Another what to do...

Effexor

Effexor

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Very early at the ring game, no reads.

full tilt poker Game #813477135: Table Williamsport - $0.05/$0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 20:14:36 ET - 2006/07/19
Seat 1: rysjulud ($1.60), is sitting out
Seat 2: Effexor ($9.75)
Seat 3: Bry2000 ($5)
Seat 4: crabbyshark ($1.60)
Seat 5: Houdini818 ($14.85)
Seat 6: trucmat ($14.55)
Seat 7: chupanebrae ($11.15)
Seat 8: bigyankee66 ($6)
Seat 9: pk_robber ($8)
chupanebrae posts the small blind of $0.05
bigyankee66 posts the big blind of $0.10
The button is in seat #6
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Effexor [Kd As]
pk_robber folds
rysjulud has returned
Effexor raises to $0.35
Bry2000 folds
crabbyshark folds
Houdini818 calls $0.35
trucmat has 15 seconds left to act
trucmat raises to $1
chupanebrae folds
bigyankee66 folds
Effexor calls $0.65
Houdini818 calls $0.65
*** FLOP *** [2s Ts 2d]
Effexor bets $1
Houdini818 folds
trucmat raises to $4

fold, call or reraise ?
 
twizzybop

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I would say the lucky sob has either a,10 or k,10.. or even j,2.. q,2...
low limits he could have anything and if he knows 9,10 is a hand that best beats AA's.. he will call your raise... low limits.. have to give kudo's to the junk player and fold here.
 
RiverNoHelp

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I would fold.. You made your continuation bet and he popped it..This is lower limits so he could be playing any kind of junk or he could be an astute player and realize that the majority of the time you miss the flop.. He could be popping it on a bluff.. However i'm going with the former, he's got junk and hit top two pair or trips.. You would need runner runner for the Nut flush and even that might not win because the board is paired.. Laying it down gets my vote..
 
Tammy

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Why does everyone assume that just because it's a low-limit table, he automatically has a junk hand that (luckily) hits on the flop?

Let's look at the situation: Pre-flop, Villain re-raises Hero. Post-flop, he raises Hero again. My guess is he's holding an overpair or possibly 10s and hit his set, and is protecting himself against a flush draw. I would fold.
 
F

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Why couldn't villain have A-Q and is trying to resteal after an obvious continuation bet?
I'd still lay this down though. Just saying is all.
 
cascat

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Why do you bet out $1 on the flop? Since you did I guess you had some kind of plan. If I were your opponent I'd raise a lot of hands in that spot when you bet out a third or so of the pot.
 
Dorkus Malorkus

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I don't understand the weak c-bet out of position into two other players with one of those players having reraised you preflop with no pair no real draw. What are you hoping to acheive?

The best you can hope for if villain isn't just donking it up with silly hands is splitting with another AK, given his action, imo.
 
withawedge

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Cannot see what you are hoping to hit here

Definite lay down and in full agreement with Dorkus.

However, are you about to suprise??????

:withstupi
 
KerouacsDog

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As other people have answered, he could have been holding absolutely anything, but lets understand that he's holding something good, that I reckon has you beaten already, A2, 22, TT or the like. You done your probe bet on the flop, and now you have your information, time to fold, IMO.
I'm going out on a limb here, and understand I don't play many cash games, but I don't like rating AKos that high. I consider it up to a 4XBB hand PF, certainly not a 9XBB against 2 other callers. You're asking for trouble getting involved with 2 raisers PF with AKos.
 
Effexor

Effexor

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I folded.

Whats a more appropriate c-bet? 2/3 the pot? the pot?

All I was hoping to achieve was to get some info about their hands, I thought that 10 times the BB was a decent amount to get info. Maybe I am still too conservative on my betting.
 
KerouacsDog

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c-bet(continuation bet?) for me is normally at least half the pot to the pot, depending on my stack.
 
Dorkus Malorkus

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Effexor said:
I folded.

Whats a more appropriate c-bet? 2/3 the pot? the pot?
Check-folding would seem more appropriate to me.

Effexor said:
All I was hoping to achieve was to get some info about their hands
You have information about the hand of the main danger - he reraised your EP preflop raise and an MP call. Without reads to the contrary, you have to respect this (yes, even at $10NL - don't assume anyone is a donk until you have at least a small piece of supporting evidence).

I'm not saying your preflop call was bad - it's fine, but just let it go having missed the flop. You have Ace high and no reason at all to either (a) think you're ahead in the hand, or (b) think that both villains will fold to your bet.

If you insist on a c-bet, 3/4 pot is fine. Betting so weakly here may encourage players to come over the top of you with surprisingly weak hands (you still can't use this as a justification for calling the flop raise though).
 
blankoblanco

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Definite fold. Villain has an overpair.
 
ChuckTs

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Effexor said:
I folded.

Whats a more appropriate c-bet? 2/3 the pot? the pot?

All I was hoping to achieve was to get some info about their hands, I thought that 10 times the BB was a decent amount to get info. Maybe I am still too conservative on my betting.
C-betting is usually done if you're in control of the hand (ie you raised last PF - he reraised you in this hand, and took control of it). What you did (and I've only just learned this term from HoH) is a probe bet. Probe bets are small bets to induce some kind of action from an opponent. Either you take the pot down, OP calls (draw/slowplay/weak call), or OP raises (bluff/strength/whatever).

I think you bet a little too much here; i'm sure someone could figure out how much would give you the most +EV.
And yes, this is an easy fold.
 
twizzybop

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To answer Juicee's question.. these types of low limits is almost like a free roll.. more then likely they are going to play and call with anything.. it is micro where they care less then they would at the much higher limits. It is just the nature of the beast.

Not saying they may have a legit hand but more then likely again they got lucky
 
Tammy

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twizzybop said:
To answer Juicee's question.. these types of low limits is almost like a free roll.. more then likely they are going to play and call with anything.. it is micro where they care less then they would at the much higher limits. It is just the nature of the beast.

Not saying they may have a legit hand but more then likely again they got lucky
A valid point. And if he would have merely flat called Effexor's preflop raise, I would completely agree (trust me, I've been sucked out on myself more than I care to remember at these levels, with goons calling with any two suited cards, A-rag, face-rag, you name it).

But you also have to remember the flip-side of donkishness too--completely over-playing their hand and all but telecasting what they have by the way they bet. With Villain's pre and post-flop raises, to me anyway, he is practically screaming, "I have a hand! Look out!":itsme:

Another thing to consider: without solid reads, never underestimate your opponent. You'll find yourself dug deep down in a hole that's hard to get out of. :)
 
cascat

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Effexor said:
I folded.

Whats a more appropriate c-bet? 2/3 the pot? the pot?

All I was hoping to achieve was to get some info about their hands, I thought that 10 times the BB was a decent amount to get info. Maybe I am still too conservative on my betting.

You continuation bet when you have the betting initiative, ie. you made the last raise preflop. If you're planning to take the pot down on the flop you should bet an absolute minimum of half the pot but I think 2/3 is better. What if the other guy just calls? You'll have to check-fold the turn anyways.
 
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