player and before I practicsed BRM I used a 20 buy-in rule. Now I use 50 very stricltly. I'll even make sure I have ~55 before moving up a level just in case.

If you think you can do it with 30, GL, but beware variance affects everyone and anyone from the biggest donk to the best pro.

FWIW - I'm speaking from expirence in over 4000 SnG's across Stars, Titan Pacific and a few others.

Better to be on the side of cautrion, the more buy-ins the safer you'll be.

GL

luckytvguy said:

oh,i dont this above sentence is right all the time.

when in tournament,you have to risk all your chips several times.

Click to expand...

You need to read the orginal post all the way through, Esp. this portion of the OP (quoted below). Are you willing to risk every penny of your poker BR on a single hand? If you are then you have no clue how to manage your bankroll and won't last a day before you're completely broke.

Bigsmak said:

Now.. what happens if you have your entire bankroll on the table for every one of these hands that you are playing? Well you would lose your entire bankroll 18 times in 100.

Shoot..... that's not good..

Click to expand...

Pretty clear what the OP meant now isn't it?

zachvac said:

Attached to this is the graph of one of the best sng players ever. If you sharkscope SpaceGravy you'll see he has over 285k lifetime profits in sngs. He made a bet for the month that he could make 40k in 30 days. He didn't even give himself odds. He still barely got action, he's that good. These are all $60 sngs, and he goes from a high point of around 3k to a low point of around -3k, this is a 100 buy-in swing from one of the best sng players today. I'm pretty sure playing sngs with a 30 buy-in bankroll is just asking to go broke.

edit: file too large, here's link: http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/5171/gravybw1.png

Click to expand...

Thats some crazy swings!! sorry, i forgot to mention that when i played SnG's i was only playing with a huge... 1 table's lol a sng pro is maybe playing like 20+ i'm guessing???? (which is the reason for me moving into cash games rather than concentrate on SnG's) in which case 30 buyins is clearly not enough, probably 50 isn't either for that amount of play, it obv depends on how many tables you are playing, i never had a problem with 30 buyins playing 1 or 2 tables at a time but thats just a recreational player, i was only playing like 3 or 4 a night maybe.

Zachs clearly got a lot of exp and knowledge and i'd take his word over mine but it depends on a lot of things, personal circumstance (i.e if you were to lose a $100 roll could you replace it easily), your own style of play and the volume of your play, i think 30 was plenty for me but for others it might be a bit low.

As with any BRM strategy it's all relative and can depend on many factors including your own personality. By that I mean, 'how much risk aversion' your used to.

I'm usually a bankroll nit, but I did play SnG's, and yeah it can have huge variance. But I think operating a strict 'drop down' policy, then having a 25-30 buy in BRM can be possible. But you have to be really disciplined!