Huge dilemma about this situation. Happens in cheap games and play money alot.
Example;
You know the table is nitty, with inexperienced players afraid to raise, but more than willing to see a flop.
You in the SB find 83o, and want to fold, you have no problem folding, but the whole table limps (10 seats for ease) and it costs you 1/2 bet into a pot of 10 bets (implied BB will check). That is 20-1 odds! Basic beginner pot odds tells you you have to call this. Even if only half the table limps, giving you 10-1 odds you pretty much have to join the party.
You don't have to do anything because odds tell you too, there are a lot of other factors in play here.
Granted, your 83o is a terrible hand, and getting away from it will be no problem, but at those odds????? Whats a guy gonna do!
Fold, there is also a thing called reverse implied odds in play here. Like the times when we flop our 8 and we are forced to fold to heavy action, or we hit and we still don't have the best hand.
Most written stuff suggests something around 7-1 almost demands limping with ATC. I at least prefer to have a face card............ And even with 2 face cards I often decide I just don't want to get involved in a potential shove fest post flop, so decide to save some chips preflop, but I do so knowing that I have the pot odds to call.
Get all of the "written stuff" you have and set it on fire, common sense and a brain is all you need to work out what to do in this situation.
Yeah it is a statistical mistake to miss an opportunity, but is also a statistical mistake to call with ATC as the sb is generally considered a losing position.
{If you fold to 9 limps, and the implied BB limp, then the poker goods will drop a flop of 883 every time you fold 83o preflop when the whole table has limped......
}
incidentally, at a full table, 10 seats, that 83o has a 9.1% chance of winning, and an AKo in that same situation only has about an 18.3% win rate. Any pair will do better, obviously. So in this example of 10 limps, you are getting 20-1 potential on a 9.1-1 stat. For clarity if you could get 20-1 on a 2-1 bet would you take it? Pot odds tell you to do it, yes.
9.1%, that is completely incorrect. It may be correct in a vacuum preflop, your forgetting the times when we hit and are forced to fold postflop, or hell, even put more money in and have to fold the turn somehow. Basically, since we are OOP it's going to be hard to know if we have the best hand, or get value from what we know to be the best hand.
If, including you, there are 5 players, the 83o increases to a win rate of 14.9%. Highest Ax hand still wins less than 30%. In that case you are getting in at 10-1, with a 14.9% chance of winning. Still good.
This is all preflop, it has no bearing in postflop play. Those numbers will drop dramatically postflop, as there is three streets of betting, and we will be OOP for all of them.
Somebody's gonna ream me a new one about these stats......
