$5 NLHE 6-max: Flush draw improves on turn but facing reraise

B

beckyg89

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Seat 1 is the button
Seat 1: Player1 ( $7.54 USD ) - VPIP: 24, PFR: 20, 3B: 8, AF: 2.0, hands: 41
Seat 2: Player2 ( $17.92 USD ) - VPIP: 23, PFR: 18, 3B: 10, AF: 1.8, Hands: 66
Seat 3: Player3 ( $5.21 USD ) - VPIP: 0, PFR: 0, 3B: 0, AF: 0.0, Hands: 3
Seat 4: Player4 ( $2.44 USD ) - VPIP: 17, PFR: 9, 3B: 0, AF: 0.0, Hands: 23
Seat 5: Player5 ( $5.18 USD ) - VPIP: 22, PFR: 18, 3B: 7, AF: 5.0, Hands: 49
Seat 6: Hero ( $15.56 USD ) - VPIP: 21, PFR: 14, 3B: 7, AF: 1.9, Hands:
Player2 posts small blind [$0.02 USD].
Player3 posts big blind [$0.05 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ Ts Ks ]
Player4 folds
Player5 folds
Hero raises [$0.17 USD]
Player1 raises [$0.45 USD]
Player2 folds
Player3 folds
Hero calls [$0.28 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ Jc, 3s, 8s ]
Hero bets [$0.69 USD]
Player1 calls [$0.69 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Th ]
Hero bets [$1.68 USD]
Player1 raises [$3.50 USD]

SO firstly I realize maybe shouldnt be calling this pre OOP. but As played 1) is the donk on the flop good here? 2) is the db good here as I improved? 3) I'm getting 4.14 to 1 on a call on the turn (19%) so even if I only have flush outs its probably just under break even to call however there is an additional 2.90 effective behind so hopefully I can scoop it if I hit which makes me lean to a call, folding on riv if I miss. - is that correct?
 
T

te7ris

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The donk on the Flop is not good. With your flushdraw + overcard you are likly to be favorite in this pot (unless you think button only makes this kind of raise w/ KK AA). You either want to see a free turn (button needs to checkback which is unlikly), or to check/raise (coz you have >50% anyways) + the extra foldequity. Some would say bestcase is to get it all in at the flop to prevent hard turn decisions (like the one you had). Donking the Turn makes your misery perfect. Now you cant fold as you said (unless you know his miniraises mean he has a monster). If you checked you could have folded, since you prolly wouldnt get nowhere near the odds you needed to draw.
 
fletchdad

fletchdad

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I agree with your statement to not call here OOP. Make your life simpler, just fold pre. The bet pre is fine, but just be done after his 3bet. There are better spots, wait for one.

As played, I dont like the donk. Once he calls, there is no need to continue leading. The turn likely hurt you more than helped you. You got yourself into a very uncomfortable spot, and that is good, as you can learn to avoid these spots in future hands.
 
TimovieMan

TimovieMan

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Fold to the 3-bet preflop.

As played, you might wanna check/call the flop and then check/decide.
But you shouldn't have a tough decision here if you just fold to the preflop 3-bet OOP.
 
K

kngstn

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With this 3B it's just fold oop preflop.
 
G

Grinder888

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Seat 1 is the button
Seat 1: Player1 ( $7.54 USD ) - VPIP: 24, PFR: 20, 3B: 8, AF: 2.0, Hands: 41
Seat 2: Player2 ( $17.92 USD ) - VPIP: 23, PFR: 18, 3B: 10, AF: 1.8, Hands: 66
Seat 3: Player3 ( $5.21 USD ) - VPIP: 0, PFR: 0, 3B: 0, AF: 0.0, Hands: 3
Seat 4: Player4 ( $2.44 USD ) - VPIP: 17, PFR: 9, 3B: 0, AF: 0.0, Hands: 23
Seat 5: Player5 ( $5.18 USD ) - VPIP: 22, PFR: 18, 3B: 7, AF: 5.0, Hands: 49
Seat 6: Hero ( $15.56 USD ) - VPIP: 21, PFR: 14, 3B: 7, AF: 1.9, Hands:
Player2 posts small blind [$0.02 USD].
Player3 posts big blind [$0.05 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ Ts Ks ]
Player4 folds
Player5 folds
Hero raises [$0.17 USD]
Player1 raises [$0.45 USD]
Player2 folds
Player3 folds
Hero calls [$0.28 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ Jc, 3s, 8s ]
Hero bets [$0.69 USD]
Player1 calls [$0.69 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Th ]
Hero bets [$1.68 USD]
Player1 raises [$3.50 USD]

SO firstly I realize maybe shouldnt be calling this pre OOP. but As played 1) is the donk on the flop good here? 2) is the db good here as I improved? 3) I'm getting 4.14 to 1 on a call on the turn (19%) so even if I only have flush outs its probably just under break even to call however there is an additional 2.90 effective behind so hopefully I can scoop it if I hit which makes me lean to a call, folding on riv if I miss. - is that correct?


Hi Becky

I'm a full ring player so maybe that's why but I think your opening is loose. I get open/steal from the CO but need to seriously consider folding to the 3bet. Calling 3bets lightly gets us in all sort of problems so we want to keep our range really tight here.

On the flop we are not the aggressor plus we have good outs to a strong hand. So we don't necessarily need to lead here. But on a J high 3 bet hand leading is not all bad, we can get a lot of folds. But our bet was too big. OOP leading so strong on the flop puts a lot of pressure on us OTT, especially when we do not have a made hand.

Turn we did improve but only to 2nd pair. Remember we liked the hand bc of our flush outs (2nd nuts though) and a T pair is really not strong plus now there are 3 to a straight (but I highly doubt villain 3bets us with Q9s). Coupled with the fact that villain showed great strength calling the flop on a board where we likely represented AJ, this should be reason enough to slow down. 99+ are very possible (I personally like TT, QQ+). So with a hand that could improve, we would be better off x/c here rather then db (pot control plays big here).

And he just min raised us which means he is deliberately "giving" the tempting odds. Eff stack here is ~150bb so my guess: villain wants a bigger pot so he could GII by the river. That gives credit to Aces and Kings (would be sick slow play). However after our turn bet calling is okay I guess .

So after your turn bet it may be okay to call and evaluate on river but we played the hand too aggressively and painted ourselves in a corner. We need to focus on playing most hands in position and a very tighter range in 3bet pots plus we need to be aware of hand strength and pot size. Drawing hands are just that, "drawing", we don't need to fight for every pot & would definitely benefit by keeping the fold button close. This hand is perfect example of marginal hands and situations we need to reduce in our play. They have a lot of risks involved and we usually end up 2nd best. Instead we need to focus more on hands and situations with fat value as that is where our profits are going to come from, and we actually increase our graph tremendously by avoiding marginal spots and cutting ur losses.

All of the above is IMHO ofc, cheers and happy grinding!
 
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