$5 NLHE 6-max: How to extract the maximum?

Alucard

Alucard

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What are the changes I should make to play for stacks here? V is a fish that has been lucky. But has been playing carefully post flop.

888 Poker - $0.05 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4: http://www.pokertracker.com

Hero (SB): 143.8 BB
BB: 72.4 BB (VPIP: 20.48, PFR: 18.07, 3Bet Preflop: 3.70, hands: 83)
UTG: 131.2 BB (VPIP: 23.44, PFR: 19.69, 3Bet Preflop: 7.69, Hands: 131)
CO: 266.4 BB (VPIP: 56.57, PFR: 33.33, 3Bet Preflop: 17.39, Hands: 102)
BTN: 101.8 BB (VPIP: 10.00, PFR: 6.67, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 31)

Hero posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has Qh Th
fold, CO raises to 2 BB, fold, Hero raises to 7 BB, fold, CO calls 5 BB

Flop : (15 BB, 2 players) Ah Kh Jd
Hero bets 8.4 BB, CO calls 8.4 BB

Turn : (31.8 BB, 2 players) 8s
Hero bets 19.8 BB, CO calls 19.8 BB

River : (71.4 BB, 2 players) 3c
Hero???
 
K

KFlint

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I think I would bet small on the river, board is scary and you want to give him a good price to look you up with top pair. You could bet a bit bigger on turn or check-raising at the risk of losing your client, depends how sticky he is.
 
terryk

terryk

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Overbet,,make it look like you missed your FD;) (which u kinda did,lol)
 
A

AlexTheOwl

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I like the overbet at the end also. I'd go all in. Villain has shown a willingness to call. Although it's pretty close:

If he calls a pot sized bet 75% of the time 71*.75 = 53BB average profit

You have about 108 BB left. If he calls 50% of the time 108 *.50 = 54BB average profit

No need to factor in potential losses since you have the nuts.
 
c9h13no3

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Villain's a fish, shove the nuts.

Also, your bets on the flop and turn should be bigger, allowing you to shove for a PSB on the river.
 
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KFlint

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Oh, I missed the fish part! Ok, what I wrote is terrible :D
 
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braveslice

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Also, your bets on the flop and turn should be bigger, allowing you to shove for a PSB on the river.
+1
Not betting large is quite bad, it’s against the essence of being tag with nuts vs fish situation. Here you have 144bb effective, it takes a bit effort to get in on the river even though 3bet pot helps a lot.

Practise for me:
Flop 15, Bet 12bb
Turn 39, Bet 31
River 101, Shove 94.5
 
Alucard

Alucard

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yeah I agree with that.
Some reasons I lowered the sizings here are,
hoping for a raise by the V.
other is not making the V fold whatever he has.
But agree should've made 2/3rds both flop & turn.

Shoved the river & V folded.

I tried betting bigger on similar occasions but V's fold on turn.
 
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AlexTheOwl

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Finding the most profitable bet size is a delicate art that I have not mastered.

But I have generally found that if they'll call a half-pot bet, they will almost always call a 3/4 pot bet, especially at the micros.
 
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braveslice

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My instinct (correct) is that 2/3 is not enough to have PSB on the river given how deep we are.

Practice for me 2/3:
Flop 15, Bet 10 bb
Turn 35, Bet 23
River 81, Shove 104.5

Fish will fold many times because they don’t have a hand to call that is irrelevant really. Here for example he might call 2str gut or FD, and fold to any bet size on the river, or call ATW with ATo, KJ,AJ, T8, K8, J8 when flush misses. Some books ( can’t remember witch ones) have separate sub chapter about how important it is to go ATW with strong hands for value even though you get called not that often. EV skyrockets. Especially on the boards where they might have something they value a lot.
But I have generally found that if they'll call a half-pot bet, they will almost always call a 3/4 pot bet, especially at the micros.
+1
Also flop bet is most important when building big pot and imo fish usually do not care what the size is in percentages on the flop, only in bbs. I would add that with good draw or semi good hand I would not care either about the bet size, but I'm quite fishy myself.
 
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braveslice

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A note about flop bet size importance. So if we assume flop heavy value attitude with pot size flop bet:


Value line potsize-2/3-?:
Flop 15, Bet 15 bb
Turn 45, Bet 30
River 105, Shove 92.5 !!

Optimal sizing??:
Flop 15, Bet 13 bb
Turn 41, Bet 32
River 105, Shove 93.5
 
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Alucard

Alucard

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A note about flop bet size importance. So if we assume flop heavy value attitude with pot size flop bet:


Value line potsize-2/3-?:
Flop 15, Bet 15 bb
Turn 45, Bet 30
River 105, Shove 92.5 !!

Optimal sizing??:
Flop 15, Bet 13 bb
Turn 41, Bet 32
River 105, Shove 93.5

yeah gotta think it through like you said. I normally go for 2/3rd on flop. Specially to have a balance betting range on bluffs & our value hands.
3/4 on turn, haven't tried it before. feels a bit strong to me. Will try it cause then it gets easier to GII on river.
Thanks
 
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braveslice

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Yeah, bet sizes are important, my skill there is nonexistent but even recognizing the PSB concept will make us better over time.

100bb deep it’s quite straight forward in 3bet pots, ip:
1.5+3+3bet=9bb
Flop 18, bet 9
Turn 36, bet 19
River 72, shove 72

It’s noteworthy that either flop or turn bet needs to be a tad over half pot. Usually this is the case so no problems there. It’s might be easier if we just 3bet to 10bb (3.33x)

1.5+3+3bet=10bb
Flop 20, bet 10
Turn 40, bet 20
River 80, shove 70

Having larger 3bet size and seeing how much easier it makes to gii on the river hints strongly that when deep the 3bet size should be a tad larger. That would also mean that the OP hand 3bet size should be larger (with good hand ;) )

Now out of position and we want to gii on the turn:
1.5+3+3bet=12bb
Flop 24, bet 22
Turn 68, shove 66.5

OP hand when 3bet size 9, given out of position and hoping at least a bit fold equity (what we don't have here at all) we could consider 10bb sizing too.

Flop 18, Bet 12 (2/3)
Turn 42, Bet 28 (2/3)
River 98, Shove 95.5 (ok)
 
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IPlay

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Got agree with Brave and C9 here but I think the only mistake in this hand is preflop. Sure 3b is usually better from SB but here we have a fish that has min raised and we probably don't have much fold equity and we are getting such a good price on a call and the BBs 3b range is basically non existent. I'd probably 3b a hand like KQ for value against CO but QTs is a weird hand because we can't 3b for value and bluffing with minimal fold equity is meh.
 
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