$3.30 NLHE MTT: BvB flop 2nd pair vs. maniac

Jacki Burkhart

Jacki Burkhart

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Heres a hand where I guess I missed value and gave villain 3 chances to suck out, but because of his crazy maniac stats I kept checking with the intent of calling any bet. what do we think?

Villian Stats (VPIP/PFR/AF):[/b] 53/34/13

Winning Poker Network (Yatahay) - 500/1,000 NL - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BB: 44.81 BB (VPIP: 52.73, PFR: 33.96, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, hands: 57)
UTG: 9.59 BB (VPIP: 24.14, PFR: 21.43, 3Bet Preflop: 11.11, Hands: 29)
CO: 22.54 BB (VPIP: 21.28, PFR: 18.09, 3Bet Preflop: 12.90, Hands: 94)
BTN: 17.92 BB (VPIP: 24.39, PFR: 17.50, 3Bet Preflop: 11.76, Hands: 41)
Hero (SB): 41.56 BB

5 players post ante of 0.1 BB, Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2 BB) Hero has 8:club: J:heart:

fold, fold, fold, Hero calls 0.5 BB, BB checks

Flop: (2.5 BB, 2 players) A:club: J:club: 4:spade:
Hero checks, BB checks

Turn: (2.5 BB, 2 players) Q:heart:
Hero checks, BB checks

River: (2.5 BB, 2 players) 2:diamond:
Hero checks, BB checks

[spoil]Hero shows 8:club: J:heart: (One Pair, Jacks)

Hero wins 2.5 BB
[/spoil]
 
mbrenneman0

mbrenneman0

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Personally id raise J8o bvb pre too exploitable to limp here. By raising we give ourselves a stronger range postflop.
 
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uavissar

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Personally id raise J8o bvb pre too exploitable to limp here.
This exactly. Raise pre and make another 1BB or something like that.
Also- I don't think 57 hands are sufficient to decide someone is a maniac (even with crazy stats like that). I expect a real maniac to bet turn once you checked...
 
mbrenneman0

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Yeah, i dont like using terms like maniac in hand analysis because it means different things to different people. Id prefer to say what their tendedncies are. "Passive player who calls too often." "Passive preflop bets when checked too." Those are better descriptions imo... but yeah, what makes him a maniac?
 
Jacki Burkhart

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His AF is 13 over 57 hands. He’s check raising like crazy triple barreling like crazy.

I agree 57 hands isn’t many for typical stats but when somebody’s VPIP is 53 and their PFR is 34 that means I’ve already watched this guy play 28 hands. That’s actually kind of a lot. I’ve seen him play as many hands as a guy who has a VPIP 20 over 140 hands. And he’s playing them in a spewy aggressive manner. That’s what I mean by maniac.

For instance I don’t think you can call somebody a nit after 57 hands cuz they just might be card dead. But when somebody is playing crazy aggressive in an illogical way you can figure that out in much less than 57 hands. You only have to see a couple showdowns actually.

Anyways yes I played this hand sub optimally, maniac or not.
 
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Edvin55555

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Maybe i'm not correct but i usually prefer to cbet flop in this kind of situation.
 
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trent32la

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Personally id raise J8o bvb pre too exploitable to limp here. By raising we give ourselves a stronger range postflop.
This is incorrect. Using a raising strategy with your entire raising range BvB is using an exploitive strategy. Using a limping strategy with your entire limping range BvB is much less exploitive and closer to GTO.

In a $3.30 MTT, I would never be worried about making plays that are "too exploitable", as playing anything but a weighted exploitive strategy in micro/lows will have you losing EV.
 
mbrenneman0

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This is incorrect. Using a raising strategy with your entire raising range BvB is using an exploitive strategy. Using a limping strategy with your entire limping range BvB is much less exploitive and closer to GTO.

In a $3.30 MTT, I would never be worried about making plays that are "too exploitable", as playing anything but a weighted exploitive strategy in micro/lows will have you losing EV.

I meant limping J8o is exploitable. Definitely limping a decent number of hands like suited connectors or 1 gappers and weak aces, including some hands that limp fold but i think if youre limp-folding J8o then you are limp-folding too many hands. Solve this by putting J8o into your raise folding range

I agree that you shouldnt worry about being too unexploitable in a 3.30 but we should default to a somewhat unexploitable strategy against unknowns. But in a game where most aggresive players attack limps we should balance our range away from limp folds and more toward limp calls and limp raises. Kind of like how we would probably be balancing our river overbetting range towards value at these stakes.
 
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liuouhgkres

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To be honest I would play exactly like this against aggressive maniac, would hate my life if I bet river and he raises huge, so I prefer to just play check-call on all streets.
 
Ryan Laplante

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Heres a hand where I guess I missed value and gave villain 3 chances to suck out, but because of his crazy maniac stats I kept checking with the intent of calling any bet. what do we think?

Villian Stats (VPIP/PFR/AF):[/b] 53/34/13

Winning Poker Network (Yatahay) - 500/1,000 NL - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BB: 44.81 BB (VPIP: 52.73, PFR: 33.96, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 57)
UTG: 9.59 BB (VPIP: 24.14, PFR: 21.43, 3Bet Preflop: 11.11, Hands: 29)
CO: 22.54 BB (VPIP: 21.28, PFR: 18.09, 3Bet Preflop: 12.90, Hands: 94)
BTN: 17.92 BB (VPIP: 24.39, PFR: 17.50, 3Bet Preflop: 11.76, Hands: 41)
Hero (SB): 41.56 BB

5 players post ante of 0.1 BB, Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2 BB) Hero has 8[emoji814]: J[emoji813]

fold, fold, fold, Hero calls 0.5 BB, BB checks

Flop: (2.5 BB, 2 players) A[emoji814]: J[emoji814]: 4[emoji812]:
Hero checks, BB checks

Turn: (2.5 BB, 2 players) Q[emoji813]
Hero checks, BB checks

River: (2.5 BB, 2 players) 2[emoji815]:
Hero checks, BB checks

[spoil]Hero shows 8[emoji814]: J[emoji813] (One Pair, Jacks)

Hero wins 2.5 BB
[/spoil]
Pre is good. We'd raise vs tight/passive players, complete vs lags/good regs.

Id bet flop vs most, but dont mind checking here vs this opponent. Def checking turn, def checking river (would call a bet).

I think you played it well vs this lag villain.
 
Jacki Burkhart

Jacki Burkhart

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Pre is good. We'd raise vs tight/passive players, complete vs lags/good regs.

Id bet flop vs most, but dont mind checking here vs this opponent. Def checking turn, def checking river (would call a bet).

I think you played it well vs this lag villain.

Limp folding to his 3x raise I assume? Or limp calling?
 
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