PL Omaha high

Table is really crazy. I don't think anyone knows how to play this game.

Hand #55254605-15365 at Hudson (Pot Limit Omaha)
Started at 27/Jul/08 18:16:47

Hank R is at seat 1 with $14.05.
mufgator is at seat 2 with $11.25.
bubbasbest is at seat 3 with $41.60.
The button is at seat 2.

bubbasbest posts the small blind of $.25.
Hank R posts the big blind of $.50.
Hank R: -- -- -- --
mufgator: -- -- -- --
bubbasbest: Qh Ac As Kd
Pre-flop:

mufgator calls. bubbasbest raises to $2. Hank R
folds. mufgator calls.
Flop (board: 3s 4s Jc):

bubbasbest bets $4.50. mufgator calls.
Turn (board: 3s 4s Jc Js):

bubbasbest checks. mufgator goes all-in for $4.75.
bubbasbest ?

looks like you have to fold here

There's $18.25 in the pot and you have $4.75 to call.

That's 3.8:1 pot odds. You have to have the best hand 20.6% of the time for this to be break even.

Welcome to Pot Committed, population = you.

This the part where I play my gut and hope its right. I would probly call because of the pot odds c9h laid out.

There is NO WAY you win this hand even 20% of the time. Fold.

WVHillbilly said:

There is NO WAY you win this hand even 20% of the time. Fold.

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Even 3 handed against retards?

c9h13no3 said:

Even 3 handed against retards?

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retards tend to know when they have a made hand. They don't tend to know when they should fold their hand instead of chase.

There's gonna be at least one flush and/or jack out there I'd say > 80% of the time.

Spade flush, 3 Js, boat possiblities just got there, even if you hit another spade for the nut flush you might be drawing dead. 2 remaining Aces are your only safe outs that I can see.

There's always the chance he's bluffing, depending on his style and his perception of your style.

I probably fold this too, but I'm no PLO expert.

NineLions said:

..., even if you hit another spade for the nut flush you might be drawing dead. .

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He won't have a flush even if a 4th spade hit. This is omaha, you *must* use exactly 2 of your 4 hole cards. Since he only has one spade he can't make a spade flush. He wouldn't have a flush if there were 5 spades on the board =).

he's got you by the nads spades , 33 , 44 , j etc. etc .
I can't see you folding for $5 with so much money in already but then again I can't see putting all that money in with that hand .
I'd say go for it , $5 for two outs and a lesson on over valuing that hand when you don't get a strong piece of the flop . JMO

Best case you have 4 outs (2 A's and 2 J's) when he only has the flush, so around 8% to get there on the river. If he has a J you have about a 4% chance. Even if this a KK bluffing 10% of the time (it's not BTW) you should fold.

jaymfc said:

he's got you by the nads spades , 33 , 44 , j etc. etc .
I can't see you folding for $5 with so much money in already but then again I can't see putting all that money in with that hand .
I'd say go for it , $5 for two outs and a lesson on over valuing that hand when you don't get a strong piece of the flop . JMO

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This is a great flop to pot it on after raising with aces. We're stacking any non-spade, non-J turn card for sure. The guy has 11$! We got 2$ in preflop, and $4.50 in on a dry flop. Sure the turn came horribly, but sometimes that happens.

c9h13no3 said:

This is a great flop to pot it on after raising with aces. We're stacking any non-spade, non-J turn card for sure. The guy has 11$! We got 2$ in preflop, and $4.50 in on a dry flop. Sure the turn came horribly, but sometimes that happens.

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This to me is the best advice here. Here's the results.

Hank R: -- -- -- --
mufgator: -- -- -- --
bubbasbest: Qh Ac As Kd
Pre-flop:

mufgator calls. bubbasbest raises to $2. Hank R
folds. mufgator calls.
Flop (board: 3s 4s Jc):

bubbasbest bets $4.50. mufgator calls.
Turn (board: 3s 4s Jc Js):

bubbasbest checks. mufgator goes all-in for $4.75.
bubbasbest calls.
River (board: 3s 4s Jc Js Tc):

(no action in this round)


Showdown:

mufgator shows Qs 7c Qc 7s.
mufgator has Qs 7s 3s 4s Js: flush, queen high.
bubbasbest mucks cards.
(bubbasbest has Qh Ac As Kd.)

pot on the flop might have been the best play but on the turn i think it is a fold

Best case you have 4 outs (2 A's and 2 J's) when he only has the flush, so around 8% to get there on the river. If he has a J you have about a 4% chance. Even if this a KK bluffing 10% of the time (it's not BTW) you should fold.

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this^^

WVHillbilly said:

Best case you have 4 outs (2 A's and 2 J's) when he only has the flush, so around 8% to get there on the river. If he has a J you have about a 4% chance. Even if this a KK bluffing 10% of the time (it's not BTW) you should fold.

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I agree that it's hard to find a hand that you are beating, but i'd pay the $4.75 to see what he's got. He's clearly not got the nut flush, as you've got the Ace - if he stays around, the money is only going to be on short term loan.

He was pot commited after he called your $2 bet on the flop. I think you could of folded this hand but I can understand why you called. The pot odds were there. You played it aggressively and the hand just did not materialize for you. I think you played it in a way that will win money over the long term.

I think it's a good call. If they're really playing that loose, he could have a weaker overpair, a straight draw, or possibly even something like TT with some overs or a straight draw. This hand was heads up the whole way, so he should have a much more wide open range to call the flop. Although you're a big underdog versus a lot of hands, he can also be a pretty big underdog versus you, enough so that I think you can win it 25% or maybe even 30% of the time.

viking999 said:

I think it's a good call. If they're really playing that loose, he could have a weaker overpair, a straight draw, or possibly even something like TT with some overs or a straight draw. This hand was heads up the whole way, so he should have a much more wide open range to call the flop. Although you're a big underdog versus a lot of hands, he can also be a pretty big underdog versus you, enough so that I think you can win it 25% or maybe even 30% of the time.

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I think that preflop/flop play were great. Exactly what you should do.

I also think continuing past that point is a long term losing play.

what happened before the turn doesn't matter... what you are looking at on the turn (which was about the worst possible card) is putting in the rest of your stack with at best 4 outs the vast majority of the time... so why continue here?

Tygran said:

I think that preflop/flop play were great. Exactly what you should do.

I also think continuing past that point is a long term losing play.

what happened before the turn doesn't matter... what you are looking at on the turn (which was about the worst possible card) is putting in the rest of your stack with at best 4 outs the vast majority of the time... so why continue here?

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In hindsight this was the best call. But I called because I was pot committed and actually I missed the fush draw on the board, (multitabling is not a good thing to do with Omaha). But I used what I found out from this hand later.

PL Omaha Hi is where no limit holdem was 5 years ago. Now is the time to get on the bandwagon and cleanup. These games are filled with people who have no idea what is going on. But you only have a year or two before everyone starts to understand it and play better at it.

You should definitely fold! I don't think taking the chance is a good idea.

This is the trouble with raising bare aces preflop

that was a mistake tbh

on the river, if you are going to call anyway, then shove, he might fold

Whoa, have i warped back to 2005?

no i'm bored ;]

you can't fold for such a small amount. your probably behind but can't afford the fold.