93 percent or better after flop

If your playing well and seem to find your self losing after the flop. with hands that where 93 percent or better to win only to loose by the river. Would these be bad beats or just suck outs. Either way you loose but is there a difference.

Second I have to assume if your getting all the chips in at these moments it's going to eventually start paying off at the online tables. I have these moments allot it seems weather in tourney or cash games online. After playing a year I was hoping my online winnings would be profitable. But never could turn those small Itm moments into anything to resemble a bank roll. But love/addicted to the games so I will continue the insanity.:evil:

Those are beats for sure. I would only play big guaranteed MTTs.

I wanted to join the discussion with you, but I did not understand what it was about you. If not difficult to explain.

John bruce said:

with hands that where 93 percent or better to win only to loose by the river.
Second I have to assume if your getting all the chips in at these moments it's going to eventually start paying off at the online tables.

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It will pay off, but your 'life expectancy' (and profitability) sharply increases when you do not typically go all-in in these situations.

8bod8 said:

It will pay off, but your 'life expectancy' (and profitability) sharply increases when you do not typically go all-in in these situations.

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So your saying I'm too aggressive with good hands. Problem is most of the time these situations I'm getting checked called. So I'll make them pay to stay. But playing in a hand that takes two streets to make a winning hand and going all in after the flop is just insane.
But what makes things even crazier is this is how I get knocked out of most tourneys. I do play low cost tourneys so I do expect allot more calls. I wouldn't mind losing the hand if I just went in with just a pair hoping it's my lucky time to gamble. Been called a NIT but I'm not. I know this after playing online it was much easier at the casinos. It also didn't feel like every time there is two or three players in the hand the streets hit everyone. Got to love it because you really never know with a strong hand where you stand. Just wish I would fold most two pairs hit on the flop. It's a losing hand every time. Good luck to all except if your playing against me then I hope you don't get your outs.

I think bad beat is the same as suck out, if that was your question. Don't think there is any difference

Meepomancer1122 said:

I think bad beat is the same as suck out, if that was your question. Don't think there is any difference

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The bad beat is a very strong hand, though you could have 1 pair and someone suckout and beat you with a better hand and it wouldn't be considered a bad beat (though would be to the player if they lost a big pot). Also not all bad beats are caused by a suckout (though some definitions vary). I tend to like the definitions that would cause a bad beat jackpot to go off. If that isn't happening noone wants to hear about it anyway. laughs.

Been a while

I haven't written on here in a long time. I've started playing even less hands. I look at most hands as a set up. I don't get as aggressive anymore unless I have the nuts on the river. Which is far and few. Reason I'm writing now is the hands I'm getting beat on hands that no one can fold. Yesterday I got knocked out of four tourneys all flopping full boats. All are loses to higher boats. I don't have to tell you that is possible but the odds must be remarkable.
Now if you think about it if I'm playing less hands and coincidently seem to hit the few hands I do decide to play which shows that in itself is odd. Usually meaning I'm starting of off with trips or better before I get into a betting scenario. And still losing 80 percent of those hands is enough to make you think. Numbers don't lie.
Now I have to admit I don't play on regulated sites because I don't have access to them. But is it any different on those sites. I remember a time when two pair was a strong hand in poker. Them days are gone unless you do get to play live some where. I went back to the creepy card room and once again was amazed that the monster hands only came about every once in a while. Not ever other hand.

Today

Today was another great day online. I won third place last night CC free roll. Won 15 bucks was happy with the win. Was a super suck out to get super low stack. Aces in hole so I put a really large bet after his bet he called. Flop As,kc,5c. He bet half the stack I went all in and he called. He turned over 6,8c. Turn is a ran fan cbut I'm not out I have ac. River a diamond. All in with that..

Skip to next day I played in four hands in a hour. I started off 5/10 cents. First hand I got first hand. A,k diamonds flop comes out A,A,8. I bet he puts me all in I call and of coarse he had A,8. Lost five bucks.
Next hand about ten hands later I got pocket Q,Q. Nice bet I call flop is k,Q,6. He goes all in of coarse I call he turns over pocket kings. Didn't hit turn or river. Lost five dollars.
Third hand about 15 hands later. I get pocket AA. Guy goes all in with a dollar I call he flip j,j. I should be good right. Nope guys turn a j and miss the river.
Down to my last four dollars. About 13 hands later my BB no one raised so I check with 5,7 spades. Flop comes out 5,7,9. I bet a dollar he called. Turn is a 7 I got the boat. I check he bet a dollar I went all in. He had pocket 9,9 for a bigger house. That was my day. That is a usual day after I win a free roll. Would you say I'm unlucky? No way this is rigged. Entertained yes will I deposit no way. Let's play poker.

True

John bruce said:

So your saying I'm too aggressive with good hands. Problem is most of the time these situations I'm getting checked called. So I'll make them pay to stay. But playing in a hand that takes two streets to make a winning hand and going all in after the flop is just insane.
But what makes things even crazier is this is how I get knocked out of most tourneys. I do play low cost tourneys so I do expect allot more calls. I wouldn't mind losing the hand if I just went in with just a pair hoping it's my lucky time to gamble. Been called a NIT but I'm not. I know this after playing online it was much easier at the casinos. It also didn't feel like every time there is two or three players in the hand the streets hit everyone. Got to love it because you really never know with a strong hand where you stand. Just wish I would fold most two pairs hit on the flop. It's a losing hand every time. Good luck to all except if your playing against me then I hope you don't get your outs.

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SO true about the flopping 2 pairs online, 99% loss, the 1% is when everyone folds, lol, true tho..

And the 90%+ after flop in online poker is barely a coin flip, not like in real poker.. Keep getting yourself in those situations & play it differently, figure out what's more profitable, plus you'll figure out how to play each hand differently against different players.. it's not a right/wrong thing.. ya'know

John bruce said:

Today was another great day online. I won third place last night CC free roll. Won 15 bucks was happy with the win. Was a super suck out to get super low stack. Aces in hole so I put a really large bet after his bet he called. Flop As,kc,5c. He bet half the stack I went all in and he called. He turned over 6,8c. Turn is a ran fan cbut I'm not out I have ac. River a diamond. All in with that..

Skip to next day I played in four hands in a hour. I started off 5/10 cents. First hand I got first hand. A,k diamonds flop comes out A,A,8. I bet he puts me all in I call and of coarse he had A,8. Lost five bucks.
Next hand about ten hands later I got pocket Q,Q. Nice bet I call flop is k,Q,6. He goes all in of coarse I call he turns over pocket kings. Didn't hit turn or river. Lost five dollars.
Third hand about 15 hands later. I get pocket AA. Guy goes all in with a dollar I call he flip j,j. I should be good right. Nope guys turn a j and miss the river.
Down to my last four dollars. About 13 hands later my BB no one raised so I check with 5,7 spades. Flop comes out 5,7,9. I bet a dollar he called. Turn is a 7 I got the boat. I check he bet a dollar I went all in. He had pocket 9,9 for a bigger house. That was my day. That is a usual day after I win a free roll. Would you say I'm unlucky? No way this is rigged. Entertained yes will I deposit no way. Let's play poker.

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it's not u bro, it IS rigged af, I've won every MTT tourney under $20 on wsop.com & after a good run or a tourney win or a withdraw or tuesday, i can go days without winning a hand, just EVERY hand a complete setup just like u said.. it's blatantly obvious & they don't care cuz they're the only game in town..

My opinion

I feel the same way. I dont know if I will quit if I dont win the vacations too. They are farther and fewer in between but they should have the same odds of winning.

John bruce said:

I haven't written on here in a long time. I've started playing even less hands. I look at most hands as a set up. I don't get as aggressive anymore unless I have the nuts on the river. Which is far and few. Reason I'm writing now is the hands I'm getting beat on hands that no one can fold. Yesterday I got knocked out of four tourneys all flopping full boats. All are loses to higher boats. I don't have to tell you that is possible but the odds must be remarkable.
Now if you think about it if I'm playing less hands and coincidently seem to hit the few hands I do decide to play which shows that in itself is odd. Usually meaning I'm starting of off with trips or better before I get into a betting scenario. And still losing 80 percent of those hands is enough to make you think. Numbers don't lie.
Now I have to admit I don't play on regulated sites because I don't have access to them. But is it any different on those sites. I remember a time when two pair was a strong hand in poker. Them days are gone unless you do get to play live some where. I went back to the creepy card room and once again was amazed that the monster hands only came about every once in a while. Not ever other hand.

Click to expand...

Yea. Online is a way different puppy than online. The odds online playing are not the same as live play. And most others will say the same unless they are lying to themselves. Tough to play online, sorta compare it to slot machines. Slot machines have a take rate and online texas hold em is no different. They are meant to make the house money, not the player.

I think that one year is a very short period of time to start receiving regular profits. I also play poker for one year. At the moment, I am not losing, but on the contrary, I began to increase my bankroll. I think that it takes at least 5 years to become a successful player and to receive regular income.

All really interesting comments....online is a bit of a sod to beat and yes..the cardrooms all look after themselves first

Reading about your bet bits, I remember how I played on the tables with cash. Now I do not play for cash. I do not want to spoil my nerves. It is better to spend this money on tournaments. At least the pleasure to play will be more.

This morning I woke up felt fresh and jumped on a free roll. Was doing good get small pots here and there. Running the table nice. Then a player transfer to my table. I got pocket 22. He gets 3 big blinds everyone folds I call. Flop comes out 2,2,8. I flop quads. He bets pot I call. Next turn is 8. He goes all in. I have stinking quads and he pushes me. I hit add timer. I thinking did he have pocket 88? No way. He has full house. No way I can fold. I call and sure enough he has higher quad. I can honestly say I don't Renner the river card. Next hand the guy got transfers. Was going to watch him play a bit but couldn't find him. But I have never lost with quads. I've never seen quads o. Quads. I think is almost impossible. Funny thing is I haven't seen a royal flush yet on a table I'm playing at. I'm done for the day. No need.

redmast said:

Reading about your bet bits, I remember how I played on the tables with cash. Now I do not play for cash. I do not want to spoil my nerves. It is better to spend this money on tournaments. At least the pleasure to play will be more.

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Usually if I wina free roll tourney I go straight to the cash table. I have always double or triple my winnings at that moment. Every time.
Its the next few days I can't win anything. I'm second best every hand. Now if I go to the cash tourneys it's different. I usually win one. I will continue to lose until I have lost all the free roll funds. Once there gone I can usually play with the tourney cash out for a few weeks. Eventually losing it all mostly due to rake. Makes me wonder if it's programmed to get that free roll money back. Just saying.

I think we have the same problems when it comes to getting all kind of suckouts and badbeats may eb it's our bankroll management which is wrong and which makes us loosing a Ton of hands that are supposed to be the best winning hands but whenever we get in a pot the board hits all involved players and a single mistake whether betting with Top set on a flushy board or a straighty one for protection or value or even slow playing it we never get there.
I try to find out how to beat online games but all tricks and technics I am using turn to be the bad choises my opponents get their draws every single time.

Maybe the site has pegged you as too good/hot and are trying to cool you off.
To me at least, after a few good deep ITMs or several bottom cashes in a row, the sites seem to deal me hands that are best to win on the flop, then kill me on the river with mass suck-out / bad-beat potential.
I'm not the greatest player in the world, average maybe but getting better.
But from what I've read from this forum, we all get that hot streak, only to experience the horrific aftermath of getting smacked around like a pinata.
We feel your pain, but remember the most important thing:
"That which does not kill you, makes you stronger"

YES

Cajin007 said:

Maybe the site has pegged you as too good/hot and are trying to cool you off.
To me at least, after a few good deep ITMs or several bottom cashes in a row, the sites seem to deal me hands that are best to win on the flop, then kill me on the river with mass suck-out / bad-beat potential.
I'm not the greatest player in the world, average maybe but getting better.
But from what I've read from this forum, we all get that hot streak, only to experience the horrific aftermath of getting smacked around like a pinata.
We feel your pain, but remember the most important thing:
"That which does not kill you, makes you stronger"

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This is exactly how they roll, completely programmed..

Right

eberetta1 said:

Yea. Online is a way different puppy than online. The odds online playing are not the same as live play. And most others will say the same unless they are lying to themselves. Tough to play online, sorta compare it to slot machines. Slot machines have a take rate and online texas hold em is no different. They are meant to make the house money, not the player.

Click to expand...

-


I couldn't agree more, online poker is like slots in casinos, but u don't have to play every hand in poker, so even as bad as they will screw u there is still skill involved. But the odds in online poker is NOTHING like live, everything you've heard is true about online poker.. rigged for rake, cash out curse, hot players penalized, bots, colluding, players & employees that can see everyone's hole cards, hot/cold seats & total bs seat changes mid tourney.. there are props/employees & they favor high volume players & always reward the utter donkeys playing 69 off utg calling down on boards of AQ9J vs AQ & here comes the river 9 to bail the awful donkey out, so now donk thinks he's good & real players feel they have to play shit hands to get rewarded, but when they do they lose like those shit hands should.. yea.. And like the casinos it just gets tighter & tighter & the reward less & less & the take more & more.. yes, they are complete thieves & we need to spread the word to help each other out.. I know that i used to feel like i was just 'trippin' but then i read about y'all goin thru the same bs & it helps to know i'm not alone.. i think if we get the word out there & we all come together to call them out then they will have to pull back the cheating & completely rigged BS!!!! We can't just accept this, post about all the BS as much as we can and expose them as widely as we can is what we can do! GL fam

Cajin007 said:

Maybe the site has pegged you as too good/hot and are trying to cool you off.
To me at least, after a few good deep ITMs or several bottom cashes in a row, the sites seem to deal me hands that are best to win on the flop, then kill me on the river with mass suck-out / bad-beat potential.
I'm not the greatest player in the world, average maybe but getting better.
But from what I've read from this forum, we all get that hot streak, only to experience the horrific aftermath of getting smacked around like a pinata.
We feel your pain, but remember the most important thing:
"That which does not kill you, makes you stronger"

Click to expand...

I think I'm Beginning to Like You and Your Thinking... after reading a few other posts you've made I think I'm going to have to keep an eye on you... I really hope i get a chance to see you in some Live events some day soon... Yeah just forget about Online Gaming and move into the real world live tournaments for bigger money...

Inequitas said:

I think I'm Beginning to Like You and Your Thinking... after reading a few other posts you've made I think I'm going to have to keep an eye on you... I really hope i get a chance to see you in some Live events some day soon... Yeah just forget about Online Gaming and move into the real world live tournaments for bigger money...

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Where do you play live at? I might join

Today I played all day at the cash tables. Started with just five dollars. Was going to play till I lost it. I dodged a crap load. I got it up to 12 dollars then for some reason I couldn't get any cards to start with. All day back and forth. Last three hours seemed the poker gods decided I sat out long enough and stated getting good hands but they just where second best no matter what. The tighter I got the better the cards. Finally I got K,Q of diamonds so I put out a nice bet. Everyone folds but this one guy. Flop comes out A,j 5d. I made a pOt bet the guy calls. Turn comes out a10d so I made a nice bet. I have a straight with a flush draw. I go all in this guy flips over 5,10. I mean really stayed all in two pair with both a str she a flush draw out there. Never guess the river. Yep another five fora full house. I guess I should be happy I played all day on five dollars. What can you do.