$4 NLHE Full Ring: Straight-flush draw in 3 way pot facing all-in (at the micros)
rowhousepd
Rock Star
Silver Level
Merge Network $0.02/$0.04 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players
Hero (BB): $4.00
UTG: $5.02
UTG+1: $3.08
UTG+2: $8.77
MP1: $2.87
MP2: $4.34
CO: $5.62
BTN: $2.20
SB: $3.97
Preflop: Hero is BB with
2 folds, MP1 raises to $0.12, 2 folds, CO calls $0.12, BTN folds, SB calls $0.10, Hero calls $0.08
SB bets $0.28, Hero raises to $1.06, UTG+2 folds, CO raises to $5.50 all in, SB calls $3.57 all in, Hero....?
Hero (BB): $4.00
UTG: $5.02
UTG+1: $3.08
UTG+2: $8.77
MP1: $2.87
MP2: $4.34
CO: $5.62
BTN: $2.20
SB: $3.97
Preflop: Hero is BB with
2 folds, MP1 raises to $0.12, 2 folds, CO calls $0.12, BTN folds, SB calls $0.10, Hero calls $0.08
With 3 other people about to see the flop, I don't have a problem calling KQs in the BB. (Right??)
Flop: ($0.48)
SB bets $0.28, Hero raises to $1.06, UTG+2 folds, CO raises to $5.50 all in, SB calls $3.57 all in, Hero....?
I got t pretty much the flop I wanted. I think it's safe to assume this flop hit everyone's range pretty hard. I'm likely up against TPTK, or 2 pair, possibly a set, and a made straight, but I could beat it w/ one of my 9 flush outs or tie it w/ one of the 6 straight outs.
As far as I can tell, I have 15 outs if I'm optimistic, maybe 13 or 14 assuming someone else holds an Ace. Either way, but the time the all-in comes around to me that's 3.3:1 pot odds vs my ~2.5:1 drawling hand. I think.
I guess the question isn't really whether I should stack off here at the end; it's whether or not I open-shove the flop instead of just making a standard 3x raise and later calling. Thoughts?
As far as I can tell, I have 15 outs if I'm optimistic, maybe 13 or 14 assuming someone else holds an Ace. Either way, but the time the all-in comes around to me that's 3.3:1 pot odds vs my ~2.5:1 drawling hand. I think.
I guess the question isn't really whether I should stack off here at the end; it's whether or not I open-shove the flop instead of just making a standard 3x raise and later calling. Thoughts?
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rowhousepd
Rock Star
Silver Level
Ha, problem with the hand converter. Ok, that should do it. Fixed the above post. Sorry!
rowhousepd
Rock Star
Silver Level
Can you guys walk me through the math on this? Let's say I'm up against a really bad scenario, like one of them has a made straight and the other a set. Here's what stove is telling me:
30.343% { KhQh }
39.756% { AhKs }
29.900% { JJ }
Is this still a call? I realize it's less likely considering the maniac's ridiculous range, but nonetheless....
30.343% { KhQh }
39.756% { AhKs }
29.900% { JJ }
Is this still a call? I realize it's less likely considering the maniac's ridiculous range, but nonetheless....
A
AlwaysPlanAhe
Rock Star
Silver Level
You need to calculate your hand equity and pot equity for 2 different showdowns and pots.
First pot is the 3way. The total pot will be 3*shortest stack = 3*$3.97 = $11.91. You're calling a final $2.82 into this final pot ($4 minus the $0.12 preflop and $1.06 you have already invested)
Pot odds = ($2.82/$11.91)*100 = 23.68%
Hand equity = 30.34%
Hand equity is higher than the pot odds so we can call. If for example it was $3 to call into $9 total pot then we would be getting pot odds of 33.33% meaning we're priced out of the call by 3%.
I'm really tired atm and don't want to make a mistake when calculating the 2nd pot and comparing the 2 so I'll finish the math tomorrow morning if someone else hasn't beaten me to it!
EDIT - I know it doesn't help you learn the math but for future reference...if you ever have a straight/royal flush draw then you're good to get the money in v's any range. Most of the time you still want to play the hand in such a way that you're maximizing fold equity but if you're called then you're ahead.
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A
AlwaysPlanAhe
Rock Star
Silver Level
I'm going to change the way we calculate the odds for the call because I feel this way is more simple to understand.
(AhKs) Villain 1 - $100
(KhQh) Hero - $100
(JJ) Villain 2 - $70
Preflop - $5 raise, call, call and pot = $15
Flop - Villain 1 bets $10, We raise to $30, Villain 2 shoves to $65, Villain 1 re-shoves to $95.
We have $65 left in our stack, $35 will be going to the main pot and $30 will be going to the side pot between us and Villain 1.
The main pot total for all 3 players will be $210. According to pokerstove we have a 30.343% stake in that pot which = $63.72 (210*0.30343). It's $35 to call so we see a profit of $28.72 (63.72 - 35).
The side pot total for us and villain 1 will be $60 and according to pokerstove we have 28.502% stake in that one with (AhKs v's KhQh) which = $17.10 (60*0.28502). It's $30 to call into this pot which means a loss of $12.90 (17.10 - 30).
$28.72 profit minus the $12.90 loss means our $65 call in this spot would yield an overall profit of $15.82.
I believe it's easier to calculate the math this way as we're quantifying the value of our hand in terms of $$ and comparing that to the $$ we have left to put into the pot. Hope this has been of help!
(AhKs) Villain 1 - $100
(KhQh) Hero - $100
(JJ) Villain 2 - $70
Preflop - $5 raise, call, call and pot = $15
Flop - Villain 1 bets $10, We raise to $30, Villain 2 shoves to $65, Villain 1 re-shoves to $95.
We have $65 left in our stack, $35 will be going to the main pot and $30 will be going to the side pot between us and Villain 1.
The main pot total for all 3 players will be $210. According to pokerstove we have a 30.343% stake in that pot which = $63.72 (210*0.30343). It's $35 to call so we see a profit of $28.72 (63.72 - 35).
The side pot total for us and villain 1 will be $60 and according to pokerstove we have 28.502% stake in that one with (AhKs v's KhQh) which = $17.10 (60*0.28502). It's $30 to call into this pot which means a loss of $12.90 (17.10 - 30).
$28.72 profit minus the $12.90 loss means our $65 call in this spot would yield an overall profit of $15.82.
I believe it's easier to calculate the math this way as we're quantifying the value of our hand in terms of $$ and comparing that to the $$ we have left to put into the pot. Hope this has been of help!
rowhousepd
Rock Star
Silver Level
Awesome post, AlwaysPlanAhe! I can't say I completely get it. Rather, I can't say I would be able to do these calculations w/ any sort of time constraint on me while I'm at the table. But in super-slow motion, I believe this makes sense. I need to practice this with other hands. Big time. Thanks.