Wsop colossus hand review

fishfood80

fishfood80

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Bl8nds 100 200 200 bb ante

Villain utg+1 raises to 600 with 27k effective stack
Hero cutoff reraises to 2200 with 43000 effective stack
AsAc
Villain calls
Pot 4900
Flop 3s9d7s
Villain checks
Hero bets 1500
Villain calls
Pot7900
Turn Ah
Villain checks
Hero bets 3000
Villain calls
Pot 13900
River 5s
Villain jams last 19k
Hero??
 
S

ssbn743

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Bl8nds 100 200 200 bb ante

Villain utg+1 raises to 600 with 27k effective stack
Hero cutoff reraises to 2200 with 43000 effective stack
AsAc
Villain calls
Pot 4900
Flop 3s9d7s
Villain checks
Hero bets 1500
Villain calls
Pot7900
Turn Ah
Villain checks
Hero bets 3000
Villain calls
Pot 13900
River 5s
Villain jams last 19k
Hero??

As played, in that ****ing Shit-Show – call!

Now, on a more helpful note – we have something going on here that I routinely see in Bracelet events; bet sizes are way too small. You put a wsop logo and bracelet up top and everyone turns into notorious NIT’s.

I’m all for chip preservation in super deep structures like WSOP events – but it is routinely taken to the extreme. We have greater than 125BB here – we have to go for value with our big hands, and with such a deep stack, that comes with virtually no risk.

Analysis:

Pre
In this event, I love the big 3-bet size, we could even go bigger for value here against a vast-majority of the field. Now, I wasn’t there, and I don’t know the villain, and I think $2,200 is good. If he’s a NIT, we could simply go $1,500 (I know, after my bigger sizes speech right?). Point is, villain specific, and at a default I simply like 3x but am completely fine with 3.5x here in almost all cases.

Flop
Where does the $1,500 come from? I can get behind strategies that use .25 pot C-bets, or .33, but we’re not really C-betting here, we’re value betting. Therefore our default size here should be .5 pot, I’m not even sure where .3 comes from – if he folds for the extra .2 – fine, we prefer folds in tournaments anyway.

I’d also like to propose an SPR related size structure. We have about a 5.5 SPR, which is perfect for Pot/.5/.5 sizes. With Pot/.5/.5 we’ll get the effective stack, in a 5-ish SPR pot, in the middle without issue.

I like a pot sized wager here - $5K chips scare the fish out of the water, so I’d do something a little more innocuous, $4,600-ish, don’t want too many black chips as more chips scare them as well.

Turn
Again, I feel it’s too small, although better. Since we’ve basically just spiked the nuts, I can see some logic to this sizing but still vastly prefer $4K as played.

If we had gone $4,600 otf, we’d go $7K here with the sole intention of giving him a .5 pot shove on the river.

River
And this is a call as played. Sure, we could be beat – but it’s the Goddamn Colossus.

With Pot/.5/.5 sizes, we now have $28K in the middle and villain has $13K behind – we
gladly call if he shoves.



Working a gigantic range for villain, that honestly is probably not big enough (we are in the Colossus).
These are the hands I think he could feasibly get to river with:

QQ,99,77,55,AJs+,98s,87s,KsQs,KsJs,AsTs,KsTs,As9s,Ks9s,Qs9s,Js9s,Ts9s,As8s,Ks8s,As7s,As6s,As5s,As4s,As3s,As2s,AQo+ (and I know the impossible AsX combo’s are here – don’t worry, Equilab does the math)

Against our AsAc (and remember, we have the huge As here) he has 24% equity, giving us 76%. Attached are two spreadsheets evaluating all-in river shoves by villain, both are extremely profitable, but as you can see, structuring our bet sizes a little better makes our decisions exponentially easier and our value exponentially higher.
 

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S

scubed

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Bl8nds 100 200 200 bb ante
Villain utg+1 raises to 600 with 27k effective stack
Hero cutoff reraises to 2200 with 43000 effective stack

Preflop:
What range is Villain raising with from UTG+1? A GTO range (which is probably too tight for The Colossus tourney) is something like 14%. So perhaps twice that, maybe a 30% frequency? Assuming Villain is capable of slow playing big hands (wouldn't Villain 4-bet JJ+, AK?) pre-flop an opening might look something like
attachment.php


Flop: :3s4: :9d4: :7s4: (pot $4900)
HERO bets a little bit less than 1/3 pot. This sizing means when Hero is bluffing Hero has to win ~25% of the time. This sizing also means that Villain can (should) call with ~16% equity and has a minimum defense frequency of ~75% of the range Villain is playing from UTG+1. This sizing isn't folding out much of Villains range.

Turn: :ah4: on :3s4: :9d4: :7s4: (pot $7900)
HERO bets ~2/5 of the pot. This sizing means when Hero is bluffing Hero has to win ~29% of the time. This sizing also means that Villain can (should) call with ~22% equity and has a minimum defense frequency of ~71% of the range Villain is playing from UTG+1. This sizing isn't folding out much of Villains range.

River: :5s4: on :3s4: :9d4: :7s4: :ah4: (pot $13900)
Villain jams 1.37 times the size of the pot (19k). As a pure bluff Villain needs to win this ~55% of the time to be profitable with this move. Hero needs to defend 45% of the range and needs about 37% equity. BUT...

This scenario is no longer a math problem. Hero has to decide if Villain has "it" or not. What hands is hero losing to based on the range above? Only flush hands (13 combos are not blocked by Heros :as4: and the boards :5s4: :7s4: :3s4: ). Would Villain call down with combos like :js4: :10s4: with the gut shot and spade draw? How about :qs4: :9s4: ?


This early in the Colossus tournament, I probably sigh call since there is one rebuy. Heros hand is SO SO strong. That said, a big bet on the end by a recreational player is usually a crazy big hand.
 

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scubed

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Attached are two spreadsheets evaluating all-in river shoves by villain, both are extremely profitable, but as you can see, structuring our bet sizes a little better makes our decisions exponentially easier and our value exponentially higher.
Nice analysis! Are the sweet spreadsheets you shared publicly available? I'd love to get my hands on them for learning!
 
fishfood80

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I did end up sigh calling and he didn't end up having the flush. I said call you got the flush he says no I'm like i got a set of aces. He turns over 4 ×@#* 2 off for the straight. I couldn't believe it.
 
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fundiver199

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As others have said, what are you doing with this bet sizing? If you go 2/3 pot the whole way down, you get it in, and you make it much more expensive for him to draw. Its obviously crazy, that he show up with 42o, but if his range is this wide, so much more reason to bet larger for value and also to deny some equity from all those draws, he have in his range.
 
Debi

Debi

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Yep - definitely too small for the bets on the flop and the turn but I am calling the river though cussing myself out for keeping him in the pot and getting such small value from doing that.
 
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ssbn743

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Nice analysis! Are the sweet spreadsheets you shared publicly available? I'd love to get my hands on them for learning!

Yeah, they're not mine - the author is James Sweeney, aka SplitSuit. I think they're free if you sign up to his mailing list - he's got a whole bunch of them in a .zip file. The one I used here is one of his most basic, and I did make a few modifications to mine, but I'll attach my version for you.

And quick note..... apparently I can't upload an Excel document on this page, but it does accept *.zip - so I just zipped it, no password or encryption.
 

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ssbn743

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I did end up sigh calling and he didn't end up having the flush. I said call you got the flush he says no I'm like i got a set of aces. He turns over 4 ×@#* 2 off for the straight. I couldn't believe it.

OK, well - that sucks. But, on the upside, if he can have 42o that means he can have any and every draw this board provides - giving us 83% equity.

(QQ,99,77,55,AJs+,JTs,J8s,T8s+,98s,87s,65s,52s+,42s,KsQs,KsJs,AsTs,KsTs,As9s,Ks9s,Qs9s
Js9s,As8s,Ks8s,As7s,As6s,As5s,As4s,As3s,As2s,AQo+,A9o,A7o,A5o,A3o,JTo,J8o,T8o+,65o
52o+,42o)

Attached are the spreadsheets proving once again that the Colossus is a "target rich" environment - you just have to dodge landmines..... several hundred of them :)

Work on sizing your bets better and shrug it off when they catch.
 

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fishfood80

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Yep - definitely too small for the bets on the flop and the turn but I am calling the river though cussing myself out for keeping him in the pot and getting such small value from doing that.
Yeah I got caught trying to be cute and make super milky bets. Definite lesson learned.
 
natsgrampy

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It needs to be said that, regardless of the bet size, in tournaments like this, there is always someone who will call any and all raises. Especially early.
 
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QA77

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I don’t mind the bet sizing too much. Yeah you can make it a bit bigger but Im not sure what difference it would make to your opponent. As played, Id lean towards folding on the river. He’s shoving 1.5x pot and his shove is nearly 100bbs. He could have value hands that you beat but I would think he might check raise those hands on the turn.
 
Ronaldo7

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I don't get it, how people can even think in that situation... Instant call... You 3 betted and got called preflop... With what if he has flush?? JTs?? I mean him calling with small pair and having tris or KK QQ which doesn't trust you have A or evem A and small card suited which hit two pairs are much more expected than flush for me...
 
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mara2259

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I apologize, but looking at how you played a pocket pair of aces I did not find other words. You see a suspicious bed in front of you and you begin to water it carefully, and when the turnip has grown, a large, very large one suddenly asks: is it not too much nitrates in it? In fact, the flop is not the most pleasant for you, with a possible straight and flush draw. The hand must be protected, but instead you prefer to take chips from small pairs or unfinished hands such as AQ, AK. Otherwise, I can't interpret your 1/3 raise raise. On the turn is luck, you have a set, but the threats are still not eliminated, and you continue to get. And here is the result: the flash becomes reality. And how about 6s 8s? Well, bite your turnip, you still have a chance that this is just a bluff or all sorts of hands with an ace, two pairs and a small set.
 
theANMATOR

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As played, in that ****ing Shit-Show – call!
but it’s the Goddamn Colossus.
Working a gigantic range for villain, that honestly is probably not big enough (we are in the Colossus).
These are the hands I think he could feasibly get to river with:

QQ,99,77,55,AJs+,98s,87s,KsQs,KsJs,AsTs,KsTs,As9s,Ks9s,Qs9s,Js9s,Ts9s,As8s,Ks8s,As7s,As6s,As5s,As4s,As3s,As2s,AQo+ (and I know the impossible AsX combo’s are here – don’t worry

So - your saying people have wide ranges in the Colossus...

He turns over 4 ×@#* 2 off for the straight. I couldn't believe it.
OMG!
Welp - great lesson for bet sizing.

ssbn743 - you were right - ?!The Colossus!?
 
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