$16.5 NLHE MTT Rebuy: Did I overplayed 99s on BU vs. BB?

Relatively large field, $16,5 MTT (Big Fish) on 888. Brand new table without known villains.

888 Poker - 300/600 Ante 75 NL - Holdem - 9 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

SB: 43.03 BB
BB: 45.74 BB
UTG: 59.57 BB
UTG+1: 86.29 BB
MP: 31.06 BB
MP+1: 58.89 BB
MP+2: 88.95 BB
CO: 43.41 BB
Hero (BTN): 43.06 BB

9 players post ante of 0.13 BB, SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.62 BB) Hero has 9♠ 9♦

fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 2.81 BB, fold, BB calls 1.81 BB

Flop: (7.25 BB, 2 players) 5♦ 7♦ A♠
BB bets 2 BB, Hero raises to 4.5 BB, BB calls 2.5 BB

Villain donks at me small bet, but I can't put him always on Ax there, although it's very possible. I'm beating flush draws and lower pairs or even OESD, so I re-raise trying to test him. But he calls.

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Turn: (16.25 BB, 2 players) Q♥
BB checks, Hero bets 8 BB, BB calls 8 BB

Those Queen doesn't seem to change anything. If he has Ace, then he has it, if not I could probably force him to fold. So I keep on my aggression with half pot bet.

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River: (32.25 BB, 2 players) K♦
BB bets 30.31 BB and is all-in, fold

Suddenly he goes all-in, as if he just hit his flush. Although actually I'm blocking it with my 9 of diamonds. :hmmmm2: But with 3 cards higher on board, there is no call for me.

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So what are your thoughts, did I played too aggressive there? What would you change in my line?

I like raising the flop, especially with your backdoor straight and flush equity. I'd raise a bit on the larger size though. The turn absolutely changes things, this is a bad card for you. Lots of flush draws have just paired and now beat you. I'd check back the turn and call bets on brick rivers, fold on dangerous rivers. If the turn had been a 6, 8 or diamond I keep barreling, but otherwise I like checking back and playing rivers.

Sizing?

alienat3d said:

Relatively large field, $16,5 MTT (Big Fish) on 888. Brand new table without known villains.

888 Poker - 300/600 Ante 75 NL - Holdem - 9 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

SB: 43.03 BB
BB: 45.74 BB
UTG: 59.57 BB
UTG+1: 86.29 BB
MP: 31.06 BB
MP+1: 58.89 BB
MP+2: 88.95 BB
CO: 43.41 BB
Hero (BTN): 43.06 BB

9 players post ante of 0.13 BB, SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.62 BB) Hero has 9♠ 9♦

fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 2.81 BB, fold, BB calls 1.81 BB

Flop: (7.25 BB, 2 players) 5♦ 7♦ A♠
BB bets 2 BB, Hero raises to 4.5 BB, BB calls 2.5 BB
Turn: (16.25 BB, 2 players) Q♥
BB checks, Hero bets 8 BB, BB calls 8 BB
River: (32.25 BB, 2 players) K♦
BB bets 30.31 BB and is all-in, fold
So what are your thoughts, did I played too aggressive there? What would you change in my line?

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Thank you for posting.

Have you run hands through the cardchat odds calculator? Try running Ad2d or QdJd or Ad2c etc.?
Excellent opportunity to understand equity vs a leading range.

Lets assume the draw is 8d6d not any of the Adxd that will never fold on the flop or turn.
Opp had 46+% equity on flop
After OPP bets 2bb pot is 9.25bb U raise to 4.5bb pot now 13.75 OPP has to call 2.5bb
5+-1 odds for a hand with 46% equity?
The act may have been aggressive the sizing was not.

Try the same exercise with other hands and their equities.

If you have any questions just reply by using the "quote and post" and I will be notified by email and respond more quickly.

Hope this helps

Well , his play is a standard line of play that most players who realize that if they decide to call on the flop and turn, the only way to win is by bluffing on the river with a shove when they missed their flush draw.
This doesn't necessarily mean he had a fush draw. He could've had an Ax hand as well but there's honestly not much you could've done post flop if he indeed had a flush draw because he would've already planned ahead and decided to jam the river upon missing his draw.

I do not understand why you're doing raises on the flop.

you have a hand of value 99, when you make raises, you are representing the A, and you would be turning your hand into a bluff, and it is not necessary.

both have more than 40bb, are many chips, it is better to control the pot, and keep it small, and bring your hand to showdown the cheapest.
regularly when a player makes mini donkbets, they can not play, and they do it with projects, your fold on the river I think it was the best option.

gl

@ ammje - You shouldn't play your specific hand so much as your range of hands. You have more aces and better aces in your range, so it makes sense for you to raise here a lot of the time. I won't always raise, there are some calls mixed in, but on this board with the backdoor straight and flush equity I favor a raise. If the board was something like A83 rainbow I'd favor more calls and mix in a few raises.

skeptix said:

@ ammje - You shouldn't play your specific hand so much as your range of hands. You have more aces and better aces in your range, so it makes sense for you to raise here a lot of the time. I won't always raise, there are some calls mixed in, but on this board with the backdoor straight and flush equity I favor a raise. If the board was something like A83 rainbow I'd favor more calls and mix in a few raises.

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Hi, but what are you going to increase on the flop ?, if you have a showdown hand, the villain is not going to fold your raises on the flop.
So you're going to make the pot bigger with 99 ?, if the villain does not have the A, you're winning the hand, take it cheap to showdown.

If you had 18bb, maybe I like the line of making raises, and push on the turn, but with more than 40bb,
gl

i don't like your bet on the turn, because opp will not fold A or straight\flush dro. just check the turn and see the river.

Calling and always calling gives your opponent way too much information about the quality of your hand. If you always do the same thing for the same reason you will become very predictable and easy to play against.

I think I would have either made a stronger raise after the flop and made a big move on the turn, or played it a bit more passively. The mini-bet is probably a flush or straight draw. People generally won't fold those draws on the flop. I'm probably either calling and planning to put a ton of pressure on him on the turn with a brick, or raising significantly more and planning to put a ton of pressure on him on the turn with a brick. The Q turn is a very bad turn though. If he indeed has a flush draw, it's going to include a Q so much of the time which significantly improves his odds....making it harder to push him off the hand. As played, I am definitely checking the turn and not encountering that spot on the river. As played to the river, obviously an easy fold. You aren't beating anything at this point except 86 or 64.

Looks like he got the flush on the river, maybe when raising the flop make it 3x but if he did have the flush draw he wasn't folding anyway. it's a tough board for 99 and we should be trying to win every pot we are in so i don't fault you here, I like your play just unfortunate the diamond hit on the river. Did you over play your 99? Nah i think you played it well. Gl in the next 1.

You have second pair on the flop, his range is wide and contains Ax or any suited connectors, if he bet, your move should be only call, he bet 2BB,, of course he will pay 2,5BB to call, pot odds are pretty cool. Action on turn is also wrong, why? because if he check you received free card on the turn, use this! don' bet toughtlessly! And position, maybe he wanted bleffing you but like you mentioned you didin't know this player 0% information, be careful for the future

Seems like they were drawing to a flush. The small donk bet is always unsettling to me. But I think it usually means that they have some sort of hand, even if it is just drawing, and they want to see where they are at. If the diamond doesn't hit on the river, they probably fold since they know you have something. That's how I read it. I welcome other interpretations, especially regarding these small donk leads, which honestly I hardly understand.

If I was trying to plays 99`s in this situation, I would just go all in pre-flop and narrow the field, because someone will out flop the nines. Usually I just fold these. And, once you reach the flop you can only bluff.

Winning chips not hands!

Erpherk said:

Looks like he got the flush on the river, maybe when raising the flop make it 3x but if he did have the flush draw he wasn't folding anyway. it's a tough board for 99 and we should be trying to win every pot we are in so i don't fault you here, I like your play just unfortunate the diamond hit on the river. Did you over play your 99? Nah i think you played it well. Gl in the next 1.

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Thank you for posting.
We cannot win every hand so setting that as a goal is not a perfect strategy. In this example if our opponent has AdXd we are likely not going to win. Trying to win hands you cannot win gets expensive.

You may consider an approach of losing less when behind and winning more when ahead. Coupled with stealing pots that are more likely to be stolen.

Hope this helps.

alienat3d said:

Relatively large field, $16,5 MTT (Big Fish) on 888. Brand new table without known villains.

888 Poker - 300/600 Ante 75 NL - Holdem - 9 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

SB: 43.03 BB
BB: 45.74 BB
UTG: 59.57 BB
UTG+1: 86.29 BB
MP: 31.06 BB
MP+1: 58.89 BB
MP+2: 88.95 BB
CO: 43.41 BB
Hero (BTN): 43.06 BB

9 players post ante of 0.13 BB, SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.62 BB) Hero has 9♠ 9♦

fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 2.81 BB, fold, BB calls 1.81 BB

Flop: (7.25 BB, 2 players) 5♦ 7♦ A♠
BB bets 2 BB, Hero raises to 4.5 BB, BB calls 2.5 BB
Turn: (16.25 BB, 2 players) Q♥
BB checks, Hero bets 8 BB, BB calls 8 BB
River: (32.25 BB, 2 players) K♦
BB bets 30.31 BB and is all-in, fold
So what are your thoughts, did I played too aggressive there? What would you change in my line?

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With no reads on the villain I have to use my default ranges for him/her and on the button that would be about 35% - 40% of playable hands.


Now that we bet and get called our raise, it narrows his range some to ~ 30%.

Pre-Flop play is great as we have 70% equity against villains range.

Pot: 3672

But I feel it changes after that.

When we have bet into the pot with a pocket pair and an over card flops we should change gears and start pot control,

villain donk bets into us on flop, this narrows his range considerably and puts us behind or in a race. :ahhhhh: on the flop against villains assigned range we are at a slight equity advantage.

Hero raises, this is the opposite of pot control and is elevating the pot...before applying aggression in an instance like this one, one must think of the turn and river and what we are going to do if we don't improve and villain bets into us again, what happens if villain raises what are we going to do?

If the answer at this point is fold to further aggression then fold now, if the answer is go all in then go all in now, if the answer is call then call and check it down, the most important thing is to make a plan and stick with it, learn from it and move on.

Pot: 9072 (if just called then 6072)

The Turn comes out ant the villain checks to the hero Re-raiser.

The Turn also puts a second over card to our nines on the board!

Also with the turn card the equity is now in favor of the villains hand range than our pocket nines.

Pot: 18672 (If we had called the flop and checked behind on the turn then 6072)

Once the river comes out and we become the 2:1 underdog in terms of equity it is clear Hero made the right choice and folded on the river.


When I look at this hand it reminds me of many hands I have played in the past and I have found that pot control is very important in these instances and will change the way our opponents play.

For me, the flop was a call and the turn was a check behind. Again pot control!

For instance:

if hero would not have raised the flop and checked behind on the turn, villain would not have had the pot size needed to go all in (sometime that doesn't make a diff) as it is, it is a 2X pot bet, where if we would have not raised the flop and checked behind on the turn
it would have be almost 4X the pot.

What if we called the flop instead of raise? Would villain make a turn bet? Maybe, maybe not but if he/she did we could easily fold if it were large and seemed like villain want to get his/her stack in by river, or call a small bet and exercise pot control to see a cheap showdown.

Is hard to say but we must think of all avenues as we play to play well.

Hope this was helpful,
Regards,
GiGiCat

A typical mistake of a player is too overestimating the strength of his hand and unnoticing anything around. Calling preflop can mean that the villain has decided to protect his big bland with any speculative hand, for example T ♦ B ♦. An ace on the flop, a flush is not completed, and the straight is still very far away, so a small distracting mini raise 2BB. You do not confuse all these little things and you are happy to swallow the hook away. Superraise 4.5 BB to sweat 9.25 BB ??? TOTAL: 13.75. Well, of course, you have 99 diamond that is not killed, which is probably why you decided to offer the villain 13.75 / 2.5 = 5.5 pot odds, which allows him to call with almost any two cards. I RECOMMEND to compare them with the odds against building a flush on the turn and further on the river. Even the lady on the river did not bother you, nevertheless you are already doomed. The river becomes too wide and the villain’s outs - that of sand on the sea. But Superman from 99 throws 8 more explosives at the bank. And only the wrong overbet of the villain saved you from ruin. In the case of Ax, you would lose a lot less. Good luck!

:sheep: