Bankroll Management - Need Help

AlfieAA

AlfieAA

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hi guys

right, ive just started playing poker properly online, its been about a week and a half now...before that i was making millions on zynga lol...anyway i opened an account at pokerstars and deposited 10 quid ($15)...my balance is now $50, although i was upto $100 a few days ago, but got too big for my boots and bought in 2 $15 sit n go's and finished on the bubble twice....then in my tilted state of mind i bought in for $20 at $1/2 nl.....anyway.....when i first deposited i bought in for 2c/4c limit holdem, and won about $5...taking me up to $20...i then went for 10c/20c and won another $10.......when i got to $30 i went up to 25/50c limit...i have been at this level ever since and enjoy it....

although i know what im doing is wrong and far too risky...i have self belief that i can gradually win enough so that i am at that level comfortably before hopefully moving up......in the meantime im going to try and learn all about the game, theory and all....theres so much stuff to learn and all the stuff that doesnt even involve the cards themselves...i.e rakeback, huds, bankroll management etc...the list goes on....my tiny little mind cant take it all in lol....

so my question is, could someone explain bankroll management to me please, and how much i need at the 25/50c limit level and how many big blinds i need for each session...and when i know when to drop down or move up.....is it correct that i would need $60 to compete at 10c/20... i have no problem that starting at that level and working my way up to 25/50 if thats what i need to do....anyway thanks for reading, i know its probably a stupid question which you've heard a million times before, but any personal answer to this situation would be great...nice one thanks :)
 
MadMaddie

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I have never even played poker online yet but not hard to know this sounds very bad.
I think you need to have 50x the amount of the buyin you are playing.
I am putting Fifty dollars on a poker site and am not supposed to play in games that are bigger than One dollar to buyin to them. It seems like common sense. With $50 I have fifty chances to win money but if I played for more each time I could lose very fast. Anything can happen in poker. Easy to not be lucky.

I guess if you are able to put more money in your account after you lose then it could be okay:confused: I am hoping to only put money in my account one time and then try to not lose it so that I can always play poker online if I want to play.
 
Kenzie 96

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Just use the search function to find more BRM information & suggestions than you wil ever want to read.
Waste of time though, as long as you know what your doing is wrong & risky, but think believing you are special is all one needs.
Proper BRM does not prevent downturns & variance happens, which usually means, first time you have a bad run after adopting some BS BRM strategy that is really just for all them fish, you are gonna tilt away all your money anyway.
If your serious, do the search & good luck.
 
AlfieAA

AlfieAA

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I have never even played poker online yet but not hard to know this sounds very bad.
I think you need to have 50x the amount of the buyin you are playing.
I am putting Fifty dollars on a poker site and am not supposed to play in games that are bigger than One dollar to buyin to them. It seems like common sense. With $50 I have fifty chances to win money but if I played for more each time I could lose very fast. Anything can happen in poker. Easy to not be lucky.

I guess if you are able to put more money in your account after you lose then it could be okay:confused: I am hoping to only put money in my account one time and then try to not lose it so that I can always play poker online if I want to play.

yeah im like you, i dont want to deposit again, i would rather just do that the once, mainly because im skint and on the dole (unemployed) haha...but if i had to i would do it because i love the game and i think i could do ok at it once ive learned the ins and outs....so are you a live player then?
 
AlfieAA

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Just use the search function to find more BRM information & suggestions than you wil ever want to read.
Waste of time though, as long as you know what your doing is wrong & risky, but think believing you are special is all one needs.
Proper BRM does not prevent downturns & variance happens, which usually means, first time you have a bad run after adopting some BS BRM strategy that is really just for all them fish, you are gonna tilt away all your money anyway.
If your serious, do the search & good luck.

cheers man, i will put it in search and see what comes up.....yeah i know that the size of the game for the amount of money i have is wrong, but i sure as hell dont know what im doing lol, ive got the basics down, but thats about it...im trying to learn about odds and outs at the mo, while trying to understand what everything else means...i wish i could learn it all in a day, i just want to play poker...haha...good luck to you too ty
 
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CANDYMAN1414

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I have found the double up sit and gos are the best way to increase the bank roll quick. Alot of fish in those $3 triple ups and $5 double ups. Hope this helps.
 
AlfieAA

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thanks candyman i will give them a go, the newbie against the fish i wonder if i can crush them lol
 
ovitoo

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double up sng's are not the way to go....unless you're winning 80% or more the rake is killer. and from what it sounds like you should still just be mulitabling 2NL. The strategy you're using now is win or bust. The point of BRM is for winning players. It's near impossible for a winning player to lose $ using proper BRM. Everyone knows that luck is involved in certain situations. BRM allows your br to not be hurt when you run into unlucky hands/bad beats. GL sir.
 
JCgrind

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learn how to play before you bother with BRM. minimum 20BIs for each level in micros
 
AlfieAA

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cheers ovitoo and jchoop, yeah im not to keen on doing heads up, as its basically a coin flip at this stage of my ability, as i have no experience in them...could end up winning half my bankroll or losing half of it, IN ONE NIGHT hahaha....cool, i wont bother about brm at this stage then, i will just keep playing and try to make enough money so that i can do a brm......

i was hoping someone would say that because you dont make too much in limit 10c 20c...i sit down with $4 and always break even or finish a 2 or 3 $'s up...so it would take me about 5 years to get out the micros if that was the case.....cheers guys
 
JCgrind

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cool, i wont bother about brm at this stage then, i will just keep playing and try to make enough money

Not what I meant at all man, I'll rephrase.
FIRST pick your format. Play only that format, do not change and do not learn others.
Assuming you're going to play cash NLHE cos it's the nuts. In which case, play no more than 2 tables of 2NL. You won't make much money if any at all but that's not the point. Play like 10-20k hands here and see how you're going. Post hands here in the analysis forum and work on your game. Get a HUD if you don't already have one and learn what all the stats are, what they mean, how to interpret them and how to read your opponents based on them. Expect to lose money in this time- so preferably stay at 2NL so it's minimal. There are plenty of guys here who know a lot more about poker than the avg 2NL player and still lose/break even/barely win. You sir have a long way to go, good luck.
Ps; if you want to crush 2NL, I have a nice thread with a strategy that made me 18BB/100 over 90k hands called 'paying the bills with 2NL 6 max winnings'. Look it up in the brags beats and challenges section. It has a lot of stuff in there that will help you to crush micros ASAP.
 
JCgrind

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Also, everyone says this and nobody listens, so try to be the first person to actually do it. Everyone who hasn't used proper BRM has gone broke, I've dumped thousands from not moving down/playing too high from my bankroll.
If you wanna move up past 2NL, wait til you have at least $100BR
 
AlfieAA

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thanks jchoop, i will follow your advice, thanks for taking the time to explain it all ....
 
MadMaddie

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yeah im like you, i dont want to deposit again, i would rather just do that the once, mainly because im skint and on the dole (unemployed) haha...but if i had to i would do it because i love the game and i think i could do ok at it once ive learned the ins and outs....so are you a live player then?
I'm a new player. So far I have only played poker online for free most of the time on Pogo. Only real money playing I have done is on the kitchen table and at my friends houses.
I got a GiftCard for a present to play real money poker online. I want to try to make it last so I can always play if I want to.
Good Luck:)
 
JCgrind

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thanks jchoop, i will follow your advice, thanks for taking the time to explain it all ....

Easier said than done. Even I found myself playing a stake tonight for which I'd technically need at least $3000 more in my roll to play.
Hardest part of poker is sticking to BRM and moving down IMO. Goodluck
 
AlfieAA

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I think bankroll management is overated...if you are in danger of getting into debt then obviously brm is a must....but if you are a good player and the money you have on a poker site is seperate to your other money, then why waste possibly a year stuck in 2nl....bloody hell, you only get a few dollars out of a 2nl session...very frustrating....brm should come into play when you are making the big bucks...to get there you should take more risks and jump into bigger stakes..
 
Arjonius

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As I've said before, BRM is about your entire roll, which includes all the money you have for poker regardless of where it is. BRM is not about separately micro-managing the amounts you have on different sites.

If my total roll consists of $10 on a site plus $990 in my pocket, I am rolled to play NL10. If I had $25 on the site and $975 in my pocket, I'd be rolled to play NL25.
 
micromachine

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I think bankroll management is overated...if you are in danger of getting into debt then obviously brm is a must....but if you are a good player and the money you have on a poker site is seperate to your other money, then why waste possibly a year stuck in 2nl....bloody hell, you only get a few dollars out of a 2nl session...very frustrating....brm should come into play when you are making the big bucks...to get there you should take more risks and jump into bigger stakes..

2nl for a year!! You only stay at 2nl for a year if you suck really badly. Let's say you start with $40, play a couple of hours a day and average $4 per session, you'll be out of 2nl in a couple of weeks.

I see what you're saying about practicing very aggressive BRM to get up to the higher levels more quickly but I've found that cautious BRM is very effective at keeping you at a level appropriate for your skill. There isn't much point in depositing $1000 to roll yourself for 50nl only to get crushed and lose it all. If you really do have money to burn then fair enough, but $1000 is a decent amount of money to most people.
 
AlfieAA

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2nl for a year!! You only stay at 2nl for a year if you suck really badly. Let's say you start with $40, play a couple of hours a day and average $4 per session, you'll be out of 2nl in a couple of weeks.

I see what you're saying about practicing very aggressive BRM to get up to the higher levels more quickly but I've found that cautious BRM is very effective at keeping you at a level appropriate for your skill. There isn't much point in depositing $1000 to roll yourself for 50nl only to get crushed and lose it all. If you really do have money to burn then fair enough, but $1000 is a decent amount of money to most people.

lol, i started with $15 a few weeks ago and have went up to $40, down to $20, back up to $30 down to $25, then back up to $30....im now at $27........so i think its going to take me more than a few weeks haha......feels like i cant get above $40 and build......but then again ive only been playing properly for a few weeks, and am trying to learn abit of everything at the same time regarding theory ect.....i am a student of the game and hope that this time next year i will be making some money...but it will take alot of work and dedication......i dont want to be that guy that multi tables 24 tables and turn into a robot....i will play about 4 tables and retain enjoyment, sanity and hope to make a few bucks along the way ...
 
AlfieAA

AlfieAA

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As I've said before, BRM is about your entire roll, which includes all the money you have for poker regardless of where it is. BRM is not about separately micro-managing the amounts you have on different sites.

If my total roll consists of $10 on a site plus $990 in my pocket, I am rolled to play NL10. If I had $25 on the site and $975 in my pocket, I'd be rolled to play NL25.

i only play on pokerstars mate so i dont have any funds in different sites.....i dont think theres much point at this stage....i would rather build up fpp's and get out of bronze star....although slowly, it would be even more slow if i swapped sites all the time....plus the challange is slightly better than on other sites (so ive heard), which means i learn better and if i do play softer sites in the future i will crush it.....are you saying you count all your money as poker bank roll as you mention having money in your pocket?
 
micromachine

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lol, i started with $15 a few weeks ago and have went up to $40, down to $20, back up to $30 down to $25, then back up to $30....im now at $27........so i think its going to take me more than a few weeks haha......feels like i cant get above $40 and build......but then again ive only been playing properly for a few weeks, and am trying to learn abit of everything at the same time regarding theory ect.....i am a student of the game and hope that this time next year i will be making some money...but it will take alot of work and dedication......i dont want to be that guy that multi tables 24 tables and turn into a robot....i will play about 4 tables and retain enjoyment, sanity and hope to make a few bucks along the way ...

ya well maybe not a few weeks lol. It took me more like 2 or 3 months to get out of 2nl...I was a beginner as well. You shouldn't be there for a year though!

Some people move up more quickly but I am prone to tilt, which definitely slowed me down. If I had to go back now it would only take a couple of weeks but when you're learning the game it can take a while.

I like your last sentence, good attitude, playing too many tables can indeed sap the enjoyment and it can also slow down your improvement as a player.
 
micromachine

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are you saying you count all your money as poker bank roll as you mention having money in your pocket?

No he's saying that your bankroll includes all your poker money, whether that be on one or many sites.

And if some of your roll is not currently on a pokersite but in a bank account or neteller account, then that is still part of your bankroll too.
 
AlfieAA

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ya well maybe not a few weeks lol. It took me more like 2 or 3 months to get out of 2nl...I was a beginner as well. You shouldn't be there for a year though!

Some people move up more quickly but I am prone to tilt, which definitely slowed me down. If I had to go back now it would only take a couple of weeks but when you're learning the game it can take a while.

I like your last sentence, good attitude, playing too many tables can indeed sap the enjoyment and it can also slow down your improvement as a player.

wow 2 or 3 months is good mate, you must be a natural

if i could do that i would be delighted lol, time will tell

yeah i am prone to tilt too, its like i expect to win if i hit the flop and have a good starting hand....i think its good to have abit passion and tilt tbh, because if you were laid back and didnt care then you lose that competitive edge...you need fire in your belly for poker i think....i could be wrong....

if i tilt it doesnt last too long though as i like to punch a pillow for about 15 minutes and let it all out....especially if i have damaged my bankroll....like the other day i had $40 and lost 3 buy ins at $5.....i took offence to getting sucked out by this russian and targetted him and played awful....went all in with pocket 2's and he had 9's....and he flopped the set......that pissed me off, so i took it out on the pillow and done some poker theory for the rest of the day haha

yeah deffo, if i do get good at this i dont think i will be playing too many tables as i think you could make enough money on fewer tables while still enjoying it.....it would become a chore if you were not enjoying it and only playing purely for the money
 
AlfieAA

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No he's saying that your bankroll includes all your poker money, whether that be on one or many sites.

And if some of your roll is not currently on a pokersite but in a bank account or neteller account, then that is still part of your bankroll too.

oh right i see, thanks for a minute i thought i was rolled for 10nl as ive got about 200 quid left in my bank haha...cheers for clearing it up
 
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BRM comes completely naturally to me. At first I just thought I was a coward and that "real" players were the ones who put their entire chips on the line and moved up as soon as they had enough for just a couple of buy-ins. I was relieved to find out that I was playing that part of my game correctly.
 
Bankroll Building - Bankroll Management
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