all in with a pair of sevens

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cracksniper

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I played in the casino the other night and was dealt a pair of sevens in late position, it got folded round to me as the blinds were 2-400, I raised 2500, and got called by the button, the blinds folded. Now my chip stack was quite good at around 12000 the average was 14000 but I did arive late for the tournament so was catching up a bit. The flop came 5,3,8 rainbow and that it would be unlikely to help the button and I thought that was a good flop for me. I tried to think what the button had and thought the chances of him having a higher pair were slim I pushed AI and got called by him with a pair of 9's turn and river did not help so I went out. I'd like to ask my fellow CC posters if I played this good should I have just checked or bet half the pot rather than AI, I thought he would be holding AK or AQ as having two PP's next to each other is very rare. Anyway thanks all again for your great advice. The sniper
 
ericgarner118

ericgarner118

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If you want a good answer we need alot more information about this guy. If you had any info at all it would really change the situation. Since it's a tournament; how big are the blinds, how close are you to the bubble, etc? I think it was a really bad play. You didn't even have an over pair to the board, it was second pair. Usually you are playing those middle pair for set value. if you are dominated, which you will be by a bigger pair a good bit of the time, you are pretty far behind. You didn't even have any other outs, A 3/4 pot bet here will give you all the info you need. I may be wrong though as I don't play a ton of tournaments
 
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cracksniper

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If you want a good answer we need alot more information about this guy. If you had any info at all it would really change the situation. Since it's a tournament; how big are the blinds, how close are you to the bubble, etc? I think it was a really bad play. You didn't even have an over pair to the board, it was second pair. Usually you are playing those middle pair for set value. if you are dominated, which you will be by a bigger pair a good bit of the time, you are pretty far behind. You didn't even have any other outs, A 3/4 pot bet here will give you all the info you need. I may be wrong though as I don't play a ton of tournaments

Thanks Eric, I suppose I just got ahead of myself I think in future I'm just going to play these hands for set value, if I hit then ok if not fold
 
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Having 2 pairs on the table together isn't that rare. Its a weird science and I'll try to explain it.
The odds of getting dealt a PP from a random deck are just over 5% (we'll call it that for ease of understanding). So if you get dealt a pair, you've hit a 20/1 chance. Nice, chances are you're miles ahead right? Wrong!
The odds are the same for every individual at the table, so if you have a PP, the odds of another player having a PP are actually strong.
9 other players with a 5% chance each, means there is at LEAST a 45% chance of there being another PP at the table.
Doesn't sound right, but trust me.
As for the 7's.... Nice move in late position, unlucky to be up against an over-pair. Remember when you play these low-mid pairs post-flop though No set, No bet!
 
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Shylax

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Sniper,

I don't like this move at all. For a bunch of reasons:

1)You had 30 BBs. There's no need to put your whole stack in danger. Especially when the BB had you covered. Just throw out a continuation bet of 1/2 the pot or so. If he had two overs, he'd probably fold to that amount. No need to put your whole stack in. If he calls, you have to slow down on the turn and if he raises get the hell out of there. You needed to practice pot control there.

2)Since he had you covered, what does your all in play do for you? The only way he's calling that bet is if he has you crushed. He's not calling under any other circumstances. Depending on the size of your stack to his, I don't see him calling you off with a lesser hand or a draw if your stack is >= 50% of his stack. Therefore, a call means you're crushed.

The only two courses of action are check behind him and see the turn or throw out a probe/continuation bet on the flop and see if you're good. All in was horrible. Especially with an M of 20. You had position. Control the pot size. Don't let it get out of hand next time.
 
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cracksniper

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thanks for both answers

Thanks to you both for the answers, like you said i let it get out of control, no set no bet is the one for me now on. Thanks boys, the sniper
 
left52side

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Late position I like the raise preflop.
Looking at the button not raising preflop would make me laery of the flat call.
The flop would have forced me to check,maybe just maybe a small raise 3 to 4X.
I would be on the lookout for A reraise,maybe on 4th street if paint came you could try to bet out again and see where your at.
I would never risk my chips with 7's even with a board like that.
 
Tom1559

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I think your raise was probably too big to start with. You were in a reasonable position and 2 or 3 BB raise would have gotten a call or even a raise from the button. Tha would probably have told you a lot more that his call to your big raise. It would still have left the dilema of what to bet but all in - no I dont think so. Short stacked maybe but then if you were short stacked then all in to start with would have been better.
 
cardplayer52

cardplayer52

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you shouldn't be shoving here. and why exactly did you shove? because you thought you were ahead? did you think they would call you if they were behind? its good to try to put them on a range of hands like you did. but instead of saying i'm ahead of his range i should bet. you may try asking what type of range would be willing to get allin here? and am i ahead of that range? here i would think your most likely ahead and there's lots of cards you dont want to see on the turn so a bet of 2/3 the pot should take the pot in most cases. no need to shove when the only hands that call are the ones that got you crushed.

---and another thing why did you raise so much to begin with? i think opening to 1k should be good enough. make sure you make a note of this guy and how this play went down you can play your sets the same way agaisnt him and stack him in the future.
 
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ph_il

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I played in the casino the other night and was dealt a pair of sevens in late position, it got folded round to me as the blinds were 2-400, I raised 2500
...Your 6.25x BB raise seems a bit much here. A 3-4x raise would've been fine. I would actually bet a bit lower, maybe 2.5x-3x

, and got called by the button, the blinds folded.
....Pot is 5600

Now my chip stack was quite good at around 12000 the average was 14000 but I did arive late for the tournament so was catching up a bit.
...Just a note, you're sitting on 30BBs.

The flop came 5,3,8 rainbow and that it would be unlikely to help the button and I thought that was a good flop for me. I tried to think what the button had and thought the chances of him having a higher pair were slim I pushed AI and got called by him with a pair of 9's turn and river did not help so I went out.
...I agree, that flop looks pretty safe for a pair of 7s, but what I don't understand why you thought his chances of a higher pair is slim? Other than the villain's preflop call-what reads do you have on this opponent in this particular hand?

I also hate your shove all-in without any positive information from your opponent. First of all, you're risking way too much such a tiny pot. You started off with 12K and raised it to 2500, leaving you with 9500. You shove 9500 to win a pot of 5600. One problem with your huge PF raise is it makes the pot bigger and harder to let go of because you've put in so much. A standard c-bet of 3/4's the pot is 4200, nearly 50% of your stack-so you can easily find yourself committed to this pot with a small pair. Where-as if you had bet smaller, you're c-bet isn't as big and will still leave you with enough BBs to play with if you have to fold or you lose the hand. But as played, I would've bet out about 1/3 of the pot for information. You might win the hand if opponent missed completely, fold if he raises, or try and got showdown cheap. If you lose, you still have 18BBs left to play with. You're getting the valued information you need to but not losing you're entire stack on a single pair.


I'd like to ask my fellow CC posters if I played this good should I have just checked or bet half the pot rather than AI, I thought he would be holding AK or AQ as having two PP's next to each other is very rare. Anyway thanks all again for your great advice. The sniper
above.
 
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