$50 NLHE Full Ring: 2Key hands today

skrsh76

skrsh76

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Hand #1
pokerstars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (9 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from http://flopturnriver.com/

UTG+1 ($58.56)
MP1 ($50)
MP2 ($80.15)
MP3 ($33.04)
CO ($90.78)
Button ($24.27)
SB ($60.66)
Hero (BB) ($50)
UTG ($54.81)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 10
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, A
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5 folds, CO raises to $1.50, 2 folds, Hero calls $1

Flop: ($3.25) 8
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, 7
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, 10
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(2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $1.54, Hero calls $1.54

Turn: ($6.33) J
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(2 players)
Hero checks, CO checks

River: ($6.33) 10
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(2 players)
Hero bets $4.32, CO raises to $14, Hero calls $9.68

Total pot: $34.33 | Rake: $1.72


Hand #2
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (7 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from http://flopturnriver.com

Hero (MP1) ($34.37)
MP2 ($25)
CO ($42.87)
Button ($25)
SB ($30.02)
BB ($23.76)
UTG ($23.40)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with K
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, K
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UTG raises to $0.50, Hero raises to $1.75, 4 folds, BB calls $1.50, 1 fold

Flop: ($4.10) Q
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, 4
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, 7
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(2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($4.10) 10
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(2 players)
BB bets $2, Hero raises to $5.80, BB raises to $10.50,Hero ???
 
S

seventhsense

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First hand, This is a fold for me. I just don't see how this isn't 9x.

Second hand, I like the flop check because his range is mostly TT-QQ and AK and we can induce a bluff from AK or get more value from JJ-TT by checking the flop. When the turn comes I would just flat. What worse hands will call your raise? You fold out AK and JJ and you now trail both TT and QQ. Of course there are a few more hands in his range I'm sure, but those make up the bulk of it.

When he comes back over you, let it go. He has QQ or TT most of the time.
 
Aces2w1n

Aces2w1n

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hand 1: 3bet pre or fold

hand 2: raise a bit more pre..
bet flop
turn i wouldnt get there like that... flat and call river
 
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seventhsense

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hand 1: 3bet pre or fold

hand 2: raise a bit more pre..
bet flop
turn i wouldnt get there like that... flat and call river

Why bet the flop? I explained above why I don't think we should, so what's the villains range and why do you think betting is beneficial?
 
Romario2223

Romario2223

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1 hand
3bet preflop, bet on the flop and bet/fold on the turn
2 hand
I'' bet on the flop and go all in in the turn after his 2nd raise
 
TimovieMan

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ATo:
3-bet preflop and take it from there.
As played, you can't call this river. This isn't just a 9 he has, it's a boat looking for a call by a 9.

KK:
For the love of God, bet the flop!!!!
As played, a fold is probably best but we're so underrepped at this point, that we can't NOT showdown. So call now and call most rivers. He could very well be spazzing with AQ after our flop check.


Why bet the flop? I explained above why I don't think we should, so what's the villains range and why do you think betting is beneficial?
I think you're confusing villain with UTG. Our opponent is the BB who flatted our raise preflop. His range is going to be a lot wider than QQ-TT/AK, will contain a lot more pocket pairs and suited connectors, and plenty of those hands will float that raggy flop, so why not get some value in while ahead?
 
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seventhsense

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ATo:
3-bet preflop and take it from there.
As played, you can't call this river. This isn't just a 9 he has, it's a boat looking for a call by a 9.

KK:
For the love of God, bet the flop!!!!
As played, a fold is probably best but we're so underrepped at this point, that we can't NOT showdown. So call now and call most rivers. He could very well be spazzing with AQ after our flop check.


I think you're confusing villain with UTG. Our opponent is the BB who flatted our raise preflop. His range is going to be a lot wider than QQ-TT/AK, will contain a lot more pocket pairs and suited connectors, and plenty of those hands will float that raggy flop, so why not get some value in while ahead?

I'm not confusing them. He has cold called our 3 bet. Unless he is a fish, he isn't playing small PP and suited connectors.
 
TimovieMan

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I'm not confusing them. He has cold called our 3 bet. Unless he is a fish, he isn't playing small PP and suited connectors.
No stats are included, but he doesn't have a full stack. It's not unlikely he IS in fact a fish, but even if he's not, it's only a 7bb 3-bet. You can't dismiss the possibility of him having small pocket pairs and suited connectors.
 
Aces2w1n

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Why bet the flop? I explained above why I don't think we should, so what's the villains range and why do you think betting is beneficial?

dry board

means qx hands will call and a lot of medium pairs will call

and well ppl float more on dryboards cuz they dont believe

also another reason is now we are underrepped bad and now we have created a tough spot on turn.. chances are illain has us on turn but we underrepped ofc so we lose value on hands we beat on flop and pay off those who have us crushed
 
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seventhsense

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dry board

means qx hands will call and a lot of medium pairs will call

and well ppl float more on dryboards cuz they dont believe

also another reason is now we are underrepped bad and now we have created a tough spot on turn.. chances are illain has us on turn but we underrepped ofc so we lose value on hands we beat on flop and pay off those who have us crushed

You can't consider a T on the turn when we are talking about the flop. Even if we could, then when the turn comes of course we wanted a small pot, so your argument has undone itself. That is nonsensical. Also under-repping is exactly what we want to get value. When you are ahead, of course you want to under-rep!

I think you have the villains range completely wrong here. Even if you are right. The only pairs we would get value from on the flop are 88-99, that I haven't already discussed. I think there is more chance of getting 2 streets of value from 88-JJ and Qx by checking the flop. This is pretty much a WA/WB spot.
 
IPlay

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Hand 1 is fine but the river bet is pretty meh and I hate the call.

Hand 2, I don't get why we are checking the flop? We want to get value here from BBs cold calling range. He doesn't have auto top up on and cold called a 3 bet from the BB so I am assuming he isn't a great player and sometimes will be wider then most winning regs here. Especially since it is a smaller 3 bet pot he should be in there with PPs and suited connectors. With that said I doubt any of his pps are folding this flop to a bet and he probably has some AQs here we can get a lot of value from. Checking just lets villain have a chance at hitting a 2 outer for free and really has no merit. I bet flop, bet turn and check back river while folding to any raise.
 
Aces2w1n

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You can't consider a T on the turn when we are talking about the flop. Even if we could, then when the turn comes of course we wanted a small pot, so your argument has undone itself. That is nonsensical. Also under-repping is exactly what we want to get value. When you are ahead, of course you want to under-rep!

I think you have the villains range completely wrong here. Even if you are right. The only pairs we would get value from on the flop are 88-99, that I haven't already discussed. I think there is more chance of getting 2 streets of value from 88-JJ and Qx by checking the flop. This is pretty much a WA/WB spot.


it does make sense. the flop mistake puts us in a horrid spot on the turn.

so soon as we check flop we put pressure on later streets and put ourselves in 2 minds.. me personally like to have a plan and stick to it. whether its stack off mode or pot control or value town.
 
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seventhsense

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it does make sense. the flop mistake puts us in a horrid spot on the turn.

It really doesn't at all. We checked back the flop and then raised the turn, we now look massive, yet he still comes over the top. It isn't a 'horrid spot', we are beat.

Besides, when he leads the flop we should be flatting. How is that horrid?

You're being results orientated. Ignore the bloody turn card.
 
Aces2w1n

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I
It really doesn't at all. We checked back the flop and then raised the turn, we now look massive, yet he still comes over the top. It isn't a 'horrid spot', we are beat.

Besides, when he leads the flop we should be flatting. How is that horrid?

You're being results orientated. Ignore the bloody turn card.

lol results orientated... cmon man... we lose value im all about value... we lose it on flop when not betting.

often when we find ourselves in a bind aka tough spot it means we screwed up on an earlier street and in this case it was the flop

look if ur right sure we save money when this happens but overall we lose money because we will be doing just fine most of the time.

checking flop means we wont get stacks in against a sticky Aq hand or qx hands. we get our value from medium pair from bet on flop as well.

if we had info on villain he may be the type to bluff a big draw in this spot if we are underrepped but yeh we call turn and we will be facing another big bet on river.

so if the plan was to underrep then we jam the turn simple but i hate this line
 
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seventhsense

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It plain and simply comes down to the range we put him on. You think he's flatting our 3 bet with PPs, SC, Broadway's at the bottom of his range. If he is, then of course we bet the flop for value.

I disagree massively though. I expect his range to be strong.

Shoving the turn is horrible because the turn is a horrible card for us. Plus, what does it accomplish? You are completely missing my points. I understand where you are coming from. I have agreed that if that range is right, then your play is right. Your line of argument is very poor though. You digress a lot.
 
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