$50 NLHE 6-max: Triple or give up?

John A

John A

Poker Zion Coach
Silver Level
Joined
Apr 12, 2012
Total posts
6,492
Awards
3
Chips
37
Villian Stats (VPIP/PFR/AF): 37/19/2

This was a hand from a student I thought was a little interesting. You guys can discuss. No real reads on opponent other than they were a bit fishy.

Leak Hand found and Converted by Leak Buster Poker Training Software

NL Holdem $0.5(BB)
SB ($30.05)
BB ($75.13)
UTG ($66.18)
HERO ($54.47)
CO ($50)
BTN ($48.25)

Dealt to Hero K:diamond: A:diamond:

UTG Folds , HERO Raises To $2.25 , CO Folds , BTN Calls $2.25 , SB Calls $2 , BB Folds

Flop ($6.5) 3:heart: 4:diamond: 8:diamond:
SB Checks , HERO Bets $5 , BTN Calls $5 , SB Folds

Turn ($16.5) 3:heart: 4:diamond: 8:diamond: J:heart:
HERO Bets $12.25 , BTN Calls $12.25

River ($41) 3:heart: 4:diamond: 8:diamond: J:heart: 7:heart:
HERO Bets $34.97 (all-in), BTN Calls $28.75 (all-in)
 
hackmeplz

hackmeplz

Sleep Faster
Silver Level
Joined
May 1, 2012
Total posts
2,282
Awards
1
Chips
2
Every draw other than diamonds gets there: the backdoor flush, 56, T9 and this leads to both you getting some credit as well as them not having much of any unpaired hands. And even diamonds there are so few unpaired hands he can have that flat button pre vs. an utg+1 open. You have the A and K so maybe if he flats QTdd pre you beat that one combo, but the next best non-pair missed FD combo is 96dd? So basically you're rarely good and should get some credit, and it's a board that "bit fishy" players usually just raise their nutted hands without thinking so doubt you're ever looking at a slowplayed set or something. wp
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

Is drawing with AK
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 2, 2007
Total posts
8,819
Chips
0
I'd like aggression frequency rather than factor, but I'd bet that villain probably checks his broken draws behind, and we beat those. I typically don't try to bluff fishy players off A8/99/JT.
 
XXPXXP

XXPXXP

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Sep 7, 2012
Total posts
5,511
Awards
2
Chips
0
just think that
flop turn bet is both fine.
but the river is not good play
simply for the reason that, the betting size problem.
there are seldom any range when putting this size could be balanced to have value.

I don't mind put the third barrel here for bluff and more for the sake of building a bluff image to show to fishy player, and let me get paid bigger next time. but the size is definitely not this one.

PS: I am using computer to analysis
if Jh is a good one on turn or 7h is a good one on river
001
002
it clearly shows that not.
and both cards improve the button range wining rate about 11%+17%

if putting your betting range VS his potential continue range on the river
all in bet is not the size to choose here.
 
Last edited:
S

steviewayne69

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 14, 2014
Total posts
50
Chips
0
like everyone's pointed out, there's not much the hero can beat other than QT or Q9, suited other than hearts or offsuit. I'm wondering what story the hero is trying to tell, I have Aces, Kings, Queens, or nothing, maybe the villain has top top and isn't worried about the draws or two pair like 8s and 7s, either way, not good, but an E for effort.
 
T

tomnovember

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jun 6, 2013
Total posts
598
Chips
0
I think the flop bet size is a bit too much bigger. Maybe half pot is better. And 80% on the turn.
 
btc87

btc87

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Aug 5, 2014
Total posts
35
Chips
0
If you decide to 2 barrel this, you should barrel the river in most of the cases... And hope he folds lower diamonds draw/A8. Obviously you only represent T9s/A5h/A2h/set (which all are in his range too) or overplayed overpair. That's why you can take a different line on the flop/turn.
And yes, too big bet sizing which doesn't let him have enough weak hands in his range.
 
John A

John A

Poker Zion Coach
Silver Level
Joined
Apr 12, 2012
Total posts
6,492
Awards
3
Chips
37
Well, I think in a squeezed position on the flop I typically advocate not betting the flop very large. So $4 or less is plenty to achieve what we want (I'd probably bet $3.5). People who said to bet the turn larger would be correct. But with the current sizing, he obviously can't do that or he won't have enough for the busted river.

I think the biggest thing about the hand is how often you can get a fishy player to fold out his mediocre hands after 3 barreling. Without better info I wouldn't typically advocate it because they are fairly oblivious to the situations they get in. They just think I have X hand, it's pretty good and my opponent could be bluffing so I'll call.

Secondarily when you're in a spot that you're repping the nuts or betting into the nuts (or near it), meaning repping a draw that came in, you need to make sure you're setting your sizing up correctly. This was off from the start, and against a fishy player, you can typically size much better than this on the flop and turn and get away with it. For example, $4 on flop, and $10 on the turn so you can get closer to a pot sized bet on the river.

In this case the opponent had A8o, which is probably the nuts to a fishy player in this spot.

Good analysis guys.
 
suby_rafael

suby_rafael

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Feb 24, 2014
Total posts
1,039
Chips
0
Pretty awful river shove there. If a fishy player is calling you down two streets post flop then that river card is pretty awful to continue firing there. He will most likely call the river bet.

Just had to give up on the river and check-fold.:p
 
mojoe2209

mojoe2209

Rising Star
Silver Level
Joined
Sep 5, 2014
Total posts
22
Chips
0
i like this spot, you can barrel again (Y)
 
K

kape

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Sep 12, 2013
Total posts
35
Chips
0
after the opponent to call on turn, it was impossible all-in on the river
 
weldphaser

weldphaser

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 22, 2014
Total posts
199
Chips
0
i don't especially like the triple here, basically because we are w/ out reads, we can bluff regs or weak-tight opponents, but not this kind of opp very often especially after he calls the turn.

he's not thinking about our range, he thinking about the two cards plastered in front of him. def better spots to barrel.
 
Top