$400 NLHE Full Ring: $500 NL live

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sactokid544

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Hero is CO with $550. Villain is BTN with $600.
Villain is a sort of fishy LAG. Capable of bluff-raising and c/r air and with draws. His PF raising range is a little tighter I believe. I saw him limp in the CO with 3 limpers in front with TT. Flopped middle set on AsTs3c board and he flatted the BBs lead. Then turn Ac BB leads again and he 2.5x.

Fish in HJ open-limps, folds to Hero with KJo. I raise to $25. Villains flats on BTN. Fish calls.

Flop Kd3d4s. Check.

I bet $60. Villain thinks about it and flats. Fish folds. Heads-up to the turn.

Turn: As. Hero?
 
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If you don't fire out and rep that A - he most certainly will - draw or no draw.

I go again for $100 - $120 - or else it's pretty much give up the hand (why?)
 
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andrewsz1991

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I say put out another 1/2-2/3 pot bet try to show you have the ace, and if you lose it's not a significant amount that it'll cripple you.
 
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sactokid544

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I fired $100. Villain goes into the tank and raises to $250.

Hero?
 
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I'd need a lot more history to decide on that one but obviously shove or fold.
leaning towards fold. A of diamonds X of diamonds is certainly in his range, but so is a whole lot else. I didn't take the time to do combinatorics for you.
 
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sactokid544

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I'd need a lot more history to decide on that one but obviously shove or fold.
leaning towards fold. A of diamonds X of diamonds is certainly in his range, but so is a whole lot else. I didn't take the time to do combinatorics for you.
Ya, the only reason I asked about the turn bet was to just make sure we are on the same page for when I asked the real question of what to do when villain raises the turn.

I went into the tank to try to do some elementary combinatorics. I figured that most of his raising range here is probably a little stronger than ours.

Anyone care to give some input on villains range here?

I think his range here is basically all draws especially the big draws (Ax, 56s), especially all NFD which improved the turn and maybe some weak Kx hands and maybe a bluff 10% of the time. Is that too narrow of a range to assume?

I couldn't imagine he is bluffing here too much because I wasn't double-barrelling that much either. I did triple barrel once vs fish for 3 streets of value and got to a showdown. So, I assume he thinks my range is definitely strong to fire the turn.
 
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Well number one - are you pretty sure he is even thinking about you at all? Or is he just trying to blow you off the hand thinking you don't have the stones (but that would be thinking about you). Notice any bully in him that he might do this regardless of who it was against?

2nd - only 10% bluff?? Just asking - you are way more familiar with what he was doing than I
 
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this is live poker, i fold turn pretty quick, and prob dont bet turn.
 
Deco

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If you don't fire out and rep that A - he most certainly will - draw or no draw.

I go again for $100 - $120 - or else it's pretty much give up the hand (why?)

I say put out another 1/2-2/3 pot bet try to show you have the ace, and if you lose it's not a significant amount that it'll cripple you.


Why are we trying to rep the ace? What do you hope to fold that we don't already beat? Bet/folding out of fear of facing bluff with less than toppair is one of the most common leaks around.
I check/call in the hope he bluffs his draws, floats and perhaps even weaker value given his aggressive nature.

As played I fold. Our reads have him as aggressive but their not strong enough to warrent throwing half our stack in with 2nd pair when facing a baluga raise.
 
Deco

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Don't mind a c/f either. His delay makes me think his holdings on the flop are more likely to be very weak hands, draws or monsters so I prefer the check/call seeing as there are few monsters he can have on this flop.
The river I will fold if the draws come in. Otherwise I'm calling unless we pull off a good tell.

Based on the turn raise you've revealed he likely held a monster but I've tried to post a non-results orientated post all the same.
 
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I don't like turn bet vs laggy opponent. Very hard to call any raises/action and such action is likely on that card.check /fold and wait for better spot against fishy lag imo. Or maybee check call. Not the right opponent for a turn barrel

As played, easy fold. What can you beat? You need avery specific read to have him on a bluff here...most likely he has adxd or some random two pair.
 
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Fwiw..if you call..are you really laying it down on river to his shove? Ugly riverspot, get outta there. Especially if the river is a diamond lol. Shoving turn and getting called by adxd is even uglier. You have very little fold equity

I lag a lot..and I get a lot of tags and nits to do stupid stuff and stack off in situations like the above, with mid pair. Not worth it. Villain rarely has complete air and that's really your only hope.
 
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Why are we trying to rep the ace? What do you hope to fold that we don't already beat? Bet/folding out of fear of facing bluff with less than toppair is one of the most common leaks around.
I check/call in the hope he bluffs his draws, floats and perhaps even weaker value given his aggressive nature.

As played I fold. Our reads have him as aggressive but their not strong enough to warrent throwing half our stack in with 2nd pair when facing a baluga raise.

Okay so you are saying check call but your very next post says check fold. Don't you want to maintain initiative against a player like this or are you saying hand it over to him?

I'm sure open to learning here, but help me out cause I'm slow.
 
Deco

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Okay so you are saying check call but your very next post says check fold. Don't you want to maintain initiative against a player like this or are you saying hand it over to him?

I'm sure open to learning here, but help me out cause I'm slow.

With mediocre value our aim is to catch bluffs. If our hand is not strong enough to get worse hands to call or weak enough to get better hands to fold betting will get us nowere and we should check/call or check/fold to make money from villains bluffs or get out whilst we can depending on his range.

Your looking to bet here to get villain to fold right? What sort of hands do we fold?
Weaker value: We beat at showdown anyway, why risk money "bluffing"
Draws: If villain knows his odds unfortuntantly we cannot get him to make a mistake by putting $150 or so in the pot. If we check/call he will bet those draws for us and we get his $150, even better he may bluff the river and we make even more money from him.
Air: Folds to our bet, if we check/call he can bluff and we can make money even from his floated junk.

The reason people avoid checking out of position after leading a previous street is because it's difficult. Whether to check/call or check/fold is a tough decision where we need to know or approximate villains range very well especially if we need to account for further streets.
It basically comes down to if villain will bluff if we check to him let him and catch his bluffs. If villain won't bluff we should fold as nothing worse will call us and we've little fear of worse hands taking the pot from us.

What do you hope to fold that we don't already beat?

Ask yourself this everytime you bluff. If there isn't anything or very little you should generally check/call or check/fold.
 
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Deco - thanks for a great response!
 
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sactokid544

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I agree that the turn bet was a mistake. After the hand, I was kicking myself because I knew I made a mistake. It was shitty cause if the turn came blank, I was going to barrel. And when the A hit, I still barrelled. Doh!

I hate it sometimes when I get into some sort of brain lapse like this. I knew the A was a bad card. Sometimes you wanna bang your head against the wall!
 
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