$5 NLHE 6-max: AK vs UTG raiser gets 4bet pre, best line?

Villains 72/22 but only over 19 hands so take what you will from that, not sure what to do in these situations and they seem to be happening a lot right now!

Poker Stars - $0.02/$0.05 No Limit Hold'em (6 players)
Poker Stars Hand Converter Tool from CardsChat.com
BU: $5.00
BU: $5.08
UTG: $5.82
MP Hero: $5.12
CO: $12.50
BTN: $5.00
Pre-flop: ($0.07) Hero is MP and dealt
UTG raises $0.10, Hero raises $0.32, 4 folds, UTG raises $1.20, Hero ??

So i think a 3bet here is standard and i'd do this all the time but once we get 4bet what is the best line to take here? AA/KK are less likely as we have 1 of each, so QQ is the most probable imo, should we just flat it and see how the flop comes, hoping for an A or K, or is that just passive spew? As surely we then fold a lot of flops, the UTG aggression is surely going to carry on at the flop and we can't go 3betting with air if we miss.

Thoughts?

I can't answer but I can share what I'm thinking.

I put this into Pokerstove. I gave the villain a 20% range. Your AKo vs. that range puts you as a 62%/38% favorite.

Do we just shove here? Don't the PS values mean that this will win you more money over time?

If folding: Do we say were waiting for a better spot since AK is still only A-high and we'd basically be a coin flip against any PP?

debpes said:

I can't answer but I can share what I'm thinking.

I put this into Pokerstove. I gave the villain a 20% range. Your AKo vs. that range puts you as a 62%/38% favorite.

Do we just shove here? Don't the PS values mean that this will win you more money over time?

If folding: Do we say were waiting for a better spot since AK is still only A-high and we'd basically be a coin flip against any PP?

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You're using a %20 range, I'm assuming based on his vpip, but his range for 4betting against our 3bet is going to be drastically different, and we'll be in much worse shape.

For example if he's opening 78s in that spot, it doesn't mean he's going to 4bet it every time he gets 3bet.

Having %68 equity is more than enough to get it in preflop, but that's based on your incorrect assumption that his range is %20. Against his actual stacking range (I'd guess it to be as wide as TT+/AQ+), we have more like %50 equity, in which case stacking isn't tremendously profitable for us, but he probably 4bet/folds enough to make it fine.

I'm not %100 familiar with 10nl but I'd assume someone who is this loose is typically not good, and will typically stack light enough and 4bet/fold enough to make shoving just fine. This is something you should be thinking about when you first make your 3bet though. "What is my plan?". You have to know if you're 3bet/folding, or 3bet/getting it in, or maybe even just flatting pf.

I am also curious about what people have to say about this. what type of hands has he shown at showdown in the 27 hands, if any?

if we flat what is our play after the flop? if we miss do we just fold if villain leads out?

We do have position after the flop would flatting and seeing a flop then decide what villian does on the flop actually be our best option. Or is the right play to just try and get it in preflop since we do have fold equity two ways to win pot. I have allot of trouble on these types of hands also.

ChuckTs said:

You're using a %20 range, I'm assuming based on his vpip, but his range for 4betting against our 3bet is going to be drastically different, and we'll be in much worse shape.

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Once you point it out, it is so much more obvious that 20% range is too wide. Thanks for the correction (I'm sure there will be many more to come!).

This situation I have trouble with lately too. In the micros sometimes they go crazy. But he is utg so his bet should mean more but U gotta remember with calling u only hit flop third of the time. If he has AK and u miss flop he takes it away. Is it profitable to push or maybe u fold and wait till u have more info on him?

I didn't see he was that loose unless he showed he just been getting good cards I think maybe pushing is best play. Fold equity plus money in pot and how loose he is I think it may be best play. I can't see folding AK against someone who is that loose.

i would probably just shove here. You could get him to fold hands like JJ/QQ/TT/AK and if not you still have outs against jj,qq,kk lol

ChuckTs said:

This is something you should be thinking about when you first make your 3bet though. "What is my plan?". You have to know if you're 3bet/folding, or 3bet/getting it in, or maybe even just flatting pf.

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This was my thoughts after the hand, and why i put it up here. When i got 4bet i was kinda like a rabbit in headlights, not really sure what to do, just kinda 3bet b/c it was AK i think. Then once i reviewed it i tried to think of a plan then and still couldnt!

I guess its just really villain dependant and quickly looking at stats and being like "this guys a drooler i'll 3bet and if he 4bets i shove, or if he flats i bet any flop when checked to" or "this guys a TAG, wide enough EP opening range, could be a lot of PP's, i 3bet and if 4bet i fold"????

purely because his 4 bet is so much more acurate to a proper raise id probably give this one up. Whats the min raise for on pre? then four bet 3 times like a decent player? Just looks like a trap.

But stacking here would be okay IMO