$5 NLHE Full Ring: Folded trips on the flop

andosalado

andosalado

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$5 NL HE Full Ring: Folded trips on the flop

***** Hand History for Game 13870980796 ***** (Full Tilt)
$5.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Friday, August 07, 03:34:41 ET 2009
Table Justin (real money)
Seat 4 is the button
Seat 1: EvilStarpZ ( $1.93 USD )
Seat 2: 24tex24 ( $16.38 USD )
Seat 3: dmoon89 ( $4.84 USD )
Seat 4: Hobie14T ( $3.90 USD )
Seat 5: l2395885jl ( $0.95 USD )
Seat 6: sheetzie03 ( $4.79 USD )
Seat 7: glorphy ( $5.00 USD )
Seat 8: andosalado ( $5.42 USD )
Seat 9: franeczek ( $5.65 USD )
l2395885jl posts small blind [$0.02 USD].
sheetzie03 posts big blind [$0.05 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to andosalado [ 6d 6h ]
glorphy calls [$0.05 USD]
andosalado calls [$0.05 USD]
franeczek folds
EvilStarpZ folds
24tex24 folds
dmoon89 folds
Hobie14T folds
l2395885jl folds
sheetzie03 checks
** Dealing Flop ** [ 7h, 6s, 4s ]
sheetzie03 bets [$0.10 USD]
glorphy folds
andosalado raises [$0.30 USD]
sheetzie03 raises [$4.64 USD]
andosalado folds
sheetzie03 wins $4.44 USD
sheetzie03 wins $0.72 USD from main pot

I don't know if i did the right thing... ¿What do you think?
 
BelgoSuisse

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1. use a hand converter to post your hands. My eyes hurt. http://www.handconverter.com/

2. you have a set, not trips.

3. don't limp. Every time you limp the poker gods kill a baby kitten.

4. folding sets at 5nl is a terrible idea. there is a very small chance you were against a made straight, against which you still had a lot of outs to improve to a boat. There was a huge chance you were up against top pair, two pairs, an overpair or a good draw, all of which you crush.
 
benevg

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what he said, but i just want to show you one more thing:

3. don't limp. Every time you limp the poker gods kill a baby kitten.

did you notice that the hand was won by the guy on the big blind, and not by the other limper?

even if you believe he had the straight (he probably did not and you should have called), that would put him on a hand like 85 or 53... if you had raised instead, perhaps he would have folded.
 
B

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3. don't limp. Every time you limp the poker gods kill a baby kitten.

its a good job i dont like cats anyway
 
andosalado

andosalado

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Yes i know i'm a fish. I just started playing cash games and i'm not doing very well.

Maybe i shouldn't folded it.

Sorry about the unconverted hand
 
andosalado

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New question: I tried to do some maths to come with an answer on my own on this hand.

This is what i was able to find out:

Givinng the circumstances i was against a draw, a str8 or a bluff.

I calculated the bluff porcentage as 10% because i don't know nothing about this villan.

If he had a str8 my chances of winning the hand were 35%, and 65% if he had a flush draw. Adding a 10% for the bluff, i had about 60% chances of winning the hand in total.

The pot odds were about 1:1 so i'm getting the right price to pay the bet.

Coclusion: it was a mistake to fold here.

¿Is this right? ¿What do you think?
 
slycbnew

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Your range for villain's hands is too narrow. Add overpairs, 7x, 5x, and AK.

No question, don't fold the set.
 
andosalado

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He would have raised with AK, overpair, and going all-in with 7x or 5x is nothing more than a bluf, so i already counted that
 
S93

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He would have raised with AK, overpair, and going all-in with 7x or 5x is nothing more than a bluf, so i already counted that
You do realize this is 5nl and most villain there are complete morons that love spazing out?
Folding a set here is just un-nececery and will only decrease your winrate imo.
 
trewtrew

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there is no way u can fold this escpecially at these stakes, there so full of idiots who would have shoved in with just a pair of eights or something. plus u have a ton of hands he shoves with crushed like all 2 pairs any overpairs and a set of 5s. It doesnt make much sense for him to make a huge overaise if he had a str8. lots of idiots at these stakes overate top pair in any situation so he could have been shoving with some junk hand like 8 2o so u just cant fold here. And if by some miracle he does have the str8 u can always hope the board pairs.
 
andosalado

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I guess i have a little experience playing cash games, maybe i'm still playing with a tournament mentality.
 
edge-t

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Plus every time you fold a set on a draw-y flop like this--God kills a baby. I'd snap-call and start raking the virtual chips in.
 
slycbnew

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He would have raised with AK, overpair, and going all-in with 7x or 5x is nothing more than a bluf, so i already counted that

You mean he would've raised preflop, right? Especially at microstakes, people do goofy things - limping pairs and premium hands (AK, QQ+) from utg as an example.

He doesn't know that 7x is a "bluff", he may think he's got the best hand. I can't count the number of times I've had someone shove into me with TPTK on a small flop (up to 9 high) under the assumption that I've only got overcards.

5x and fd hands are semi-bluffs rather than pure bluffs - a good semi-bluff represents a monster and is frequently willing to stack off. As an example, if I held As5s in his spot, I'd have raised any flop bet with the intent of shoving.
 
TheNoob

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IMHO, folding a set here is a huge leak.

I'm not the sharpest poker tool in the shed, but the only decision I would be making is how fast to shove.
 
StormRaven

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As others have mentioned this is micro limits and most people at these limits aren't that good or experienced. The guy utg open limped and since you were utg +1 the best way to find out if the utg limper has any decent hand is to throw out a raise. If he does then he will usually reraise you. Instead you also limped and allowed others a free flop. I would have raised it to 3xbb and see what happens. You don't always want to do this but it is good to vary your play to keep your opps guessing so they don't get a read on you.

You limped and flopped a great hand. Your reraise was nice and it certainly is possible the bb who got to see a free flop had a bb special and flopped a straight. Because of the straight and flush possibilities/draws on that flop I would have bet the pot to discourage draws, it is better to take down a small pot than lose a large one. It is also possible he flopped 2 pair or just top pair and did the large reraise to get rid of any possible flush draws. He might have had the flush draw and was betting that and put a read on you as an opp that will fold to a large reraise so he can semi-bluff steal or outright steal pots from you.

The point is there are a lot of possibilities and I would have shoved after his reraise, chances were pretty good you had the best hand on the flop and if you didn't you still had the chance to fill up.
Good Luck to you!
 
ItsMe

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No, don't fold the set.

I hit a set of 2s on the flop at these levels which developed into a full house by the river. The villain was happy to bet and I was happy to call him down and found he was betting top pair, king kicker and his conclusion was "lucky flop man". That is the mentality you are up against.

So, don't make a habit of folding floped sets.
 
andosalado

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Thank you for all the comments. I'm convinced now that it was a bad fold.

The limping also was a mistake, i usually raise from any position with pocket pairs, i don't really know why i limped this time.
 
WVHillbilly

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I was inspired by your thread:

MP3 is 9/7/3 over 1700 hands
BB is 11/9/5 over 60 hands


Full Tilt, $0.25/$0.50 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 9 Players
Hand History Converter by Stoxpoker

CO: $191.65 (383.3 bb)
BTN: $68.45 (136.9 bb)
SB: $100 (200 bb)
BB: $104.05 (208.1 bb)
UTG+1: $24.50 (49 bb)
UTG+2: $111.75 (223.5 bb)
MP1: $50.25 (100.5 bb)
Super Duper Deluxe Hero (MP2): $131.35 (262.7 bb)
MP3: $50 (100 bb)

Pre-Flop: Super Duper Deluxe Hero is MP2 with Q
heart.gif
Q
spade.gif

3 folds, Super Duper Deluxe Hero raises to $1.50, MP3 calls $1.50, 3 folds, BB calls $1

Flop: ($4.75) Q
diamond.gif
A
diamond.gif
T
diamond.gif
(3 players)
BB checks, Super Duper Deluxe Hero bets $4, MP3 raises to $12, BB calls $12, Super Duper Deluxe Hero folds

Turn: ($32.75) 9
spade.gif
(2 players)
BB bets $36, MP3 raises to $36.50 and is all-in, BB calls $0.50

River: ($105.75) 8
diamond.gif
(2 players, 1 is all-in)

Results: $105.75 pot ($3 rake)
MP3 showed K
spade.gif
J
club.gif
(a straight, Ten to Ace) and lost (-$50 net)
BB showed A
spade.gif
K
diamond.gif
(a flush, Ace high) and won $102.75 ($52.75 net)
 
andosalado

andosalado

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Wow, that whas a good fold. Sure it's nice to have stats about you rivals, it makes this kind of decisions much easier.
 
BelgoSuisse

BelgoSuisse

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I was inspired by your thread:

MP3 is 9/7/3 over 1700 hands
BB is 11/9/5 over 60 hands


Full Tilt, $0.25/$0.50 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 9 Players
Hand History Converter by Stoxpoker

CO: $191.65 (383.3 bb)
BTN: $68.45 (136.9 bb)
SB: $100 (200 bb)
BB: $104.05 (208.1 bb)
UTG+1: $24.50 (49 bb)
UTG+2: $111.75 (223.5 bb)
MP1: $50.25 (100.5 bb)
Super Duper Deluxe Hero (MP2): $131.35 (262.7 bb)
MP3: $50 (100 bb)

Pre-Flop: Super Duper Deluxe Hero is MP2 with Q
heart.gif
Q
spade.gif

3 folds, Super Duper Deluxe Hero raises to $1.50, MP3 calls $1.50, 3 folds, BB calls $1

Flop: ($4.75) Q
diamond.gif
A
diamond.gif
T
diamond.gif
(3 players)
BB checks, Super Duper Deluxe Hero bets $4, MP3 raises to $12, BB calls $12, Super Duper Deluxe Hero folds

Turn: ($32.75) 9
spade.gif
(2 players)
BB bets $36, MP3 raises to $36.50 and is all-in, BB calls $0.50

River: ($105.75) 8
diamond.gif
(2 players, 1 is all-in)

Results: $105.75 pot ($3 rake)
MP3 showed K
spade.gif
J
club.gif
(a straight, Ten to Ace) and lost (-$50 net)
BB showed A
spade.gif
K
diamond.gif
(a flush, Ace high) and won $102.75 ($52.75 net)

You have 30% equity in the 3handed part of the pot with some dead money in and you're way ahead of the big stack's flush draw. You really need to be furiously results oriented to consider this a good fold...
 
Forsmann

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great fold.
dangerous flop u get reraise from shortstack, possibly he could bet all on the next streets
 
Implied Odds3

Implied Odds3

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Never fold sets at 5nl. Oh yea, and what basically everyone else has said, don't limp.
 
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