Busted my Bankroll, taking a break, seeking friendly advice!

Hi all, so here is the cliff's notes on my story:

1) Many years ago, I spent a year making a living playing basement tournaments. I dreamed of playing in the wsop someday, and poker was just something I loved everything about. So I'm not entirely new, but maybe a little rusty because after that year... (hanging out with different crowds, etc.) it's been a long time since I played.

2) A new casino just opened up 10 minutes down the road and just for fun I thought I'd splurge a whopping $50 at a ($2-4 Limit) table. Turned that into $300 and was *hooked*!

3) So I made it a daily hobby of mine, playing for a few hours. At first I jumped between 2-4 Limit and 1-3 NL, then eventually stuck with NL only. I never really chased big profits, was happy to walk with 50% profit or so.

4) That's how I turned $50 into $1500 in just a few weeks.

5) But that f***ing downswing hit, and it hit hard. Apparently I must've gotten pretty tilted because that seemed to last a few days. Despite practicing good bankroll management, I still hit a series of bad losses and now I'm back down to $0.

6) If I built up that bankroll once, I know I can do it again but not in this state of mind. So I'm taking a nice long break to get my head right.

Lol it's gonna be kinda hard to go through that break because it has become such a routine to head down there every morning after the kids go to school, but if I try to jump back in now I know I'll just be making poor choices and chasing what's gone.

My goal is to become a better poker player. To play the long game. To not lose myself to the thrill of gambling-- including the highs of winning and the depression of losing. I *have* that kind of patience & self control/discipline yet I'm still here asking for tips on what kind of goals I should accomplish before I decide to hit the felt again?

Would anyone suggest playing "free poker" (like that WSOP App?) or just cut it out entirely for a few days/weeks?

I think you should cut it out entirely for a one week to de-stress yourself just do your other hobbies, then you can try to play some freerolls firstly and then come back to true poker

Mazak said:

I think you should cut it out entirely for a one week to de-stress yourself just do your other hobbies, then you can try to play some freerolls firstly and then come back to true poker

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Thanks! I keep hearing about freerolls, is that an online poker thing? Is there one that you can play in the US, in NY? I don't think I would really try putting any money online but a freeroll might be worth a shot.

Breaks are key.

It'll work wonders if you can just step away for a good week or so.

For me it had to be things I could similarly just lose my mind in, and relax, such as video games.

But no, the free play money stuff is bad.. it'll make the problem worse.

DomGov said:

Breaks are key.

It'll work wonders if you can just step away for a good week or so.

For me it had to be things I could similarly just lose my mind in, and relax, such as video games.

But no, the free play money stuff is bad.. it'll make the problem worse.

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Good point! I plan on working on some mixed media art projects as a distraction but it might be a good idea to break out Fall Out 4 or The Last of Us and take a real mind-cation.

I had a feeling that "free poker" might make it worse, but I wasn't sure. Some people say to try that before going back but I've only ever tried that WSOP app and it gave me a headache... all-in preflops galore. Come to think of it, maybe that contributed to this to begin with lol

Caryn,

In reply: Im from US, Pennsylvania. Yes you can sign up online at any number of sites, Bet-on-line probably has the most freerolls and on a daily schedule. So you can play poker tournaments regularly for $o investment if you choose. As for your "downswing" maybe I am reading it wrong but it seems as though this all occurred in a few weeks or month?? If so that is "poker" a downswing is losing over the course of a certain sample size. I am not going to commit to a certain length of time because it can vary for people but having 2 or 3 winning sessions followed by a losing 1 or 3 , I don't think qualifies?? I mean even the best cash players in the world experience winning and losing sessions, so anyway, get on the freeroll grind gain back that confidence and then give them hell. Good Luck on the tables...unless I am on 1 of them.

jsnake716 said:

Caryn,

In reply: Im from US, Pennsylvania. Yes you can sign up online at any number of sites, Bet-on-line probably has the most freerolls and on a daily schedule. So you can play poker tournaments regularly for $o investment if you choose. As for your "downswing" maybe I am reading it wrong but it seems as though this all occurred in a few weeks or month?? If so that is "poker" a downswing is losing over the course of a certain sample size. I am not going to commit to a certain length of time because it can vary for people but having 2 or 3 winning sessions followed by a losing 1 or 3 , I don't think qualifies?? I mean even the best cash players in the world experience winning and losing sessions, so anyway, get on the freeroll grind gain back that confidence and then give them hell. Good Luck on the tables...unless I am on 1 of them.

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Thanks, I may look into it but I think that any freeplay/free poker could make the problem worse. I had about 30 something winning sessions with reasonable variance (mostly breaking even, but worst case I'd walk with $50 less than my buyin, which still isn't bad.)

This downswing that busted my bankroll is the last 3 sessions... and I should have known to take this break after the first one but instead I got put on tilt and apparently shifted into this perspective of wanting to "win back" what I'd lost. That's a lesson for me, and it won't happen again... I guess I needed this bust to be reminded of it.

If you really want to make money you need to work on your discipline. You have none, not going to sugar coat it because playing for money vs entertainment are totally different. Playing to win money is a job just like any other. If your boss said take 200.00 and buy lunch but you decide to take 1500.00 you most likely would get fired. Why is this any different? That really is how important bankroll management is.It's cold, calculated, final, and not negotiable. If you lose your steak for the day you are done. You play tomorrow. It seems harsh, but until you do this you will never be profitable. I know so great players that are always broke and some average players who make a good living.

karl coakley said:

If you really want to make money you need to work on your discipline. You have none, not going to sugar coat it because playing for money vs entertainment are totally different. Playing to win money is a job just like any other. If your boss said take 200.00 and buy lunch but you decide to take 1500.00 you most likely would get fired. Why is this any different? That really is how important bankroll management is.It's cold, calculated, final, and not negotiable. If you lose your steak for the day you are done. You play tomorrow. It seems harsh, but until you do this you will never be profitable. I know so great players that are always broke and some average players who make a good living.

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You're absolutely right. I did make some poor choices and I'm thankful for this experience... including the time I'll take to really let the lesson sit in so it doesn't continue.

First mistake was going to the casino in a bad mood. The rest of the mistakes could've been avoided but I needed to bust my bankroll to reach that clarity-- there's a difference between knowing/understanding something and KNOWING (through experience). All mistakes are lessons in disguise.

karl coakley said:

If you really want to make money you need to work on your discipline. You have none, not going to sugar coat it because playing for money vs entertainment are totally different. Playing to win money is a job just like any other. If your boss said take 200.00 and buy lunch but you decide to take 1500.00 you most likely would get fired. Why is this any different? That really is how important bankroll management is.It's cold, calculated, final, and not negotiable. If you lose your steak for the day you are done. You play tomorrow. It seems harsh, but until you do this you will never be profitable. I know so great players that are always broke and some average players who make a good living.

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Great tips, congratulations!

I identified with your post, I started without control and discipline.

After organizing my BR and strategies, I felt that the safety of my game was different, it seems crazy but things flowed better.

Mind is powerful, likes to knock us down in these bad moments in the game if we do not have a certain control, that deep breath and leave outside

Caryn said:

Thanks! I keep hearing about freerolls, is that an online poker thing? Is there one that you can play in the US, in NY? I don't think I would really try putting any money online but a freeroll might be worth a shot.

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Where I live there are a lot of Bar Game freerolls. If you can deal with the stupidity and land mines I have personally won a few hundred out of those games. Its a place to start if youre looking to build a bankroll for live games. Good luck

MinisterBobby said:

Where I live there are a lot of Bar Game freerolls. If you can deal with the stupidity and land mines I have personally won a few hundred out of those games. Its a place to start if youre looking to build a bankroll for live games. Good luck

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Thanks, unfortunately I don't think there's anything like that near me. I'd hoped for a poker league too but no luck.

I do agree in cutting it out entirely, so u can purge yourself as to say. See how u cope with out poker for a while, could look at it as an mental exercise. Then when you feel free of any emotion towards them u can get back at it

Lerts said:

I do agree in cutting it out entirely, so u can purge yourself as to say. See how u cope with out poker for a while, could look at it as an mental exercise. Then when you feel free of any emotion towards them u can get back at it

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Eggzackery. This is reason #43 why I love poker so much TBH, I'm always learning and not just about the game but about myself. And this current lesson is all about not only how I deal with stress, but also how to recognize when it starts and how to run interference before it takes over. I'll be a better person because of it

Focus on building the bankroll steadily playing proper limits...otherwise it will continue to crash down once it gets up

Can't really be to results oriented, ur sample size was not that big to determine that your playing bad or just run in g bad

I would probably walk away for awhile to. Get the stress levels down and clear your mind of any negativity towards poker.. You'll be back in no time. But in my opinion you should ease back into it to and remember why you play the game in the first place.

Xcoder said:

I would probably walk away for awhile to. Get the stress levels down and clear your mind of any negativity towards poker.. You'll be back in no time. But in my opinion you should ease back into it to and remember why you play the game in the first place.

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Yes! I've stewed on this and:

I'm not all that upset. I only lost money I won (technically I'm still up $80 or so)... and I'm not gonna cry over spilled milk.

There's a TON of lessons for me to learn and I'm gonna take the right amount of time for it to really sink on. It's all stuff I knew but needed to experience that "rock bottom" feeling to really follow it.

When I'm ready, I shouldn't be playing the $1-3Nl cash games with a bankroll under $3-5k. Even a $1500 bankroll was too small.

I will never go to the casino in a bad mood. Ever again.

Since Limit sucks and I'm building from scratch, I'm going to focus on tournaments to build my bankroll back up. The casino I play at won't be doing those until the end of April so I've got time to "get my groove back"

Caryn,

You have the right mindset. Take a break for a bit and do your game some good. In the meantime write down your strategies, rules regarding how when and where to play , and review your BRM. You'll find that when you return you will be a force at the tables!

Best of luck.

Caryn, well it's sort of sad story you told, but i know how it is and i experienced it too. Although i lost my first $50 at cash tables online, not like you in casino. But it wasn't just loose for me and i don't think it's a loose for you. See it as an investment in your experience. That made you more steady after all. I have learned those time to stick to the bankroll management. Basically after those my loose, BR management became to me "the hallowed principle", which i wish become for you too. If you just stick to BR management - it will never happen again, that you fall to the 0 again. That's why you need this, to resist downswings, when they happen and don't go broke.
Second important thing is self-tilt-controlling. You gotta check yourself for your emotions all the time and when you start to feeling like you are angry or eager to get your money back. That's it! Enough poker for now or even for today. Just leave the table. You may playing freerolls, but not for money. Also i highly recommend you to play for money ONLY if you think you will be good concentrated and in a well state of mind. You shall not play for your money if something bothers you, if you have bad mood or had a ruffle with your wife or if you drunk a beer already or smoked a joint, if you are just awake and still sleepy or you are tired, even if your thoughts just far away from poker at the moment. DO NOT PLAY FOR YOUR MONEY IN ALL THOSE SITUATIONS! Your bankroll will thank you for that. Also is a good idea to cut off all possible irritants, while you are playing poker. Turn off mobile phone or skype, tell your family don't come in your room next couple of hours, until house is on fire and so on. Nothing shall distract you from poker.
What to do if named above requirements don't fit for your current situation, but nevertheless you are willing to play poker. Just play freerolls. That's still nice poker experience and you could even win some small money there. If you don't want playing MTTs, just play really small limit SNGs, like smallest you can find. Still better than playing at play money section thought..

Caryn said:

Thanks, I may look into it but I think that any freeplay/free poker could make the problem worse. I had about 30 something winning sessions with reasonable variance (mostly breaking even, but worst case I'd walk with $50 less than my buyin, which still isn't bad.)

This downswing that busted my bankroll is the last 3 sessions... and I should have known to take this break after the first one but instead I got put on tilt and apparently shifted into this perspective of wanting to "win back" what I'd lost. That's a lesson for me, and it won't happen again... I guess I needed this bust to be reminded of it.

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Think you might have played over your bankroll mate if that happens in 3 sessions. If you play small enough stakes you don't have to worry about variance.

And I'd suggest improving your mental game as well to reduce the effects of tilt etc. Jared Tendler's book was a nice read for me on that topic.

Nr98 said:

Think you might have played over your bankroll mate if that happens in 3 sessions. If you play small enough stakes you don't have to worry about variance.

And I'd suggest improving your mental game as well to reduce the effects of tilt etc. Jared Tendler's book was a nice read for me on that topic.

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That's actually been another conclusion reached from this "internal review"... though I'm not too sure how to approach it differently when I get back! The casino I play at has only $2-4 Limit (barely ever open, plus limit sucks) which helped me turn $50 into $300, the rest all came from $1-3NL but I'm honestly not bankrolled for that until I have at least ($10k, right?).

So, since I won't invest more than $100 personal money into building a self sustainable bankroll, how would you suggest I approach that gap when I get back? Also, there aren't any tournaments there yet, which would be my personal preference anyways.

PS- Thanks for the book recommendation, I'll check it out Tilt was definitely something I needed to experience because there's "knowing" something, and then really KNOWING it. I had to hit this "rock bottom" feeling so I could thoroughly focus on when it started, why, how, warning signs, etc.

If you feel like you're about to hit a downswing or just bad days you have to stop, you just gotta have the feeling I know it's so hard for someone who loves poker so much and hates losing (im the same way) but to be a great player you have to know and realize your run bad days

Caryn said:

Hi all, so here is the cliff's notes on my story:

1) Many years ago, I spent a year making a living playing basement tournaments. I dreamed of playing in the WSOP someday, and poker was just something I loved everything about. So I'm not entirely new, but maybe a little rusty because after that year... (hanging out with different crowds, etc.) it's been a long time since I played.

2) A new casino just opened up 10 minutes down the road and just for fun I thought I'd splurge a whopping $50 at a ($2-4 Limit) table. Turned that into $300 and was *hooked*!

3) So I made it a daily hobby of mine, playing for a few hours. At first I jumped between 2-4 Limit and 1-3 NL, then eventually stuck with NL only. I never really chased big profits, was happy to walk with 50% profit or so.

4) That's how I turned $50 into $1500 in just a few weeks.

5) But that f***ing downswing hit, and it hit hard. Apparently I must've gotten pretty tilted because that seemed to last a few days. Despite practicing good bankroll management, I still hit a series of bad losses and now I'm back down to $0.

6) If I built up that bankroll once, I know I can do it again but not in this state of mind. So I'm taking a nice long break to get my head right.

Lol it's gonna be kinda hard to go through that break because it has become such a routine to head down there every morning after the kids go to school, but if I try to jump back in now I know I'll just be making poor choices and chasing what's gone.

My goal is to become a better poker player. To play the long game. To not lose myself to the thrill of gambling-- including the highs of winning and the depression of losing. I *have* that kind of patience & self control/discipline yet I'm still here asking for tips on what kind of goals I should accomplish before I decide to hit the felt again?

Would anyone suggest playing "free poker" (like that WSOP app?) or just cut it out entirely for a few days/weeks?

Click to expand...

Were you playing with regulars, Are you aware of your own physical tells, do you have a regular betting pattern?
If you answered yes to even one of these questions, you may have a leak that was exploited by better players than you and your downswing may not be entirely based on variance.

shinedown.45 said:

Were you playing with regulars, Are you aware of your own physical tells, do you have a regular betting pattern?
If you answered yes to even one of these questions, you may have a leak that was exploited by better players than you and your downswing may not be entirely based on variance.

Click to expand...

I've pretty much narrowed it down to tilt and not having the right bankroll for $1-3 NL yet. Even at $1500, it was close. I could afford to lose one or two buyins but I made the mistake of just snowballing negative energy and my gameplay entirely shifted from the usual (controlled) to frustrated. I should have taken this break on Saturday. I shouldn't have even gone in to play when I was pissed off (about something personal)... to be specific... but one mistake led to several.

I do play with a few regulars but that hasn't been an issue. It's usually friendly play in the morning, and more profitable when the gamblers come in lol.

As far as betting pattern, I've been really good about mixing that up. (I think). When I short stack, players tend to think I'm scared or not serious. They try pushing me out with nothing, and that's how I've been doubling (or tripling) very quickly. It's why I like playing short stack. I also like to check-raise.

But not consistently. I rarely bet preflop, but that depends on positioning. I hope I don't have any tells but would love to have a mentor or coach who is local and can watch me play live and offer guidance. I'm all about getting better so I can be the best player I can be. But if nothing else, I feel that I've been underestimated a LOT because 8 out of 10 times I'm the only female playing. And I'm the only female regular.