$5.50 NLHE MTT: Is this a call on a shortstack shove?

Alucard

Alucard

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very early in the game


pokerstars - 300/600 Ante 75 NL - Holdem - 8 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4: http://www.pokertracker.com

BTN: 50.56 BB (VPIP: 9.68, PFR: 8.06, 3Bet Preflop: 9.68, hands: 63)
SB: 21.31 BB (VPIP: 12.70, PFR: 11.11, 3Bet Preflop: 3.70, Hands: 63)
BB: 29.03 BB (VPIP: 22.22, PFR: 4.76, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 63)
UTG: 41.94 BB (VPIP: 16.67, PFR: 5.56, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 36)
Hero (UTG+1): 38.86 BB
MP: 38.64 BB (VPIP: 42.86, PFR: 28.57, 3Bet Preflop: 11.11, Hands: 63)
MP+1: 279.56 BB (VPIP: 30.16, PFR: 16.13, 3Bet Preflop: 6.45, Hands: 63)
CO: 117.31 BB (VPIP: 26.98, PFR: 14.29, 3Bet Preflop: 3.23, Hands: 63)

8 players post ante of 0.13 BB, SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.5 BB) Hero has 8c 8d
fold, Hero raises to 2.17 BB, fold, MP+1 calls 2.17 BB, fold, BTN calls 2.17 BB, SB raises to 21.19 BB and is all-in,
 
liuouhgkres

liuouhgkres

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It's bottom of your opening range. So just fold.
 
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Edvin55555

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Player on SB looks pretty tight. He shoves against 3 players, so his range looks very strong. I consider fold is the most appropriate decision in this case.
 
mbrenneman0

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this is a fold

you have to call 19bb to win 30bb so you need ~40% to make it even cEV

lets just assume his range is 99+/AQ+/AJs

88 has 37% vs that range

adjusting that range wider has very little affect on the equity as long as he has two cards higher than 8.
 
T

Thenightrain

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At best you’ve got a slight advantage in a coin flip, worst case your dominanted and lose half your stack early. I’d fold and wait for a better spot.
 
iwont20

iwont20

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Easy fold. 88 isn't good enough vs tight SB, you don't have a big stack either and you're oop vs huge chip leader.
 
T

trent32la

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very early in the game


PokerStars - 300/600 Ante 75 NL - Holdem - 8 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4: http://www.pokertracker.com

BTN: 50.56 BB (VPIP: 9.68, PFR: 8.06, 3Bet Preflop: 9.68, Hands: 63)
SB: 21.31 BB (VPIP: 12.70, PFR: 11.11, 3Bet Preflop: 3.70, Hands: 63)
BB: 29.03 BB (VPIP: 22.22, PFR: 4.76, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 63)
UTG: 41.94 BB (VPIP: 16.67, PFR: 5.56, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 36)
Hero (UTG+1): 38.86 BB
MP: 38.64 BB (VPIP: 42.86, PFR: 28.57, 3Bet Preflop: 11.11, Hands: 63)
MP+1: 279.56 BB (VPIP: 30.16, PFR: 16.13, 3Bet Preflop: 6.45, Hands: 63)
CO: 117.31 BB (VPIP: 26.98, PFR: 14.29, 3Bet Preflop: 3.23, Hands: 63)

8 players post ante of 0.13 BB, SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.5 BB) Hero has 8c 8d
fold, Hero raises to 2.17 BB, fold, MP+1 calls 2.17 BB, fold, BTN calls 2.17 BB, SB raises to 21.19 BB and is all-in,
Run for the hills.
 
B

BigThingWithHolesInIt

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Agree with the fold for all the reasons given, I'd also be very concerned that the LAGgy huge-stacked MP+1 tags along even if we iso-shove.
 
mbrenneman0

mbrenneman0

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I'd also be very concerned that the LAGgy huge-stacked MP+1 tags along even if we iso-shove.
really shouldnt be worried about that... I wouldnt consider those stats laggy as much as i'd consider them loose/weak, the gap between pfr and vpip is way too wide, its really hard to see him having any kind of range that flats a 2bet and then cold calls a 4bet. infact him coming a long is probably going to be better for us than if he didnt
 
daredeviljo

daredeviljo

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Fold here. 88 is definitely not the bottom of your opening range from that position. However, it's quite unlikely that you have higher pockets or they have a hand like A5s.Additionally, according to the 63 hand you've played in the table, this opponent is the tightest player in the table. Furthermore, there are still players behind.

With all of these factors in mind, you should almost definitely fold here. There are definitely better spots to take with your 35-40BB. If you lose the hand, you're likely playing the open-shove game.
 
U

uavissar

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this is a fold

you have to call 19bb to win 30bb so you need ~40% to make it even cEV

lets just assume his range is 99+/AQ+/AJs

88 has 37% vs that range

adjusting that range wider has very little affect on the equity as long as he has two cards higher than 8.

+ 1
I'd fold 99 and 1010 as well.
I think the range mbrenn put is very lax. I think he is shoving much tighter there. Going against the big stack (+200bb) with 2 more players. 1010+.
Furthermore you are not closing the action. Even JJ I'm folding there because I'm giving great odds to mr. big stack to call with AQ+.
... if SB was bluffing- kudos to him. You have over 35bb. Catch him in some other hand. No need to go suicidal with 88 here.
 
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