50nl - I wanna fold KK?

Stacks:
* MP2 with $50.00
* MP3 with $26.60
* CO with $8.50
* BTN with $94.75
* SB with $50.00
* BB with $40.75
* UTG with $128.85
* UTG+1 with $12.90
* MP1 with $51.20




Blinds: $0.00/$0.00
Site: pokerstars
* * Dealt to SB:K♠ K♦
* * Sklansky group 1
Preflop:
* * UTG raises $1.50 to $2
* * 6 players fold.
* * Hero raises $5 to $7
* * BB raises $11 to $18
* * Total folds this street: 6



no reads, no HUD stats
https://www.cardschat.com

Do it, sure there are going to be 200 ppl quote me and tell me im an idiot on here but I say if you think you should fold, you should fold regardless of what your hand is. Listen to your gut. Everybody is going to disagree but I feel the ability to fold those types of hands is a beautiful thing. If you can do it at the right time that fold will save you a lot of money one day. Don't listen to all the idiots that are going to tear my comment up in like 10 minutes, you feel like you should fold so fold. FOLD, FOLD, FOLD, and don't look back baby!

With no history and no read on the guy to want to fold the second best starting hand to a re-raise makes me wonder if you are playing beyond your bankroll or comfort level.

If John Juanda can shove $350,000 with KK over a four-bet preflop we can shove $50 here.

Ok, if you have no reads, no history, or anything to go by, then what is it in you that is making you want to fold this? How long have you been on this table for, Also have you seen this player make moves of this nature at all?
Look Van, I'd be the last person to give any good advice on here, but there is another hand that ppl might make the same play with, KK, QQ, and even AKs, that folding this would'nt be the best move. I mean your better then I, but I would'nt think twice about shipping this in. If he got them he got them, nothing other then Bad Luck, or Bad timing, but if he does'nt got it, then you've got him/her crushed or atleast a split pot.

What did you end up doing?

I would come over the top and make it worth my while. He will put you all-in later anyway if you stay in the hand.

If it was HU: Yes. I would shove.

But with an EP raise and a BB 3-bet, I'm not sure. If UTG flats the 3-bet, then maybe I flat too. If UTG shoves, then I think I might fold. "Might" but jeez, I'm not 100%.

Don't EP & blind raises get more respect than MP/LP raises?

baudib1 said:

If John Juanda can shove $350,000 with KK over a four-bet preflop we can shove $50 here.

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so if guy laliberte can shove $500,000 with AQ over a cold4bet, we can shove $50 with AQ over a cold4bet too?

no

No reads/stats I think you just have to ship this. If BB rarely 3 or 4-bets I think it's a fold. Problem is I think enough readless (ie random) 50nl players will be raising QQ/AK here to make KK more than a favorite over his range. Against someone you know to be smart and/or a nit you can find a fold, but otherwise I think you just have to ship this.

Folding KK in a cash game pf? I can't imagine this is ever correct.

I say get your money in and play the game, but I'll listen intently to a
knowledgable player explain why I'm wrong.

80BB stacks versus an unknown, I'm folding KK as often as I'm folding AA.

I assume UTG folds to the 4bet?

I like a shove. Without specific reads, you can't take AK/QQ out of his range. Also, BB only has $40 and total nits usually have either full or min stacks, not 80bb ones. That being said, over 100k+ hands, when I do get AIPF with KK, i'm break-even on average, so we're certainly thrilled if we get called.

F Paulsson said:

80BB stacks versus an unknown, I'm folding KK as often as I'm folding AA.

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Which is????

27.81% of the time.

Actually, never.

I would never fold in this situation for the following reason. With no other info to go on, for every time the other player does have AA there are to many other times he could only have AK,AQ,KK,QQ,and JJ so just by simple odds I will always call and the majority of the time be right in making that call. I just hate trying to make the hero fold with KK to find out the guy went with QQ.

I agree with Fatbassett, your playing way above your comfort zone!

Don't think I fold KK ever, even with the cold 4bet from the BB. 5 Bet shove this all day.

someone here said fold and dont look back here... I say you shove and dont look back here. Its interesting how we can start thinking of being beat so fast we dont even take a proper look at our hand here when the facts are: there is only one more hand that beats us preflopped, only one more hand and thats all, those guys might have everithing of course but folding KK here, guys i just think we wouldnt be doing things right here. there is about a 5% chance for anyone to hold any pair preflopped, and if he catches a ppair then there is a more then a 92% chance here that we have a higher or at least the same pair as he has. so shove shove and once more all in.

Without any reads and him not having a full stack, I ship it here.

Say a prayer and ship it!!! Not thinking twice about it here, but then I don't think, maybe that's why I'm a donk.

yea i was never really gonna fold to this @ 50nl but these spots come up at 100nl,200nl,400nl and everywhere, so its important to analyze spots like these imo

anyways i shipped and sucked out vs AA

Hmmm I flat here lots as well, prob around 20% of the time. Especially if we are against a villian that will lay down 1010-JJ type hands to a shove. Very player dependant as well.

Prob one of these situations where having a HUD is a good thing, on nl$50 if this is mcnit doru*, then I actually fold all day.

tenbob said:

is mcnit doru*,

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wat

vanquish said:

wat

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nl$50 stars reg. I call them Mc'Nits. The star is to stop him googling himself.