what to do with AQo on turn raise ?

W

westaspire

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Hello,
I appreciate any help.

$0.10 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players

SB: $10.81
BB: $10.00
UTG: $14.67 VP: 20 | PR: 14
CO: $10.18
Hero (BTN): $11.22

SB posts SB $0.05, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: (pot: $0.15) Hero has A♣ Q♠
UTG raises to $0.30, fold, Hero raises to $0.80, fold, fold, UTG calls $0.50

Flop: ($1.75, 2 players) A♦ 9♦ 9♣
UTG checks, Hero bets $1.30, UTG calls $1.30

Turn: ($4.35, 2 players) 3♦
UTG checks, Hero bets $2.90, UTG raises to $7.00, Hero? and why?

Did i make a mistake 3betting pfr?

Bests,
Bgd
 
C

cheddachris

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risky trying to play high pair here....
although you have a good kicker,
with a raise like that he is either bluffing, hit his flush or had the third 9 and wanted to slowplay until you made the 3$ bet.... id fold it unless it is a player who has been continuing to bluff throughout the game
 
T

TheWall

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All that you beat is a weaker A or air. Its probably a fold. You perhaps played the hand a little too aggressively especially after the diamond hit.
 
Weregoat

Weregoat

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Hello,
I appreciate any help.

$0.10 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players

SB: $10.81
BB: $10.00
UTG: $14.67 VP: 20 | PR: 14
CO: $10.18
Hero (BTN): $11.22

SB posts SB $0.05, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: (pot: $0.15) Hero has A♣ Q♠
UTG raises to $0.30, fold, Hero raises to $0.80, fold, fold, UTG calls $0.50

Flop: ($1.75, 2 players) A♦ 9♦ 9♣
UTG checks, Hero bets $1.30, UTG calls $1.30

Turn: ($4.35, 2 players) 3♦
UTG checks, Hero bets $2.90, UTG raises to $7.00, Hero? and why?

Did i make a mistake 3betting pfr?

Bests,
Bgd

Villain is PFR 14% of his hands, AQo is ahead of 14% of hands, however he's under the gun, so you can knock off a couple % for his range, however it's 6-handed, so you can add on a couple % for his range. Flop presents a flush draw and a paired board. You hold on A, which means there are four cards out there to represent possible made hands. (Two aces, and two nines). The check/call on the flop could be a slow played 9, a flush draw, or a weaker A. Rarely would I expect AK to check/call this flop.

The turn presents a completed flush draw. Check raises on the turn usually come from strong completed hands. However it also presents a scare card. "If you're going to bluff, bluff when the scare card hits" - Me. I'd probably check this turn here, as while you pick up a few outs, you're drawing slim against a K high flush, and raising can create a real predicament.

What I'd do: Jam. It's only $10.

What I'd do if this were a lot more money: You're beating a weaker A, a pocket pair that doesn't have any friends on the board, and a bluff.

And this is quite the situation. You're in this pot for 40 BBs and he wants to play for 41 more. A river that doesn't improve us puts the pot at some 160 BBs and we really can't fold, so it's either jam or fold here.

It depends on our villain and how he plays. Against an unknown I'm checking the turn behind.

As played, I'd probably fold and reload.
 
WVHillbilly

WVHillbilly

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I like flatting preflop.

As played, I think you need to check back the turn (as much as that sucks if the 4th diamond hits the river). That said he shouldn't have hardly anything in his range that beats you here. He likely 4bets AK/AA preflop. He shouldn't have called the 3bet pre with Kxdd. There are 2 9s on the board so he's unlikely to have one and 33 folds to the flop bet.

I don't know, feel like gambling?
 
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zebadie

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I think its hard to tell whether he had the flush or bluff, he knows hes bluffing if he has a weaker A, he knows (thinks) you havent hit the flush bc he cant see you been so aggressive when it shows, big chance for him to bluff. I think you created too much of a pot on the turn when the scary diamond showed, giving him a chance to make a realistic bluff, i cannot see him having any ace at all unless he has AA or he is poor and thinks he is in front with AJ but given that his vp/pr ratio is high hes obviously not a fish, the reason i cant put him on an ace is bc i cant see him check calling the flop and checking back to you on the turn with an ace bc it gives him no info. I think the way you played it i would have to fold, i would say next time you're in this position defo check to get your free card and weigh it up again. I mean...what can you be beating..... not lots, a bluff or weak ace ( as above) no way has he got another PP (unless AA or 99) bc he wouldn't raise you after a 3 bet pf. (gotta eliminate 33 given his vp lowish and the call on the flop)
My guess(es) is he overated his A9 and flopped the dream... he had 99 although id rather say he had AA, im not sure now i can put him on a flush either, the board is paired.. would he give you the chance to check and land a FH? Don't think so, i'm eliminating the hnds as i type lol.. scratch AA, im daft, defo reraise pre flop unless hes crazy.
Im thinking he either was weak pf and had A9, checked hoping you'd bet your AK (what he mighta thought) and waited for the turn bet, off you, to raise it.
OR
He has 99 and is basically trying to get as much of you as he can.
OR (im gonna have to say this is my fave)
He has picked up on the diamond on the turn and used it, along with the two 9s showing, and pulled a nice bluff.
The mistake was betting the turn i think, check the turn, although you will probably have the same dilemma on the river, so.... maybe (unless he bluffed) you did the 'cheapest' thing (if you folded on the turn after his raise) by getting check raised bc if you checked the turn i think it would have been very hard to fold the river, even with a big bet.
AQ is a hard hand to play.. pot control is probably your best tactic here.
 
slycbnew

slycbnew

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Ugly spot. I really want to fold to baluga's (Villain's flop/turn line c/c, c/r) with TP2K without a specific read that Villain spews, except that I think we're pot committed in a 3bet pot at this point. Agree w WVH that checking the turn is distasteful but prob correct here unless we're willing to stack off.
 
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Kidsoldja

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I would have folded this hand when he made that raise pf. I think him being in position put you in a tough spot to begin with. What kind history can you share about villain, is he known to bluff? is he tight? in all honesty regardless, that diamond on the turn didnt help you and the fact that he didnt back down from your bet and reraised you implies he has a strong hand. I would fold.
 
ChuckTs

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Preflop is fine, assuming you think he calls with lots of worse hands like JTs, KQs and stuff like small-medium pocket pairs that give up postflop somewhat easily. It's a value 3bet, and we're folding to a 4bet.

Postflop looks ok, but on the turn you have to know what you're doing when you bet. It is in effect a wa/wb spot which means maintaining pot control is always a fine line, but if you think he's got lots of aces in his range then betting is just fine. The problem is stuff like A2 will very rarely check/raise this turn because it just wouldn't make sense, so your turn bet is a very clear bet/fold.
 
WVHillbilly

WVHillbilly

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Preflop is fine, assuming you think he calls with lots of worse hands like JTs, KQs and stuff like small-medium pocket pairs that give up postflop somewhat easily. It's a value 3bet, and we're folding to a 4bet.

Postflop looks ok, but on the turn you have to know what you're doing when you bet. It is in effect a wa/wb spot which means maintaining pot control is always a fine line, but if you think he's got lots of aces in his range then betting is just fine. The problem is stuff like A2 will very rarely check/raise this turn because it just wouldn't make sense, so your turn bet is a very clear bet/fold.

I don't play 6-max (or full ring particularly well for that matter) so maybe my ranges are all off but what does a relatively tight player who opens UTG and calls a 3bet OOP show up with here that beat us? Quads and ?
 
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westaspire

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My decision was also to fold, but was an autopilot decision I guess. I checked my hand history with him and I have about 500 hands with the UTG player. From what I saw he never bluffs or floats. I guess I have to put him on A9o or Kxs.

Thank you for your replies.
Good luck at the tables.
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

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I don't play 6-max (or full ring particularly well for that matter) so maybe my ranges are all off but what does a relatively tight player who opens UTG and calls a 3bet OOP show up with here that beat us? Quads and ?

It's definitely wider than quads but I see your point. Thing is this guy isn't a 16/14 who will 4bet/fold most of his range OOP vs a 3bet, and as such will have a much wider calling range preflop. I don't think 54d is in his range everytime, but there are definitely enough to outweigh the part of his range we beat. ie AxJd will rarely c/c this flop and c/~minraise the turn like this, at least not in my experience. I guess he could be spazzing with a slowplayed KdKx here but that's just as unlikely IME.

So yeah: {KQd/KJd/KTd/QJd/JTd/78d/67d/54d, 99, 98s, 9Ts, AA, A9s} (some of which are discounted of course), and compare that to the range we beat which is a heavily discounted {AxJd/KdKx/QdQx/JdJx/TdTx} type of range. I could be wrong about how often that second group of hands shows up here, but have a hard time believing it's enough to call a turn raise like this.
 
WVHillbilly

WVHillbilly

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I can't fault a fold and if you think he has all those 9s in his range it's for the best.

At FR you'd see a poorly played KdKx or QdQx here more than any 9 ime.

I'm also the "curious" type (read: calling station), so maybe I'm manipulating his range so I can call. :)
 
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