$4 NLHE Full Ring: Trips on flop

twoturntablez

twoturntablez

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$4 NL HE Full Ring: Trips on flop

I think i made a mess of this hand.

Wasnt really representing the Jacks after checking and making small ish bet on the flop, Im sure he didnt beleive me.

I didnt like the call on the turn because of the staright draw, which I possibly left open on the flop, because it was rainbow.

He ended up with top pair after the jacks so I guess my river bet was too large.

Was I too weak in the first place on the flop? Could I have got more value on the river?
 

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thepokerkid123

thepokerkid123

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I fold pre-flop. I don't think the call is a huge leak, but this is as weak as you can call, imo.

Bet the flop. No one will believe you have the J, all pp's are calling as well as straight draws and AK/AQ.

Turn, bet 3/4 pot, or if they're stations, full pot.

River, value town here we come. I like the pot sized bet here. Against competent players I bet small because they're not calling a pot sized bet without a J or straight, but at 4nl just keep betting and let them hero call.


Don't worry about what you're representing at $4nl.
 
twoturntablez

twoturntablez

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Cheers for that, is it that J8 in the SB is a leak because of likely scenarios after the flop will cause you to lose more money with the second best hand, or are you saying hang on to the 2c and put it towards calling a better starting hand. With only 1 caller i was pretty sure i should complete.

Just to add to that, how many limpers in front of you should you have to call any two in the SB?
 
thepokerkid123

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You're OOP so your ability to win big pots is really low, and J8o will almost never dominate anything and will frequently be dominated, plus you have to make .5bb per hand to break even.

I can't really answer how many limpers for you to play ATC, it depends too much on your play and theirs since we're mostly concerned with money that's going in post-flop.
It's a lot harder to fold too much than not enough from the SB though. When in doubt, fold. As long as you're not folding premiums you're doing ok.

Obviouslly there's room to get pretty loose vs BTN/CO steal attempts and in squeeze opportunities, but even then folding too much is by far the smaller mistake.
 
Pascal-lf

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Thepokerkid123 has pretty much explained everything I have to say :)

I'd definitely fold pre-flop, but I understand why you completing. Focusing on making sure I folded hands which weren't premium worked for me - I'd only ever play J8 in late position as a steal.

Lead out on the river; most villains will go crazy if they've caught even a scent of a straight draw/bottom pair.

And I like the pot bets on turn / river too :)
 
Stu_Ungar

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Unless he calls more than 30% or raises preflop I would raise with J8o

Once I hit that flop I put in a c-bet

The turn does complete some draws, but it also makes others so I bet the turn but think about folding to a reraise. For him to have the top end of the straight he has to have KQ and not raise it preflop.

On the river I still think I have the best hand. I would either bet small because after he has called preflop, flop and turn the pot is probably too big for his hand to call another big bet.

I would fold to a reraise.


I might check the river intending to call any reasonable bet if I thought he was the type of player who might bluff at the river if I checked.
 
forsakenone

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thepokerkid123 could not have said it better, you are at 4nl so don't try anything fancy, if you think it is a week player who has maybe an A9 on the flop, or a draw just taking him to value town, 3/4 of the pot bet on all streets should do the job.
 
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