$5 NLHE 6-max: Shove on river???

Alucard

Alucard

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V is running 23/19/9 AF = 6
Has been 3betting me & taking down preflop a couple of times. Haven't played a big pot before. Feels like a reg though. Considering him betting 2 streets effective both deep I can only put him on the top of the range.1010, QQ+, AK, Perhaps some AQ & AJ. Haven't seen showdown hands so unaware of how he plays suited connectors or one gappers. Is this a lead V bet or check & bluff catch??

partypoker - $0.05 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4: http://www.pokertracker.com

BB: 101.4 BB (VPIP: 28.97, PFR: 16.02, 3Bet Preflop: 5.27, Hands: 21,886)
UTG: 117.2 BB (VPIP: 27.87, PFR: 16.49, 3Bet Preflop: 5.98, Hands: 21,257)
Hero (CO): 176.6 BB
BTN: 281.8 BB (VPIP: 29.68, PFR: 17.17, 3Bet Preflop: 5.88, Hands: 19,353)
SB: 167.6 BB (VPIP: 29.11, PFR: 16.30, 3Bet Preflop: 5.66, Hands: 22,433)

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has Jc Js
fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, BTN raises to 10.4 BB, fold, fold, Hero calls 7.4 BB

Flop : (22.2 BB, 2 players) Tc 2s 4c
Hero checks, BTN bets 15.8 BB, Hero calls 15.8 BB

Turn : (53.8 BB, 2 players) 6d
Hero checks, BTN bets 25.6 BB, Hero calls 25.6 BB

River : (105 BB, 2 players) Jd
Hero??
 
nucl

nucl

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Hero there have to shove because from the point of view of villain hero's range has a ton of missed flush draws and and get called by all the over pairs,sometimes by medium strength pairs and a few time he will bluff catch you with some Ax high.

By checking there villain will often check back some over pair,some Tx and alot of A high having there showdown value.

So by me shoving is the correct move.
 
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Sorin Iliescu

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check raise

in that spot, i would check raise,villain seems to have a strong hand preflop/he connected with the board in some way/he bluffs, which will probably determine him to go for three barrel. imho, it seems this way you would get the most money out of that street.
 
B

braveslice

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I think it's practically always better to lead the river, I'm not sure though, and personally I fail mostly to do it. He should be weak though given turn sizing, so him betting river is quite unlikely.
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

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I think I prefer a line where we bet like 25-30 BB and try to induce a raise. Our hand is so underrepped, and villain has a decent amount of air on this river.

I could check/raise too, but villain has a lot of Tx he will check back with.
 
nucl

nucl

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I think I prefer a line where we bet like 25-30 BB and try to induce a raise. Our hand is so underrepped, and villain has a decent amount of air on this river.

I could check/raise too, but villain has a lot of Tx he will check back with.
I don't think hero induce much there with a 25-30BB bet.
All the one pair hands will just call,except TT and AA.
IMO by betting this much hero is losing value there from all the overpairs and Txs.
So believe is better to shove and extract max value.
 
Q

Quads2017

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In a hand like this where vilain is the agressor and looking at his stack size he will be irritated by a small bet which he will 3 bet or put you all in and then you can go all in and get most value.

Going all in directly will give him a valid reason to fold.
 
nucl

nucl

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In a hand like this where vilain is the agressor and looking at his stack size he will be irritated by a small bet which he will 3 bet or put you all in and then you can go all in and get most value.

Going all in directly will give him a valid reason to fold.
Lets say that villain is you.You are playing against hero.

If your range on the river contains 77/88/99/QQ/KK/AA and AT(s,o)/KT(s,o)/QT(s,o)/T9s and some Axs what you would do if hero bets 25-30BB?
Imo folding is a bad act in the long run.
If you raise all in over his 30BB bet what value hands will call you except from nuted hands?

What is more likely that you will do if hero bets 30BB?Just a call I suppose.You have no reason to shove over him if you have the above value hands.
What will you do if hero donk shove there?You are also likely to call him with this value hands because of the game play preflop,flop,turn and river in this run out.
Hero have more bluffs than value hands there and villain more value hands than bluffs.
Always my opinion.

Cheers!!!
 
TheBigFinn

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Villain has a 5.88 3-bet PF, likely a little more on the button. Call it 88+ ATs+ KJs+ & KTo. That's a total of 73 combos. Against that range you're ahead 60/40, but there are a bunch of cards that you are afraid of. Aces and Kings make you a dog, Queens are break even. A club has to to slow you down, although you have a blocker and still are likely ahead. If Villain doesn't have a club, she's slowing down too.

That said check raising the flop will get folds from draws and the ace high hands you are currently beating. right now you are losing to 6 combos of AA, KK, and QQ each, 18 total. Villain has 28 combos with a single ace and 8 combos of single Kings and just 6 combos of flush draws that she might have C-bet with, but fold to a reraise. This is why JJ is hard to play. You are not stacking anyone with JJ unless you improve and you only have 2 outs, but I think it is better to re-raise fold to 4-bet on the flop than face another bet on the turn.

As played the 6d turn changes little. The 3 5 straight came in, but Villain does have either of those cards in her range which you are still 60/40 ahead of. But when Villain bets, you have to ask yourself, "Would she bet her aces and draws?" Maybe, but how often? If you call the turn, what's the plan on the river. Check fold everything but a jack?

As played you hit your two outer and look to be way ahead here. Villain will likely only bet AA , KK and bluffs at best if checked to. She'll likely make a crying call with AA, KK and maybe QQ if bet into. With a little under a pot size bet, I shove and hope Villain calls.
 
Alucard

Alucard

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Villain has a 5.88 3-bet PF, likely a little more on the button. Call it 88+ ATs+ KJs+ & KTo. That's a total of 73 combos. Against that range you're ahead 60/40, but there are a bunch of cards that you are afraid of. Aces and Kings make you a dog, Queens are break even. A club has to to slow you down, although you have a blocker and still are likely ahead. If Villain doesn't have a club, she's slowing down too.

The stats are wrong there. I've typed the actual stats above

Here I shoved & the V folded.

But here's a couple of hands later against the same guy

partypoker - $0.05 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4: http://www.pokertracker.com

CO: 100 BB (VPIP: 28.94, PFR: 16.03, 3Bet Preflop: 5.30, Hands: 21,935)
BTN: 100.8 BB (VPIP: 27.84, PFR: 16.47, 3Bet Preflop: 5.97, Hands: 21,294)
Hero (SB): 255.8 BB
BB: 89.2 BB (VPIP: 29.40, PFR: 15.83, 3Bet Preflop: 5.60, Hands: 21,668)
UTG: 231.2 BB (VPIP: 29.68, PFR: 17.19, 3Bet Preflop: 5.89, Hands: 19,374)
MP: 100 BB (VPIP: 29.07, PFR: 16.28, 3Bet Preflop: 5.65, Hands: 22,480)

Hero posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has Ks Kh
UTG raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 10 BB, fold, UTG raises to 31 BB, Hero calls 21 BB

Flop : (63 BB, 2 players) 3h 7d 4c
Hero checks, UTG bets 24 BB, Hero calls 24 BB

Turn : (111 BB, 2 players) Jh
Hero checks, UTG bets 40 BB, Hero calls 40 BB

River : (191 BB, 2 players) Kc
Hero checks, UTG bets 136.2 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 136.2 BB

Hero shows Ks Kh (Three of a Kind, Kings)
(Pre 71%, Flop 85%, Turn 93%)

UTG shows Tc Ad (High Card, Ace)
(Pre 29%, Flop 15%, Turn 7%)

Hero wins 443.4 BB
 
thylmanoid

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I'd go for a nice value bet on the river. True they might only call but if you go all-in there's a good chance villain is folding. It looks like they have fired two barrels you'e called both and if you lead with an all in, you are repping a very strong hand.

If you bet on the 30-40BB side, you could have missed a flush draw. They will most likely call and you'll at least get something. Or best case scenario they re-raise and you're beating nearly all of their range.
 
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