$0.50 NLHE MTT Rebuy: $micro NLHE MTT Rebuy: The Situation - MTT Call Shove in BB with A/8 o

$0.50 NLHE MTT Rebuy: $micro NLHE MTT Rebuy: The Situation - MTT Call Shove in BB with A/8 o

The title is incorrect - the Bttn did not shove.

MTT $100gtd, late registration closed. Nearing money bubble 100 players remain out of 2000 runners, top 75 place ITM.

Hero in BB with 23bigs
Villain is Bttn when Hero is BB.
Villain has Hero covered with 50bb.

Villain has raised 85% of hands over the past 8 orbits 3-4x open from CO/Bttn

Hero has played back at Villain twice with marginal holdings and missed the flop entirely. Bluffed c-bet and was called down to showdown and re-raised once.
Villain has shown to call pre-flop re-raises with suited gappers, and will call all the way down to showdown.
Villain has shown to call shoves with A/rag, and J/9 off.

Villain will call down all the way to show down. Has done this at least 4 times with other smaller stacks including SB who is under 10 BB at this point.

Villain opens 4x from Bttn.

Hero is holding A/8 off.


How do you proceed?

Your opponent is too loose a player, his range is too wide and luck plays a decisive role. You should be very careful and try to minimize risks by entering the game with good hands. A8 is not quite suitable for this purpose.

All in. If we lose and bust, then so be it. Its worth the risk, because if we dubble up, we are in a great position to not only cash but also make a run for the final table. As a side benefit if this guy lose half his stack, he can no longer "run the table", and he will probably go on monkey tilt and lose the rest within the next orbit or two. Which is also beneficial for us, because it allow us to start winning some small pots without showdown, which is very important in the middle and late stage of tournaments.

if he is raising 85% then you have About 59% equity, so shoving is fine.
You also have enough fold equity to let him fold most of his range and if he calls with a lot of Hands worse than A8o, we are still in a good spot.


Button vs BB I would shove here.
Folding and getting our Tiny stack in the mincash is not going to win us a lot

mara2259 said:

Your opponent is too loose a player, his range is too wide and luck plays a decisive role. You should be very careful and try to minimize risks by entering the game with good hands. A8 is not quite suitable for this purpose.

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You have to consider the Position and stats from V.
85% PFR in the last 70-80 Hands (if it's full ring)
Opening from the button and hero is in the BB, no one else to act behind.
With those circumstances I would jam 100% of the time.


The same spot with V in UTG and us in MP, I would fold 99% of the time with 23bb, A8o, close to the bubble and other Players behind to act.

Results

mara2259 said:

Your opponent is too loose a player, his range is too wide and luck plays a decisive role. You should be very careful and try to minimize risks by entering the game with good hands. A8 is not quite suitable for this purpose.

Click to expand...

fundiver199 said:

All in. If we lose and bust, then so be it. Its worth the risk, because if we dubble up, we are in a great position to not only cash but also make a run for the final table. As a side benefit if this guy lose half his stack, he can no longer "run the table", and he will probably go on monkey tilt and lose the rest within the next orbit or two. Which is also beneficial for us, because it allow us to start winning some small pots without showdown, which is very important in the middle and late stage of tournaments.

Click to expand...

Veritas said:

if he is raising 85% then you have About 59% Equity, so shoving is fine.
You also have enough fold equity to let him fold most of his range and if he calls with a lot of Hands worse than A8o, we are still in a good spot.

Button vs BB I would shove here.
Folding and getting our Tiny stack in the mincash is not going to win us a lot


You have to consider the Position and stats from V.
85% PFR in the last 70-80 Hands (if it's full ring)
Opening from the button and hero is in the BB, no one else to act behind.
With those circumstances I would jam 100% of the time.


The same spot with V in UTG and us in MP, I would fold 99% of the time with 23bb, A8o, close to the bubble and other Players behind to act.

Click to expand...

Thanks for your input guys.
Mara - I respect and agree with your point of view often. I take into account I still have about 15 orbits to find a better hand in a better spot and that is a lot of time to find better circumstances.
Great point about the luck playing a big role in his loose play.

Fundiver / Veritas In that moment I made the shove. Villain turned over 9/T o.
Flop came 7,9,A
Turn Q
River T.

So I busted - but I think that was the correct move at that time. This time it didn't work out, but yesterday evening the same move worked 3 times. A/8 s got a pre-flop fold. A/5 o got a pre-flop fold, and A/9 o won and doubled me up late, nearing final table.

Oddly - I had two big stacks on my right alternating the bully role, and I was mystified when they both folded to my shoves. Both players had over 100k in chips and I was sitting between 28-38k during this time.
I think the folds may have been a result of a couple things, they were bullying with marginal hands and I'd played pretty tight so I was essentially an unknown player. The only hand I can remember going to showdown when they were on the table was pocket Ks that hit a set on the river, and I busted out a player with 5-6bb total.

100% with A/8?

Veritas said:

You have to consider the Position and stats from V.
85% PFR in the last 70-80 Hands (if it's full ring)
Opening from the button and hero is in the BB, no one else to act behind.
With those circumstances I would jam 100% of the time.

Click to expand...

To clarify here - you would jam with 100% of hands - or you would jam 100% with A/8?
I doubt jamming 100% of hands would result in anything other than bust out.

The reason I detailed a couple of prior failed continuations was because I had crap holdings nearly every time this situation arose.
I don't think jamming 100% of hands here is positive value, although I believe you probably meant this would be a jam here 100% with A/8.
Thanks Veritas

From my point of view I think that the most important thing is to enter ITM, any risk must be calculated with great precision and for what you detail of the villains it is not convenient for you to risk your stack of chips without needing knowing that you could be out of the tournament.
If your stack of chips were not below and you detect that the villains are very tight you could steal the blinds easily and I would advise you to attack but under the circumstances surrounding you the FOLD is immediate

theANMATOR said:

To clarify here - you would jam with 100% of hands - or you would jam 100% with A/8?
I doubt jamming 100% of hands would result in anything other than bust out.

The reason I detailed a couple of prior failed continuations was because I had crap holdings nearly every time this situation arose.
I don't think jamming 100% of hands here is positive value, although I believe you probably meant this would be a jam here 100% with A/8.
Thanks Veritas

Click to expand...

I would jam A8 everytime against him.
I would also jam any A, any PP, JT+, QT+ and KT+

theANMATOR said:

Fundiver / Veritas In that moment I made the shove. Villain turned over 9/T o.
Flop came 7,9,A
Turn Q
River T.

So I busted - but I think that was the correct move at that time. This time it didn't work out, but yesterday evening the same move worked 3 times. A/8 s got a pre-flop fold. A/5 o got a pre-flop fold, and A/9 o won and doubled me up late, nearing final table.

Oddly - I had two big stacks on my right alternating the bully role, and I was mystified when they both folded to my shoves. Both players had over 100k in chips and I was sitting between 28-38k during this time.
I think the folds may have been a result of a couple things, they were bullying with marginal hands and I'd played pretty tight so I was essentially an unknown player. The only hand I can remember going to showdown when they were on the table was pocket Ks that hit a set on the river, and I busted out a player with 5-6bb total.

Click to expand...

well you made the right move and he had a lucky runout. if he calls with T9 he is always behind or in best case flipping. so it's a terrible call.
glad to see it worked for you in the next tournament.
Good luck!

disoft21 said:

From my point of view I think that the most important thing is to enter ITM, any risk must be calculated with great precision and for what you detail of the villains it is not convenient for you to risk your stack of chips without needing knowing that you could be out of the tournament.
If your stack of chips were not below and you detect that the villains are very tight you could steal the blinds easily and I would advise you to attack but under the circumstances surrounding you the FOLD is immediate

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we can't fold to a button open range of 85% when we hold A8o
min cash is kinda worthless. if we win this hand, we have a good chance for a deeper run or even the FT where the big money is.

I would personnally have folded... why risk my tournament at such a late stage with a medicre hand...
You still have enough chips to wait for a better situation and with villain you have someone who makes it likely you will get paid for your monster...

Why go fishing for 3 outs, because hitting the ace is the only way to make a strong hand. You have literally no chances to catch a flush or a straight with A8o. And even donls with 85% PFR have a decent hand every once in a while.

I would rather make a move like this with suited connectors instead if you prefer to miss ITM for a better chance to reach the top places.

Veritas said:

we can't fold to a button open range of 85% when we hold A8o
min cash is kinda worthless. if we win this hand, we have a good chance for a deeper run or even the FT where the big money is.

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Agree - I think yesterdays results back this up substantially. In the first even I busted pre min-cash and min-cashing was basically buy-in, so better to go for it or bust.

Yesterday the 3 big blind shoves provided momentum for me to place 18th instead of min-cashing down around 70th place.

kraemer said:

I would personnally have folded... why risk my tournament at such a late stage with a medicre hand...
You still have enough chips to wait for a better situation and with villain you have someone who makes it likely you will get paid for your monster...

Why go fishing for 3 outs, because hitting the ace is the only way to make a strong hand. You have literally no chances to catch a flush or a straight with A8o. And even donls with 85% PFR have a decent hand every once in a while.
We are ahead against any Kx, Qx, Jx, suited connector, weaker Aces. we are flipping 22-77 so we don't have to hit the A to win the Hand, A high is fine against most of his Holdings!
I would rather make a move like this with suited connectors instead if you prefer to miss ITM for a better chance to reach the top places.

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well he has 10% Chance to get a top 8.5% Hand which has us dominated (30:70). the other 90% we are a 60:40 fav against his 85% PRF range.
If you want to fold into the mincash (1buy-in) go ahead, but in the Long run your ROI will suffer from those decisions. We have to take the Chance to double up, and this is a good one against a very LAG big stack bully.
I totally agree with you that A8o is not a strong Hand, but in this Situation it is.
also with 23bb we still have some fold equity and a stack where we should not wait too Long because we hit the 10-15bb area really soon.
Not sure why you say you would fold A8o to make the Money but you would make this move with suited connectors?! they are a lot weaker and not worth the gamble with a 23bb stack. they are fine to call the raise, but not worth the 23bb shove

theANMATOR said:

Agree - I think yesterdays results back this up substantially. In the first even I busted pre min-cash and min-cashing was basically buy-in, so better to go for it or bust.

Yesterday the 3 big blind shoves provided momentum for me to place 18th instead of min-cashing down around 70th place.

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if the min-cash is only the buy-in, you have to make the Money everytime to break even (0$ won). so it is even more obvious how useless it is to fold ITM while your stack shrinks. Once you make a rebuy, even the mincash is -% ROI....
congrats on the 18th place